Whats our President trying to do to us gun buyers/owners

Rooster52

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What is our President trying to do ?We already have back ground checks,what else is he trying to do?
 

hank4elk

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I'm all for background checks & funding for them.
There is a reason I can pass a Lifescan too.
Also a reason I'm not a NRA member anymore,quit in the 80's.
It's a personal opine deal.
 

nrpate05

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It seems that he is trying to end the gun show loophole by expanding background checks to private sales. In Colorado, where I live, It won't do much because we already have a law that requires background checks for that type of sale. Other than that, I don't think he is really doing much. Other than taking all of our guns away.
 

Hem

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Your guns arent going anywhere Rooster and your right to buy one wont change. Geez! Another stupid pointless political thread.
 

VAspeedgoat

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I am by no means an Obama fan, but in my opnion the "gun show loophole" needs to be closed. I'm not too sure we don't need to pass some sort of competency test before we can buy. We have to pass a test to get a drivers license. Maybe something similar would actually prevent some of these mental patients from getting their hands on a gun.........OK, now let me have it for suggesting something like that.
 

swmt

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Va Speedgoat - I think that is actually pretty rational. I'm willing to take a competency test to buy a gun - we already have to take a class to carry one - and if you can't carry, whats the point of owning one? I would even go a step further . . . I wouldn't mind registering my gun - that way the next time someone breaks into my house and steals my guns I might have chance of getting them back rather than having them sold in a pawn shop somewhere. We have registered our vehicles with the state since we have had vehicles and they haven't come for them yet.
Now we are really going to catch chit.
 

hank4elk

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Like I said there is a reason I CAN PASS a Lifescan.
Most LEO's I know couldn't, IMHO.
Competency test would have ACLU all over us......
That said a simple cursory background check & stopping GS loophole would help.
 

w8n4rutnmt

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Driving is a privilege, not a right. Vehicular registration is a tax. Should firearm registration cost gun owners money? I say NO
 

blb078

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I am by no means an Obama fan, but in my opnion the "gun show loophole" needs to be closed. I'm not too sure we don't need to pass some sort of competency test before we can buy. We have to pass a test to get a drivers license. Maybe something similar would actually prevent some of these mental patients from getting their hands on a gun.........OK, now let me have it for suggesting something like that.

It's not a bad idea, the problem with it is that a drivers license is a privilege provided by the citi/state. Where as owning a gun is a constitutional right so that is something anyone wanting a test type law will have to deal with. I'm all for keeping guns away from people who shouldn't have them, the problem is those people don't follow the rules/laws to begin with so adding more checks, competency test, etc wont do much. So the real issue is how do you keep guns away from criminals who don't care about the law anyway and the mentally ill, and some of the people labeled as mentally ill aren't actually labeled that until the go off on a shooting spree, you always hear the "he was a nice kid" story. I've never looked it up but anyone know what the crime rate is for states/cities that have minimal gun control vs those that have a lot of gun control?
 

VAspeedgoat

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My wife works in alternative education in public schools. She went to a conference where a parent from the Connecticut school shooting talked. The lady was pushing for early identification and testing for some of these kids/people before they leave school and we have no way of identifying potential issues. I can't even immagine implementing things like this but it made sense. Especially when she could have taken the east way out and just wanted to ban guns. Instead she addressed the real problem.

I don't have any issues with the right vs privilege debate, it just seems like there had to be something out there that isn't a hastle to 99% of us and "helps" keep guns away from the mentally ill. Lets face it, we won't keep guns from criminals and people will still lose there head temporarily and murder somebody, but this mass killing crap seems like it could be prevented most of the time.
 

JohnCushman

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I have severe PTSD, on top of depression, and social anxiety. Do I deserve to have my guns taken away or not be allowed to buy one due to my mental health issues? Not a single one of my 28 guns in my house have the intention to shoot up a school or a church or a movie theater or a minority...but my mental health issues could keep me from owning and buying guns in the future if these executive orders actually go through? I call bullshit. If my new shrink at the VA is some anti gun liberal and says I'm unfit to own a gun, just because they don't like guns...there goes my guns. I can foresee a lot of abuse of the system if implemented. Yes, something needs to happen to keep people safer, but you can't lawfully come up with a way to rationalize intent. With my mental health issues, I'm not going to harm anyone with my guns, but how many people with intent to harm someone would be honest on a background check to say they intend to commit a crime or harm someone with the gun they are lawfully purchasing? Do you just automatically criminalize people like me, and several thousand veterans with PTSD, and not allow us to own guns due to issues from combat? That's just one example. How do you foresee a person's intent when they purchase a firearm? You can register the hell out of every gun out there and give classes and give stricter background checks and whatnot, but someone with ill intent will still legally buy a firearm and use it for that purpose, no matter what safeguards are in place. So, now what?
 

w8n4rutnmt

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I would also like to keep mass killings to a minimum...but any type of registration would, in my opinion, be a hassle. It would be yet another tax and gov't tab keeper. Like vaspeedgoat alluded to...the difficult issue is with people and how to manage/educate them.
 

TimeOnTarget

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I have severe PTSD, on top of depression, and social anxiety. Do I deserve to have my guns taken away or not be allowed to buy one due to my mental health issues? Not a single one of my 28 guns in my house have the intention to shoot up a school or a church or a movie theater or a minority...but my mental health issues could keep me from owning and buying guns in the future if these executive orders actually go through? I call bullshit. If my new shrink at the VA is some anti gun liberal and says I'm unfit to own a gun, just because they don't like guns...there goes my guns. I can foresee a lot of abuse of the system if implemented. Yes, something needs to happen to keep people safer, but you can't lawfully come up with a way to rationalize intent. With my mental health issues, I'm not going to harm anyone with my guns, but how many people with intent to harm someone would be honest on a background check to say they intend to commit a crime or harm someone with the gun they are lawfully purchasing? Do you just automatically criminalize people like me, and several thousand veterans with PTSD, and not allow us to own guns due to issues from combat? That's just one example. How do you foresee a person's intent when they purchase a firearm? You can register the hell out of every gun out there and give classes and give stricter background checks and whatnot, but someone with ill intent will still legally buy a firearm and use it for that purpose, no matter what safeguards are in place. So, now what?

Right there with ya Cush!!
 

Rooster52

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I guess no matter how this turns out in the end there will always be some kind of abuse.It is the society we live in.
No praying in our schools
No pledge allegence to our flag
We do not need a democrat or a republican in the Whitehouse,we need an AMERICAN !!
 

elkantlers

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I have no problem with background checks but they really don't stop a criminal from getting guns. My problem with the new executive action is that I really don't see it making any difference, just like many of the other gun laws already on the books that are not enforced. If I'm correct, Murder is already illegal. Doesn't matter what a person uses to do it.
More laws are not needed.
JohnCushman also Makes some very good points. Makes me think about what all these guys and gals paid for, and continue to pay for, all of our freedoms. Thanks...
 

VAspeedgoat

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I have severe PTSD, on top of depression, and social anxiety. Do I deserve to have my guns taken away or not be allowed to buy one due to my mental health issues? Not a single one of my 28 guns in my house have the intention to shoot up a school or a church or a movie theater or a minority...but my mental health issues could keep me from owning and buying guns in the future if these executive orders actually go through? I call bullshit. If my new shrink at the VA is some anti gun liberal and says I'm unfit to own a gun, just because they don't like guns...there goes my guns. I can foresee a lot of abuse of the system if implemented. Yes, something needs to happen to keep people safer, but you can't lawfully come up with a way to rationalize intent. With my mental health issues, I'm not going to harm anyone with my guns, but how many people with intent to harm someone would be honest on a background check to say they intend to commit a crime or harm someone with the gun they are lawfully purchasing? Do you just automatically criminalize people like me, and several thousand veterans with PTSD, and not allow us to own guns due to issues from combat? That's just one example. How do you foresee a person's intent when they purchase a firearm? You can register the hell out of every gun out there and give classes and give stricter background checks and whatnot, but someone with ill intent will still legally buy a firearm and use it for that purpose, no matter what safeguards are in place. So, now what?

This is exactly why I like threads like this. I am a think out loud kinda guy and would never have thought about situations like this. You're exactly right, there would be all kinds of abuse of the system. I don't know what the answer is but it seems like there should be something. But, the law of unintended consequences seems to always be there.
 

hank4elk

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I'm there with ya folks.
Just wondering if it's just the society we have become.
Like Rooster said ,maybe we just need a Good American President again.
And Americans to stand up for each other,be good neighbors.

Teddy where are your offspring when we need you now?

Cush, I agree with you 100%!
I would probably not be let out of a VA hospital after initial shrink profile was done on 1st visit.........I have never set foot in one for myself and never will.
PTSD,oh that. It was denied it existed to most of my contemporaries in arms.
And I most likely would not be hired for the LEO job these days,background check or not.
Just not PC enough......John ,your much smarter than you let on at times.
Thank you for your service.
 
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Wow such a different tone on this thread than on another forum I frequent. Glad people who think closing the gs loop aren't cut down for "hating freedomz". Even some things that I think are common sense are met with disdain, such as the proposed law in WA for criminal liablity for parents if a kid gets a hold of an unsecured gun and injures or kills somebody. Who on HT doesn't keep guns out of reach of small kids? Seems like common sense to me but I try to be as pragmatic as possible.

JC, thank you for your service. Sure, the mass shootings in this country are often perpetrated by people with mental illness but not all people with mental illness would think it's a good idea to shoot up a school. Don't think that can be the litmus test for determining if somebody shouldn't own a gun. As far as registration, I'm conflicted. Face it, the feds could find out already who owns guns from hunting licenses, cc purchases, etc. I do think training would be a good idea, lest the guy who thinks packing his pistol in his waist band shoots his nuts off (actually, maybe he shouldn't breed):hump:
 
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