The REAL (REASONS) hunting is declining

[LuketheDog]

that makes me feel old hearing you reference N64 as being old.... Father Time is undefeated after all.

Good grief, seriously! I remember when my best friend got a hand-me-down Atari, we thought that thing was amazing, and THEN my other buddy got this gray boxy thing called a Nintendo with a game called Mario Bros, WHOA! And I'm only an ancient 38...

 

[SAJ-99]

I have to completly disagree with you on the issue that hunter numbers isn't the biggest issue facing hunters.

Things are never what they seem and everything is complicated. Hunter trend numbers are declining at a rate of about 1.5% annually. Two reasons for this, 1) since forever (like 1776) the US has slowly moved from an agricultural society to an urban society. Farmers and Ranchers were more likely to hunt because it was easier for them. They had land, they knew their neighbors, etc. As ag became more corporate, land gets closed off. Add to that the loss in public lands. City kids can play video games much easier than they can pack up stuff and drive to the country and set up camp or knock on doors to try to find a place to hunt, and they might not even know where to start. 2) the boomers are a large % of the population. As they get older, they are less likely to hunt for physical reasons, like death. So a 1.5% annual drop can be explained by a lot of changes in the demographics of our society. If you want to fight that trend, you are going to lose. You need to pick winnable battles on the edges. Start with opening up land and opportunity.

I would also add that as we become a more urban society, we get disconnected from the source of our food. A farm kid has probably had to kill something to eat. A city kid hasn't. Consequently, as a group, we have become more compassionate. Killing an animal is (at least should be) an emotional experience. Both good and bad.

The good news is that the Millennials group is now larger than the Boomer group. Many of those people will eventually want to connect with nature in one way or another and many will take up hunting. Unfortunately, I will continue to struggle to find a camping spot because of it. I might try to lure them away with a video-game call.

Youth is wonderful. Don't waste it. But take time to digest information before reacting and forming a conclusion.

 

[BigHornRam]

Ok boomer

 

[JohnCushman]

Good grief, seriously! I remember when my best friend got a hand-me-down Atari, we thought that thing was amazing, and THEN my other buddy got this gray boxy thing called a Nintendo with a game called Mario Bros, WHOA! And I'm only an ancient 38...

I remember before Comodore 64 we used to spell boobs on calculators for fun

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Ok, had my coffee... now I can handle this shit...

Outdoor life article

Why We Suck at Recruiting New Hunters, Why It Matters, and How You Can Fix It

Baby boomers make up our nation's largest cohort of hunters, and they've already begun to age out of the sport. Within 15 years, most will stop buying licenses entirely. And when they do, our ranks could plunge by 30 percent—along with critical funding for wildlife management, advocacy for...

www.outdoorlife.com

Tons of regional differences. Colorado, Utah, Oregon, Arizona, etc have seen huge net in migration. Colorado is 3x 1.8MM -> 5.6MM over that time frame. Assuming new residents aren't all hunter or in the same ratio of hunters as were there originally you are going to "dilute" your hunting base. Every state is going to have a different story, Indiana has had the biggest hunter loss, I would be interested to hear some personal experiences from that state.

The real reason hunting participation is because it not a high enough priority for people. Barriers to entry are just that, but they are nearly always surmountable. At the end of the day though, I think this largely just a prioritization issue.

@elkbug

Mostly agree, for each age group/or stage of life? People will have different priorities or issues. Time-Money-Health, we will all experience various surpluses and deficiencies of these during our lifetimes. Depending on where you are in life, one will probably resonate with you more than another I imagine... personally I'm in the money stage on my way to the time stage as my wife and I talk about starting a family.

That said... starting from scratch hunting is hugely expensive. Also unlike skiing, or various other outdoor activities there isn't a way to pay for a lesson. You can go guided, but that is very expensive, and you aren't really being taught to hunt. If say @DouglasR decides he wants to learned to shred the gnar, he can rent gear, buy a lift ticket, and take a lessor or two. There really isn't an option in the ~$500 range for someone to try out hunting. If you don't have someone to take you under their wing it's a tall order to self start.

Also, "Hi, I would life you to teach me how to do something, that after 1-3 lessons I will do solo for the rest of my life" - kinda a niche group of people are into that. This just happens to be a forum dedicated to that niche.

Grew up in Colorado and was competing professionally in snowboarding before I graduated high school. I was riding or training 7 days a week from August to May. I loved it but if I had to choose now it would be hunting without a second thought. Hindsight is 20-20 though

Well guess you should have skied, instead of picking something lame.

Video game shade. Psssssssh...
There are a ton of gamers on here that love hunting, the two are not mutually exclusive.

N-64 is the tip of the iceberg.


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I agree with @JLS lots of more people out in the woods recreating, across the country land is being privately consolidated and also developed into .25 acre lots. The back 40 of the 60s is in steep decline, it's either postage stamp lots of mega ranchers.

Perhaps Randy, Meateater, and the hankshaws of the world can soften the decline. At the very least perhaps make hunting more accepted by non-hunters.

Personally I try to change people in my sphere of influences perception of hunting, and where possible help get new hunters into the sport. I can't make someone want to hunt or stick with it, but if someone expresses interest I do my best to remove as many barriers to entry as possible.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

To the continuous stupid generational battle... listen to the big guy

Another Housing Market Crash Looming?

There is a strong possibility in the next 6-12 months that a 20-30 year old will be able to purchase their first home significantly below current market value with interest rates at historic lows. The individuals that are going to be most effected by the coming recession/depression will be...

www.hunttalk.com

 

[El Jason]

Also unlike skiing, or various other outdoor activities there isn't a way to pay for a lesson. You can go guided, but that is very expensive, and you aren't really being taught to hunt.

There are a plethora of resources on YouTube about how to hunt. Skiing is a motor skill, and as such learning it is far different than learning and implementing the techniques involved in hunting. There is really no reason whatsoever a person trying to learn to hunt can't find all of the information they need via some searches on the internet.

 

[VikingsGuy]

To the OP. It's amazing how at 19 with 4 years of hunting experience that you know all the REAL resons hunting is in decine.
That's funny because when I was 19 I also thought I knew everything.
Thank you for sharing ALL your years of hunting knowledge or perhaps lack of it. Sour grapes maybe?

No need to get snarky. His post was fairly standard stuff. Stuff that I have seen "seasoned" hunters posting for years - including many on this site. While we may disagree on various parts of a very loonnnggggg post, I would guess many of us agree with several sub-points whether OP is 19 or not.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

There are a plethora of resources on YouTube about how to hunt. Skiing is a motor skill, and as such learning it is far different than learning and implementing the techniques involved in hunting. There is really no reason whatsoever a person trying to learn to hunt can't find all of the information they need via some searches on the internet.

I'm not sure I agree... there are tons of technique videos about skiing as well. I'm sure they exist, but I've not found great resources (for a reasonable cost) that teach rifle and archery marksmanship.

Part of the reason I love hunting is the breadth of the sport, that also makes it intimidating. Gun/bow knowledge, learning to stalk animals, blinds/stands/etc, camping tent/car/basecamp/spike, various mountaineering things, navigation, survival... I mean there is literally a life time of new experiences to be had in the sport. That can be intimidating.

If you are a suburban parent, that maybe hunted as a kid, wants to take their kids out... but it might just be one time, you kinda want to get your feet wet before you buy a gun... what do you do? Kinda SOL in my mind.

 

[LuketheDog]

Ok, had my coffee... now I can handle this shit...

The story of our lives right now...

 

[AggieHunter]

You can go guided, but that is very expensive, and you aren't really being taught to hunt.

It is a very expensive option, but with the right guide you can learn a lot about hunting and it helps overcome the obstacle of what to do when you have something like a 500-pound elk on the ground. When my dad and I moved to Colorado we had no experience hunting besides sitting in front of a feeder in Texas so going on a guided trip and spending a week with a guide was really helpful for me and I learned a ton just asking him tons of question during it.

 

[VikingsGuy]

I'm not sure I agree... there are tons of technique videos about skiing as well. I'm sure they exist, but I've not found great resources (for a reasonable cost) that teach rifle and archery marksmanship.

Part of the reason I love hunting is the breadth of the sport, that also makes it intimidating. Gun/bow knowledge, learning to stalk animals, blinds/stands/etc, camping tent/car/basecamp/spike, various mountaineering things, navigation, survival... I mean there is literally a life time of new experiences to be had in the sport. That can be intimidating.

If you are a suburban parent, that maybe hunted as a kid, wants to take their kids out... but it might just be one time, you kinda want to get your feet wet before you buy a gun... what do you do? Kinda SOL in my mind.

With many skills it is about that first step from total ignorance and a real chance of screwing it up (and possibly hurting yourself or others) to a sense of, "I may still suck at this but I am not going to do major damage here and I see how I can learn and improve" that can be a real first barrier. For those of us that crossed this threshold when we were 8 years old and our dad/uncle/grandpa was there to make it seem doable this may seem far fetched, but I have seen it in both the shooting sports and in scuba diving. I wonder how many folks out there think about hunting/shooting and do the research and maybe even buy the gear/guns but can't activate past this first hurdle. I have know a few that got stuck there and reached out and after I took them to the range once or twice, for an easy bird hunting, or even just squirrel hunting, all of a sudden felt OK figuring it out themselves from there, and stuck with it.

 

[MNElkNut]

Thanks Elk Bugler for starting this thread! We can debate the #1 or #2 reason until we finally all agree or disagree....but that will solve nothing. The bigger issue is doing something about it.

Doing something about it happens on a couple of levels. First, some on here have said that they try and get a new person to hunt with them every year. Thank you!! I believe we all should be doing that. If we are going to flip the trends around, this has to happen. Not all hunters will do this, but anyone reading this has some interest in helping the situation and should make that effort.

Secondly, what can you do to take the next step? Get involved with a conservation organization. National, state, local, it doesn't matter, just get involved and help to develop or enhance programs to get more people involved with hunting. Pick something that interests you as there are a lot of options: work on public land access issues, teach hunter safety, develop a mentorship program, develop a youth outdoor activity day that leads to a mentorship program, start a gear library, etc.

I challenge people to get involved and post their experiences. Good or bad, successful or not, let's do something about it and not just hammer the keyboards! So as not to derail this thread, I will start another thread asking for people to share their efforts.

 

[1_pointer]

As a guy that teaches hunter education courses I have an inside view of the demographic of HTE students in my area of Pennsylvania. In addition to the natural decline of hunters from the baby boomer generation as they age out or pass on the next the largest group that is contributing to the decline of hunter numbers is the parents... whether that parent be 30 years old or 65 years old. While I applaud them for getting as far as an HTE course, there's 3 reasons I see for the kids I teach not following through and becoming hunters.

1) Too busy- Both the parents and kids are involved in too many things: work, school, yoga, soccer, baseball, basketball, swimming, volleyball, track, boy scouts, girl scouts, 4H, karate, etc. Many of these are overlapping, time consuming, require travel, and are expensive. You're really setting yourself up for failure if you are going to try and make a kid choose between basketball with his friends or sitting in a tree stand.

2) The parents themselves quit on hunting. Often the parents have already fallen out of favor with hunting and are on their way out by the time they have the kid attend an HTE class. Often, the parents only signed their child up due to the peer pressure from other friends that have kids signed up or at the urge of someone like a grandparent. Plenty of times the parents have already quit hunting or are only fair weather/opening day hunters. It doesn't take much to push these people to quit all together as the simply don't care enough.

3) All anyone cares about is deer hunting.... Small game hunting is a dying art and is generally skipped all together. I'd wager that at least 80% of all students I teach will not hunt small game of any kind as their first hunting experience. Day 1 will be in a deer stand in December. These parents have forgotten how insanely boring and borderline torturous it is to a kid to sit silently in a tree stand or blind in subzero temperatures for hours. If they had the general woodsmanship and hunting lessons that are learned in the small game woods while experiencing successes and failures we would see a lot kids turning into well rounded lifetime hunters instead of the type of adult listed in point number 2.

#1 and #3 are very real around here. The fixation on deer hunting has also made it harder to get permission to hunt private land for small game. Lot's of "No's" since cousin Jimmy, etc deer hunts that patch of woods. That said, squirrel hunting here in IN, even on public ground, is about as accessible as it gets in this state. Great primer.

willm -
Thinking my boys may get introduced to D&D during this extended Ronacation. Yes, I played back in the day and still this day enjoy reading fantasy sci-fi.

 

[JEL]

Good grief, seriously! I remember when my best friend got a hand-me-down Atari, we thought that thing was amazing, and THEN my other buddy got this gray boxy thing called a Nintendo with a game called Mario Bros, WHOA! And I'm only an ancient 38...

You aren't old unless you can remember being excited about Pong.

 

[Elk Bugler]

You are upset with the bees after you kicked the hive??

You still didn’t answer my question.

Good luck.

And what question didn't I answer? I addressed your points some I can agree with others not so much.

 

[LopeHunter]

I remember before Comodore 64 we used to spell boobs on calculators for fun

58008

 

[Elk Bugler]

I remember as a kid and all the way up until I left home it looked like the orange army in the mountains. You could not find a place to park in most areas and there were tents and campers galore anywhere big enough to hold them. This was all on public land however and it was a sort of accepted norm to see a ton of people (welcomed by most actually because it got things moving according to the old timers) It was more of a social gathering with hunting tossed in than anything. Fast forward 20 or 25 years and now those same ridges and wide spots are empty. You rarely see a hunting camp outside of certain places and you can sit all day without hearing a shot.
Thinking back on it I cant remember seeing many kids in those camps. I guess I would have remembered since I wasn't much more than one myself then either. Most were made up of middle age or much older guys who took one of their vacation weeks to go to deer camp. Those guys are all either past tense now or retired and no longer have the drive to go because their friends cant go or wont go. This last example is one of the reasons that the deer camp I used to enjoy as a kid no longer exists. The only way to hunt around those guys anymore is to visit a graveyard.

I never really thought of the commraderie and acceptance perspective around public land hunting culture and always attributed that more to deer camp. But now that I think of the stories I heard about strangers meeting in the woods on firearms seasons and coming together for a deer drive it makes sense. So you think the lack of comradarie among hunters has led to decline in hunting? I can definitely see it as a factor because this country in general has shifted to a less friendly "us against them" culture.

 

[JohnCushman]

58008

Or boobless.....55378008 and look at it upside down

 

[Deleted member 28227]

#1 and #3 are very real around here. The fixation on deer hunting has also made it harder to get permission to hunt private land for small game. Lot's of "No's" since cousin Jimmy, etc deer hunts that patch of woods. That said, squirrel hunting here in IN, even on public ground, is about as accessible as it gets in this state. Great primer.

willm -
Thinking my boys may get introduced to D&D during this extended Ronacation. Yes, I played back in the day and still this day enjoy reading fantasy sci-fi.

My older cousin has been running a campaign for his elementary age kids and a few of their friends, he said it has been a blast.