JoseCuervo
New member
WH,
Don't you think some education could come from it? Why just "laugh it off"?
Don't you think some education could come from it? Why just "laugh it off"?
Vice-President Shoots Up Texas.....
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Washington Hunter
Well-known member
Education for who? Most hunters I know already know not to shoot if a person is in the line of fire. All this incident did is to "educate" non-hunters that hunting and guns are dangerous, even in the most repsonsible hands.
Washington Hunter
Well-known member
here you go Buzz...you'll like this one:
It’s time for Cheney to take responsibility
BY MIKE LEGGETT
Cox News Service
AUSTIN, Texas -- Be a man. You shot a guy.
That would be my unsolicited advice for Vice President Dick Cheney.
You shot a guy. At least stay in town until he’s out of the hospital.
You shot a guy. Don’t blame the sun or the wind or the rotation of the Earth. And for goodness’ sake, don’t blame Harry Whittington.
He’s the guy you shot, and unless he pulled the trigger himself, it wasn’t his fault. Unless he was invisible, it wasn’t his fault. And it wasn’t his fault that he didn’t “announce his presence,” either. He was supposedly 30 yards behind you. His only fault was being a human being standing on two legs.
He’s in the hospital. You’re in Washington. And others are making excuses for you.
You shot the guy.
I’ve been hit with pellets, and it felt like a swarm of bees coming upside my head. I didn’t spend several days in the hospital. I’ve picked shot out of other people sitting on the tailgate of a pickup, and they didn’t even have to go to the doctor. They went back out hunting.
They got peppered. Whittington got shot. By you.
As somebody who’s shot a hole in the floorboard of his own pickup with a shotgun load and gone jelly-legged and speechless at the horror of that puff of smoke curling up inside the truck, I know exactly how easily the gun goes off when it shouldn’t. I can’t go holier-than-thou on the vice president’s accident. That would be ignoring the reality of human beings afield with firearms. It happens.
Hunters know the truth. We’ve all done it. We’ve all gotten away with a moment of carelessness, usually with no more damage than a silent prayer and a promise never to make that mistake again. But most of us don’t have to go public with our mistakes.
Hunters assume a huge responsibility every time they pick up a shotgun. For knowing whether a particular bird is a mallard hen or a mottled duck or whether it’s a killdeer and not a mourning dove. (See previous presidential shootings.)
They also assume the responsibility for being as safe as possible and knowing where the gun is pointed.
When we slide a cartridge down the gullet of a shotgun, when we climb on a hunting truck with another, we’re assuming the responsibility for being safe or admitting when we aren’t. That’s understood, whether the hunter is an assistant cashier at the drug store or the vice president of the United States.
All is not lost here, though. Cheney can use the opportunity to make a strong statement for hunting safety, for wearing hunter orange behind bird dogs, for honesty. It would mean a lot to youngsters, and to everyday guys who make the same mistake, that the vice president didn’t try to shuffle the blame onto someone else.
Stand up. Take responsibility. Be a man. You shot a guy.
Mike Leggett is the American-Statesman’s outdoors writer. E-mail: mleggett AT statesman.com
Story Filed By Cox Newspapers
It’s time for Cheney to take responsibility
BY MIKE LEGGETT
Cox News Service
AUSTIN, Texas -- Be a man. You shot a guy.
That would be my unsolicited advice for Vice President Dick Cheney.
You shot a guy. At least stay in town until he’s out of the hospital.
You shot a guy. Don’t blame the sun or the wind or the rotation of the Earth. And for goodness’ sake, don’t blame Harry Whittington.
He’s the guy you shot, and unless he pulled the trigger himself, it wasn’t his fault. Unless he was invisible, it wasn’t his fault. And it wasn’t his fault that he didn’t “announce his presence,” either. He was supposedly 30 yards behind you. His only fault was being a human being standing on two legs.
He’s in the hospital. You’re in Washington. And others are making excuses for you.
You shot the guy.
I’ve been hit with pellets, and it felt like a swarm of bees coming upside my head. I didn’t spend several days in the hospital. I’ve picked shot out of other people sitting on the tailgate of a pickup, and they didn’t even have to go to the doctor. They went back out hunting.
They got peppered. Whittington got shot. By you.
As somebody who’s shot a hole in the floorboard of his own pickup with a shotgun load and gone jelly-legged and speechless at the horror of that puff of smoke curling up inside the truck, I know exactly how easily the gun goes off when it shouldn’t. I can’t go holier-than-thou on the vice president’s accident. That would be ignoring the reality of human beings afield with firearms. It happens.
Hunters know the truth. We’ve all done it. We’ve all gotten away with a moment of carelessness, usually with no more damage than a silent prayer and a promise never to make that mistake again. But most of us don’t have to go public with our mistakes.
Hunters assume a huge responsibility every time they pick up a shotgun. For knowing whether a particular bird is a mallard hen or a mottled duck or whether it’s a killdeer and not a mourning dove. (See previous presidential shootings.)
They also assume the responsibility for being as safe as possible and knowing where the gun is pointed.
When we slide a cartridge down the gullet of a shotgun, when we climb on a hunting truck with another, we’re assuming the responsibility for being safe or admitting when we aren’t. That’s understood, whether the hunter is an assistant cashier at the drug store or the vice president of the United States.
All is not lost here, though. Cheney can use the opportunity to make a strong statement for hunting safety, for wearing hunter orange behind bird dogs, for honesty. It would mean a lot to youngsters, and to everyday guys who make the same mistake, that the vice president didn’t try to shuffle the blame onto someone else.
Stand up. Take responsibility. Be a man. You shot a guy.
Mike Leggett is the American-Statesman’s outdoors writer. E-mail: mleggett AT statesman.com
Story Filed By Cox Newspapers
JoseCuervo
New member
WH,
Where on Earth did you come up with the idea that Cheney is the "most responsible" person? He is likely going to be indicted for leaking the name of a CIA agent. Hardly a responsible person.
Where on Earth did you come up with the idea that Cheney is the "most responsible" person? He is likely going to be indicted for leaking the name of a CIA agent. Hardly a responsible person.
Washington Hunter
Well-known member
I didn't mean for it to sound like I think he's responsible, just that many people probably see him that way. You know, for instance the people who worship anybody who calls himself a Republican...
Delw
Member
BuzzH said:
Exactly
Delw
noharleyyet
Well-known member
Washington Hunter said:
....and vice versa WH. Welcome to Hunttalk stab, I see you've met the resident basher boyz.
MarvB
Well-known member
My sentiments, for what their worth, lie along the same lines as Del's...pretty much NO grey area with a firearm- unless its something mechanical with the weapon itself you either fugged up or you didn't. Cheney fugged up!
That being said, I think the add on's are a bit of a reach...can't hardly equate quail "hunting" (if that's what he wants to call it) with WMD, Haleberton, CIA leaks, etc...take the news for what it is boys- the guy blew it and another "hunter" paid the price. As far as
Hey Johnnie...long time no visit...you coming back to CA for piggies this year?
That being said, I think the add on's are a bit of a reach...can't hardly equate quail "hunting" (if that's what he wants to call it) with WMD, Haleberton, CIA leaks, etc...take the news for what it is boys- the guy blew it and another "hunter" paid the price. As far as
I don't really think so- it makes CHENEY look bad! Leno and his writers will get some run for awhile and then it will be stamped in history and brought up over the years just like a Lewenski punchline.
Hey Johnnie...long time no visit...you coming back to CA for piggies this year?
The Hedgehog
Well-known member
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- 11,793
The Republican haters need to get over it.
I've read the media reports. Sounds like he flubbed up in a big way, luckily his buddy wasn't killed. It could have been worse. But unless somebody here was there to see how flagrent it was or wasn't, pretty tough to make a clear judgement on exactly what happed, based on what you read in the press. Shit happens. Funny that everybody is in such panic that it wasn't released to the press until a "whole" 24 hours later. As if it's some big cover-up attempt.
Cheney was cited with a warning for not having proper license, and this is what I read..
As far as ethics goes, it's not nearly as low as banging your intern.
I've read the media reports. Sounds like he flubbed up in a big way, luckily his buddy wasn't killed. It could have been worse. But unless somebody here was there to see how flagrent it was or wasn't, pretty tough to make a clear judgement on exactly what happed, based on what you read in the press. Shit happens. Funny that everybody is in such panic that it wasn't released to the press until a "whole" 24 hours later. As if it's some big cover-up attempt.
Cheney was cited with a warning for not having proper license, and this is what I read..
I doubt there was any intent to break any laws. Like I said, shit happens and I don't think any more or less of Cheney because of that.
As far as ethics goes, it's not nearly as low as banging your intern.
Calif. Hunter
Active member
Greenhorn - you make too much sense. I also agree with Del that barring mechnanical failure, gun "accidents" occur because someone screws up. As far as this incident goes - get over it.
muskeg
Active member
It's just plain bad press for hunting ..... it could have and should have been spun into good press (or as good as possible) .....
When Ak changes or make a new reg I don't think they give warning citations for six months !!!! but the might to the VP !!!!
When Ak changes or make a new reg I don't think they give warning citations for six months !!!! but the might to the VP !!!!
A-con
New member
Looks like things are getting ugly for the V.P. The guy he shot just had a heart attack, pellets lodged in his heart ! What do you think will happen if he dies ?
muskeg
Active member
More bad JuJu for Cheney .....
bad JuJu eventually catches up with you .....
bad JuJu eventually catches up with you .....
Washington Hunter
Well-known member
A-con said:
wow...sounds like it's more serious than they made it out to be. Still, from what they're saying, he should be ok. Quote from an article I found:
http://www.comcast.net/news/index.jsp?cat=GENERAL&fn=/2006/02/14/325908.html
cjcj
New member
I heard this today!!! The Lawyer that Cheney shot had a heart attack! they said he was hit in the heart with some shot.... Anyone heard about this?
Washington Hunter
Well-known member
Well...this is the article I read:
Hunter Shot by Cheney Has Heart Attack
By LYNN BREZOSKY and NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press Writers
1 hour ago
CORPUS CHRISTI, Texas - The 78-year-old lawyer who was shot by Vice President Dick Cheney in a hunting accident has some birdshot lodged in his heart and he had "a minor heart attack" Tuesday morning, hospital officials said.
The victim, Harry Whittington, was immediately moved back to the intensive care unit for further treatment, said Peter Banko, the administrator at Christus Spohn Hospital Corpus Christi-Memorial in Texas.
Banko said there was an irregularity in the heartbeat caused by a pellet, and doctors performed a cardiac catheterization. Whittington expressed a desire to leave the hospital, but Banko said he would probably stay for another week to make sure more shot doesn't move to other organs or to other part of his body.
"Some of the birdshot appears to have moved and lodged into part of his heart in what we would say is a minor heart attack," Banko said in a news conference outside the hospital.
David Blanchard, chief of emergency care, called it "a silent heart attack, an asymptomatic heart attack. He's not had a heart attack in the traditional sense."
The doctors said Whittington did not experience symptoms of a heart attack or any other problems. They left the birdshot in place and said he could live a healthy life with it there.
White House physicians who attended to Whittington at the scene after Cheney accidentally shot him were involved in the treatment, the officials said.
Whittington had initially been placed in intensive care after the accident Saturday evening. He had been moved to a "step-down unit" Monday after doctors decided to leave several birdshot pellets lodged in his skin rather than try to remove them.
A Texas Parks and Wildlife Department report issued Monday said Whittington was retrieving a downed bird and stepped out of the hunting line he was sharing with Cheney. "Another covey was flushed and Cheney swung on a bird and fired, striking Whittington in the face, neck and chest at approximately 30 yards," the report said.
The department found the main factor contributing to the accident was a "hunter's judgment factor." No other secondary factors were found to have played a role.
The department gave Cheney and Whittington warning citations for breaking Texas hunting law by failing to buy a $7 stamp allowing them to shoot upland game birds. A department spokesman said warnings are being issued in most cases because the stamp requirement only went into effect five months ago and many hunters weren't aware of it.
Cheney's office said Monday night in a statement that Cheney had a $125 nonresident hunting license and has sent a $7 check to cover the cost of the stamp. "The staff asked for all permits needed, but was not informed of the $7 upland game bird stamp requirement," the statement said.
Cheney, an experienced hunter, has not said anything publicly about the accident. It was fodder for jokes on late night TV and early Tuesday at the White House, before news surfaced about problems with Whittington's heart.
Hospital officials said they notified the White House of the change in Whittington's condition late in the morning. The mood of press secretary Scott McClellan was much more serious in an afternoon press briefing shortly before the hospital publicly updated Whittington's condition.
Katharine Armstrong, owner of the ranch where the shooting occurred, said Whittington made a mistake by not announcing that he had walked up to rejoin the hunting line after going to retrieve his bird, and Cheney didn't see him as he tried to down a bird.
The accident raised questions about Cheney's adherence to hunting safety practices and the White House's failure to disclose the accident in a timely way.
Several hunting safety experts agreed in interviews that it would have been a good idea for Whittington to announce himself. But every expert stressed that the shooter is responsible for avoiding other people.
Bush was told about Cheney's involvement in the accident shortly before 8 p.m. Saturday _ about an hour after it occurred _ but the White House did not disclose the accident until Sunday afternoon, and then only in response to press questions.
___
On the Net:
White House: http://www.whitehouse.gov
Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
Hunter Shot by Cheney Has Heart Attack
By LYNN BREZOSKY and NEDRA PICKLER, Associated Press Writers
1 hour ago
CORPUS CHRISTI, Texas - The 78-year-old lawyer who was shot by Vice President Dick Cheney in a hunting accident has some birdshot lodged in his heart and he had "a minor heart attack" Tuesday morning, hospital officials said.
The victim, Harry Whittington, was immediately moved back to the intensive care unit for further treatment, said Peter Banko, the administrator at Christus Spohn Hospital Corpus Christi-Memorial in Texas.
Banko said there was an irregularity in the heartbeat caused by a pellet, and doctors performed a cardiac catheterization. Whittington expressed a desire to leave the hospital, but Banko said he would probably stay for another week to make sure more shot doesn't move to other organs or to other part of his body.
"Some of the birdshot appears to have moved and lodged into part of his heart in what we would say is a minor heart attack," Banko said in a news conference outside the hospital.
David Blanchard, chief of emergency care, called it "a silent heart attack, an asymptomatic heart attack. He's not had a heart attack in the traditional sense."
The doctors said Whittington did not experience symptoms of a heart attack or any other problems. They left the birdshot in place and said he could live a healthy life with it there.
White House physicians who attended to Whittington at the scene after Cheney accidentally shot him were involved in the treatment, the officials said.
Whittington had initially been placed in intensive care after the accident Saturday evening. He had been moved to a "step-down unit" Monday after doctors decided to leave several birdshot pellets lodged in his skin rather than try to remove them.
A Texas Parks and Wildlife Department report issued Monday said Whittington was retrieving a downed bird and stepped out of the hunting line he was sharing with Cheney. "Another covey was flushed and Cheney swung on a bird and fired, striking Whittington in the face, neck and chest at approximately 30 yards," the report said.
The department found the main factor contributing to the accident was a "hunter's judgment factor." No other secondary factors were found to have played a role.
The department gave Cheney and Whittington warning citations for breaking Texas hunting law by failing to buy a $7 stamp allowing them to shoot upland game birds. A department spokesman said warnings are being issued in most cases because the stamp requirement only went into effect five months ago and many hunters weren't aware of it.
Cheney's office said Monday night in a statement that Cheney had a $125 nonresident hunting license and has sent a $7 check to cover the cost of the stamp. "The staff asked for all permits needed, but was not informed of the $7 upland game bird stamp requirement," the statement said.
Cheney, an experienced hunter, has not said anything publicly about the accident. It was fodder for jokes on late night TV and early Tuesday at the White House, before news surfaced about problems with Whittington's heart.
Hospital officials said they notified the White House of the change in Whittington's condition late in the morning. The mood of press secretary Scott McClellan was much more serious in an afternoon press briefing shortly before the hospital publicly updated Whittington's condition.
Katharine Armstrong, owner of the ranch where the shooting occurred, said Whittington made a mistake by not announcing that he had walked up to rejoin the hunting line after going to retrieve his bird, and Cheney didn't see him as he tried to down a bird.
The accident raised questions about Cheney's adherence to hunting safety practices and the White House's failure to disclose the accident in a timely way.
Several hunting safety experts agreed in interviews that it would have been a good idea for Whittington to announce himself. But every expert stressed that the shooter is responsible for avoiding other people.
Bush was told about Cheney's involvement in the accident shortly before 8 p.m. Saturday _ about an hour after it occurred _ but the White House did not disclose the accident until Sunday afternoon, and then only in response to press questions.
___
On the Net:
White House: http://www.whitehouse.gov
Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Hey stab...
How about that 8 shot and tweezers?
Care to change your tone?
Why do people have such a hard time putting two and two together? Anyone with half a firing brain cell should question why a guy that had a couple shot in him would be in ICU.
Of course it was covered up and slow to be released to the press, it was A LOT more serious than just a peppering.
The coffee is now officially burnt.
How about that 8 shot and tweezers?
Care to change your tone?
Why do people have such a hard time putting two and two together? Anyone with half a firing brain cell should question why a guy that had a couple shot in him would be in ICU.
Of course it was covered up and slow to be released to the press, it was A LOT more serious than just a peppering.
The coffee is now officially burnt.
Ithaca 37
New member
Now Whittington has had a heart attack from a pellet getting into his heart!
Hunter Shot by Cheney Has Heart Attack
CORPUS CHRISTI, Texas - The 78-year-old lawyer wounded by Vice President Dick Cheney in a hunting accident suffered a mild heart attack Tuesday after a shotgun pellet in his chest traveled to his heart, hospital officials said. Harry Whittington was immediately moved back to the intensive care unit and will be watched for a week to make sure more of the metal pellets do not reach other vital organs. He was reported in stable .....
http://news.yahoo.com/fc/us/bush_administration
Hunter Shot by Cheney Has Heart Attack
CORPUS CHRISTI, Texas - The 78-year-old lawyer wounded by Vice President Dick Cheney in a hunting accident suffered a mild heart attack Tuesday after a shotgun pellet in his chest traveled to his heart, hospital officials said. Harry Whittington was immediately moved back to the intensive care unit and will be watched for a week to make sure more of the metal pellets do not reach other vital organs. He was reported in stable .....
http://news.yahoo.com/fc/us/bush_administration
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