long range

[Duck-Slayer]

Well archery is challenging by getting close and outsmarting the animal, not by reading the conditions and being a great shot, I am sure that can be very difficult, but you are not outsmarting the animal. That is what hunting is about to me.

I agree with that statement, I basically live by that standard, die hard bow hunter here...
Matt

 

[belly-deep]

What they don't say until pressed is that the last bull that was killed at 700 and something yards (the yardage was mentioned in their opening statements) was shot multiple times in nonvital places even though it was immobilized. They had to finish it off when they got there. Precision shooting? They got their bull.

Press a bowhunter and they will share stories of lost animals too, many of which would have been dead or immobilized until another shot could be taken had the hunter been using a rifle.

One serious disadvantage I see in a bow is in the follow up shot. Wounded animals are not "shocked" by an arrow in the way they are a bullet and a bow's range can quickly be out ran by a wounded animal. Additionally, bows require more time and movement for a follow up shot. Often times, a rifle hunter can get a follow-up shot off. Rarely does a bowhunter do so.

That said, I still hunt with a bow. It lack of effectiveness in certain areas does not rule it out as an unethical weapon in my eyes, just one that takes more care to use.

I think John Burns has pretty much proven that a practiced hunter with a suitable long range rifle can be very deadly on the first shot out to 1000 yards or more.

 

[belly-deep]

Well archery is challenging by getting close and outsmarting the animal, not by reading the conditions and being a great shot, I am sure that can be very difficult, but you are not outsmarting the animal. That is what hunting is about to me.

Where do you draw that line?

Is shooting an animal that is unaware of your presence not "outsmarting" it?

I'm guessing that is your main contention with long range hunting--that the animals are so far distant that they don't know they're being hunted.

Should treestands not be used by bowhunters?

Or do you believe that a hunter must be within detection of the animal's 5 senses to "outsmart" it?

If that is the case, I've had elk wind me at 1/2 mile and spot me even further than that. So are you saying that an 800 yard elk kill is still within the realm of "outsmarting" it? What about antelope?

Isn't the whole game of hunting to get with your weapon's range of an animal undetected and kill it?

 

[JohnCushman]

I wish your buddy the best of luck!!! I am fairly new to the 'long range' game with a rifle. Hell, I've only hunted with a rifle since moving to Colorado..lol I too am a die hard bow hunter, but even with that I've extended my range out to 80 yards. There's alot of argument on archerytalk.com about shots more than 30 or so yards being 'unethical', but I see it more as what the shooter is capable of and what they can do with their equipment. With my 25.06 I am good out to 400 yards, but I plan on extending that range out to 600+. Just like my bow, it's going to take alot of practice and nearly perfect conditions for that 'long range' shot....but I want to know I can do it and challenge myself to be able to do it if the need arises. Especially living out here on the plains, a multiple hundred yard shot is not all that uncommon, especially on antelope. I don't see 'long range' shooting as needing less talent or anything like that or being unfair to the animals. Just like close range shooting, long range shooting has it's own set of challenges and rewards. If your buddy is proficient and knows he can make the shot, then by all means, all the best to him!!!

 

[MHMT]

Where do you draw that line?

Is shooting an animal that is unaware of your presence not "outsmarting" it?

I'm guessing that is your main contention with long range hunting--that the animals are so far distant that they don't know they're being hunted.

Should treestands not be used by bowhunters?

Or do you believe that a hunter must be within detection of the animal's 5 senses to "outsmart" it?

If that is the case, I've had elk wind me at 1/2 mile and spot me even further than that. So are you saying that an 800 yard elk kill is still within the realm of "outsmarting" it? What about antelope?

Isn't the whole game of hunting to get with your weapon's range of an animal undetected and kill it?

Ya you're right when you put it that way. I guess it would also be outsmarting an animal by catching them and growing them in high fences to shoot later, maybe you could give that a try.

Basically I am saying there is a point, (probably different for everyone) that the "game" isn't fun anymore, and doesn't feel like hunting. I am just stating what part of the "game" I prefer.

 

[mtmiller]

Quite a bit of what hunters do is for "bragging rights"

Shooting is just another aspect of it.

Don't bowhunters shoot smaller animals than they would with a rifle and say "its a good sized buck for a bow kill"??? How is that different from a rifle hunter saying "its a two point, make it difficult"???

And yet, a long range rifle hunter who considers his effective range to be where he can place 90% of his shot in the vitals of an animal is somehow violating ethics?

The long range rifle hunter is no different from a bowhunter. The thrill and the challenge is different; one uses a weapon that limits the hunter to shot range and placement while the other uses a weapon extends the range to obtain the challenge.

I say we don't throw rocks in a glass house. The bowhunters, the "regular" rifle hunters, and the long range hunters will all wound animals. The ones that practice more, regardless of weapon, will be less likely to wound.

any long range shooter's out there, my buddy Rob his GF Dawn, my wife, and I are headed out too a 2 point only hunt in some wide open countryish, my buddy love's too long range shoot and my dad and I got into last 2 years or so, its fun, but I am going too take my bow, going too try and stick another deer, the wife will be long range shooting, i'm hoping she can pull off a 400 yard shot, we'll see, but my buddy Rob wants too break his record of 725 from this past antelope season, so hopefully I will have some good pictures and story for you all, and i'm sure a video or two... we will be leaving wed. morning....
Matt

Not sure if I got much of the analogy on the bowhunting vs long range rifle "shooting". I killed a lope with my bow a few years ago at 55 yds. Since then, not once, have I thought to myself that I need to get out this season and break my personal record. To purposely get as far away as possible to try to kill a big game animal seems very silly to me.

 

[1_pointer]

I'm on the same page, I think anyway, as miller. I don't think most fellow hunters care what range most folks take game at with any weapon if they have the gear and skills to do so. I think what many take umbrage to all too often the stated goal is the distance and not the animal. That is a perception problem that will always face long range hunting when stated as done in the OP. Heck, one of the most respected hunters on this board has taken game much farther than the stated 'goal' in the OP. However, his posts/stories are about the hunt and/or the critter not the distance. IMO, big difference...

 

[HUNTMAN]

To compare long range rifle shooting to bowhunting is ludcris.I grew up rilfe hunting and archery hunting.As i got older i put the rilfe down.I have nothing against rilfe hunting and i will pick mine up for wolves this year. But to shoot something at 600 yards plus is just shooting to me no hunting involved IMO.Good luck on the 2points.

 

[putm2sleep]

It's an OYOA site, and if your adventure involves spotting something a long ways off, then dropping the hammer from a great distance, and you did it yourself - kudos. It takes practice.

 

[DRAFTSTUD]

Things happen at 100 yards to the best of Marksmen, yet you want to go 6 or 7 times that? If ya'll want satisfaction on the wide open plains, drop yer pants and get in a circle. This is one of the silliest posts to come on this board since I have been a member. Oh, that's just my opion. John

 

[belly-deep]

Not sure if I got much of the analogy on the bowhunting vs long range rifle "shooting". I killed a lope with my bow a few years ago at 55 yds. Since then, not once, have I thought to myself that I need to get out this season and break my personal record. To purposely get as far away as possible to try to kill a big game animal seems very silly to me.

Different than a traditional archer wanting to use wood shafts and obsidian heads? Or to use a bow when rifle season is open? Both seem silly to me by your logic.

Isn't, in both instances, the hunter foregoing an "easier" option that, at the same time, increases the liklihood the animal will be wounded?

 

[mtmiller]

You missed my point. To go out with the intention of shooting something further that you ever have (break his 725 yard record), seems silly at best. Your mileage may vary.

This has nothing to do with "easier".

 

[TheTone]

If a guy is truly proficient at the long range game I really don't have much of a problem with it, but it takes lots of range time. How much has your wife shot your buddies gun to be truly accurate with it? I'll also agree with the others that setting out with the intention of trying to see how far away you can hit one is a little "interesting".

Hopefully you don't throw anymore tantrums while missing and wounding 2 ponts and break anymore bow equipment.

 

[belly-deep]

You missed my point. To go out with the intention of shooting something further that you ever have (break his 725 yard record), seems silly at best. Your mileage may vary.

This has nothing to do with "easier".

No, I understand completely.

My whole point is that as long as the method of harvest is within the law, who are we to judge whether it is appropriate?

I think its silly to want to poke a cedar shaft and an obsidian head through a critter...but I'm not going to knock the guy that does it.

 

[wingman1]

If it's legal go have fun.

 

[highmountian]

I like long range, short range, bow, shotgun, bb gun , sling shot, what else....

 

[pointingdogsrule]

As a archery hunter.... I've never had a buck walk by at 15 yards (with an ethical shot) and say to myself.... "I think I'll let him get out 40 yards before I shoot"

Best of luck on your hunt.

good luck to all
the dog

 

[elk_hunter]

+1 highmountain

 

[Dinkshooter]

This is more like a December thread, not October.......................

 

[buck23]

I wish you well.I too like shooting long range,smashing sierra bt at 1000 yds at paper and steel.But as a hunter I would rather get as close as possible rather than seeing how far I can back up.