60% Resident increase?

[BuzzH]

You find nothing wrong with killing 53 bulls out of a herd of 296....

Did you look to see what their post harvest bull to cow ratio's were?

How long is that sustainable?

You'll come to the same conclusions that I have...

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Not sure where to find the ratio of Cows and Bulls in a unit... but it looks like mostly bulls were harvested which seems like the right idea if you want to grow the elk herd and the heard has increased every year since 2010... I can't see where what their doing isn't working?

 

[JohnCushman]

Hey Buzz...your PM's are full. I'd like to talk to you privately about something BTW, my last post asking you questions was serious, not sarcastic. I would like to understand better and learn.

 

[BuzzH]

Not sure where to find the ratio of Cows and Bulls in a unit... but it looks like mostly bulls were harvested which seems like the right idea if you want to grow the elk herd and the heard has increased every year since 2010... I can't see where what their doing isn't working?

I'll find the exact bull to cow ratio's but I can assure you its not better than 15:100 post harvest, and I bet its closer to 10. They don't even have to change management until bull make up less than 8% of the observed elk (or 28 bulls)...oh, and for 2 consecutive years.

If that's the case, and you believe their numbers, even on the high end, you're talking 45 bulls post harvest.

How do you kill 53 out of 45 available bulls the following year. That's not even taking into account winter kill, wounding loss, predation, etc.

Their numbers are total dogshit...and I can tell you I could manage elk better with a Ouija board and a handful of chicken bones...and it would make more sense.

 

[Bambistew]

Didn't CO have OTC deer until they "managed" the population into the ground?

I'd gladly waste a week hunting CO over MT every time, deer or elk.

Pretty soon those MT hunets will need an even longer season to find an elk to kill.

I looked up some harvest stats in MT the other day for an area I used to occasionally hunt, and was floored at how bad they were. Just 10 years ago it was near 20-22% success, it was now at 10-12%. And the people keep flocking there to shoot a handful of elk.

The leftover deer tags in CO are as good or better than any hunt in MT on public IMO. The tags that take a few points are far better IMO.

Sad how bad it has gotten compared to 20 years ago. Blame the wolf with a pocket full of shells and a couple elk tags.

 

[sneakem]

Good deal, apply in Colorado.

Forgot to mention all the cow tags, leftovers, and general tags that are not part of the 16%.

Kind of a "moot" point as Colorado has the same crap with leftovers, OTC, and PLO tags with no NR % restriction.

For the record I'm in favor of the increase on both ends... I get tired of both NR's and residents whining... but I would gladly pay more in Colorado especially if they would move more in to line with NR allocations as other Western states. Hell they could increase their application fees a few bucks too...

Even with the increase Colorado is one of the cheapest state for a NR to hunt, gives the highest NR allowance of draw tags in the west, has tons of public land, plenty of game...

People forget that in many states you have to pay for a hunting license on top of your tag fee, you pay more for preference points, application fees...etc...etc...

 

[Oak]

Hell they could increase their application fees a few bucks too...

Define "a few." Is this called called foreshadowing?

 

[sneakem]

Define "a few." Is this called called foreshadowing?

I could only hope its in the making... personally I'd be fine with $10/species but I'm sure tears would spill over that one. Would be the same if I suggested everyone had to purchase a general hunting/fishing license prior to applying or hunting big game....

 

[Oak]

I could only hope its in the making... personally I'd be fine with $10/species but I'm sure tears would spill over that one.

Oh it's going to be sad times, then...

 

[JohnCushman]

Oh it's going to be sad times, then...

Stop teasing, dude

 

[sneakem]

Oh it's going to be sad times, then...

People will always find something to complain about... Reality is a $50 RES deer tag and fuel allowance works out to be about $1.30/lb, that's cheap....$80 Res elk tag and fuel works out to about $1.00/lb. Food and lodging is negligible cause you'd have to eat if you stayed home anyways and camping can be done for free...

Non Res... range from $3.75-$4.00/lb for deer and elk for tag cost... then you have travel expenses, which varies dependent on where you live, which likely brings the price equivalent to or slightly higher than beef. If it's too much, hunt in state or buy domestic meat and be financially responsible... Can't hunt elk in your state but want to...move to Colorado and be underpaid in our thriving economy...

I don't mean to come off as pretentious... but I work my A$$ off and save little bits here and there to be able to hunt every year in state and hopefully one out of state tag, budgeting and a little extra elbow grease goes a long ways....I'm far from a wealthy man...

 

[Zach]

People will always find something to complain about... Reality is a $50 RES deer tag and fuel allowance works out to be about $1.30/lb, that's cheap....$80 Res elk tag and fuel works out to about $1.00/lb. Food and lodging is negligible cause you'd have to eat if you stayed home anyways and camping can be done for free...

Non Res... range from $3.75-$4.00/lb for deer and elk for tag cost... then you have travel expenses, which varies dependent on where you live, which likely brings the price equivalent to or slightly higher than beef. If it's too much, hunt in state or buy domestic meat and be financially responsible... Can't hunt elk in your state but want to...move to Colorado and be underpaid in our thriving economy...

I don't mean to come off as pretentious... but I work my A$$ off and save little bits here and there to be able to hunt every year in state and hopefully one out of state tag, budgeting and a little extra elbow grease goes a long ways....I'm far from a wealthy man...

Given the $80 elk and $50 deer tag prices that you use, that is a $6M increase over current intake in R Elk dollars and $1.5M increase for deer. There has been an increase of about 4k R licenses sold over the last few years, waiting for the FY 14-15 v 15-16 comparison to come out to see if that trend continues. There is always talk of increasing big game fee's but I never hear of an increase in R fishing license. The financials don't break out the resident fees, but doing a straight division of dollars/volume it's an avg of around $13.50/license. Make that average $20/license and the dollars are increased about $4.4M.

Where do you think that money will go?

According to the CPW meeting last night, 12% of the budget comes from resident sportsmen. Of the total intake of the Hunting and Fishing License, about 51% is from NR elk.

CPW spoke of how expensive and extensive it is to maintain all the damns, maybe the slight increase on fishing will help with that.


My math could be off, not the first time. I'm sure if I'm wrong someone will be more than happy to grab a vine, swing through and point it out.