Tag your animal immediately!

[johnp]

After watching the wardens go about daily job duties on several different tv shows, it seems to that the Montana wardens have alot more common sense and people skills when compared to California or Maine wardens . That being said, I would be livid about losing all of that meat also.
The one thing that I find challenging the most is leaving proof of sex naturally attached to boned out meat wich is put in game bags for the pack out.

 

[RobG]

Overzealous policing and nit-picky regs are a good way for any wildlife agency to squander their credibility and public good will. Why would anyone stop at a check station if they fear getting their hard-won elk confiscated by an overzealous warden on a technicality? That said, it's the hunter's responsibility to know the law and toe the line.

I haven't had my tags checked at a MT game station in years. I assume they stopped doing it just for that reason. Lately they've only asked me what animals I saw and if I harvested anything. Is this everyone else's experience?

My friend had an experience with a warden who I assume was Drew. My friend was launching a boat on the Yellowstone when the warden asked for his license. This was his first trip of the year and he forgot that his old one expired so they agreed that he would only row the boat and not fish.

Well, after rowing about half way down the river my friend realizes he can buy a license online using his iPhone. So he does this and starts fishing. Of course the warden was spying on him from the bank and figures he has caught him red handed. The warden meets him at the take out furious, having already called in the ticket. When my friend showed him the electronic receipt he was dumbfounded. Ha!

 

[Poke 'Em]

I always cut my tag before I do anything else once I reach the dead animal. The tag usually doesn't get attached until I have a rear quarter separated.

I think the most common error in Idaho is forgetting to leave proof of sex on an animal that's quartered.

Being required to leave proof of sex is a stupid regulation. The regulation doesn't say you what sex you can kill, it says whether you can killed antlered or antlerless animals. Theoretically you could kill a bull with both antlers broken off at the base, and it would be a legal antlerless elk. Likewise, whitetail does, for example, can actually grow antlers in rare cases. So you could theoretically shoot a female deer that would be tagged as an antlered deer.

 

[300stw]

no matter how many times i watch the warden show, i always leave the show feeling your guilty until proven innocent, i record the shows and watched them over and over, also with some other people,, about 90 percent of the people i ask feel the same way,, maybe i run with a small crowd,

the buck i killed this year took 40 minutes or so to reach him,, i guess a tickets in the mail not that i admitted it,,

 

[WapitiBob]

"Knarr called the time between when Jim Latvala shot and when the elk was tagged “substantial” — roughly 20 to 25 minutes."

Seems petty to me and I'm surprised a warden would take something this far.

No excuse to wait 25 minutes. 5 yea, not 25.

 

[Stubaby]

I have a close relative in Utah who is a game warden. He realizes that he is alone deep in the woods the majority of the time. Help for him is usually a long ways away if he needs a hand. He doesn't want a mountain full of dudes who hate his guts because he's always got an ax to grind.

I have seen him in action on multiple occasions. He only pushes when one of two things are going on:

1. The people are obviously up to "no good". When a major rule has been broken and the hunters are trying to get away with it.

2. The huntrers get chippy and push back.

I have seen minor violations like this occur with him and he used the situation as a teaching and education scenario.....not a time to write tickets and create hostility.

Rules are rules but there are different levels of breaking the law. I wasn't there but this seems a little harsh. Nothing needs to be confiscated or fined IMO. This guy had already given the state enough money this fall. Talk him through what he should have done and he will remember to do it next time just as much as doing it this way.

 

[RobertR]

This is the coment game warden Gerry W Lister wrote: However once the ticket is written and the tag is punched, we will generally consider the animal lawfully possessed and leave it with the hunter.
I understand the warden who wrote the violation writes many violations and that's his style.
Why would he be given the head and not the meat?

If the camera crew was not present maybe he might have done things different but then he would have been held accountable for not writing a ticket being on camera.

I'm sorry but FWP has no common sence sometimes.

 

[jerrym]

The whole tagging thing in Montana is a joke...theres so many ways to interpret "transporting", etc.

A bud of mine, an LEO himself, received a $135 ticket for having an untagged elk hind quarter in his truck. He packed the quarter out the first trip, threw it in his truck, and was on his way to camp to get his Dad and Brother to help him with the rest. He left the tag on the remainder of the elk that he left.

Warden scratched him for transporting an elk without a tag...

That was BS to give him a ticket, that is what game wardens have told me to do. The warden should have hiked back to the elk in the field and if no tag then wrote him up. I was always told by wardens the tag stayed with the animal in the field and comes out on last load.

 

[Lawnboy]

That was BS to give him a ticket, that is what game wardens have told me to do. The warden should have hiked back to the elk in the field and if no tag then wrote him up. I was always told by wardens the tag stayed with the animal in the field and comes out on last load.

This is exactly what was taught by a warden at my son's hunters ed class. Tag stays with the meat on the last load out.

I'm calling BS on the whole camera guy being a fly on the wall. Having filmed a few episodes the the camera men are always giving you instructions on a shoot. They know what they are looking for and might have you simply go back again and glass on a rock outcropping because it makes a great shot and they missed it originally. If it's a slow day in the field he's going to be saying something to the warden. I guarantee the warden at one point or another feels pressure. It take a lot of money to produce TV and a lot is at stake each day your running the cameras.

On another note the article said they were on a neighbors land. I might be mistaken but even a warden needs permission to enter private property at least that was my understanding. Did he just go onto the land without such?

 

[tjones]

I think this would have turned out different had the tag been cut, attached or not.

 

[MT_elk]

Geez. There's always two sided to every story, but this one seems wrought with suspicion. I agree with Lawnboy and others about keeping the tag with the meat and it should be with the last load out. I have shot elk across a draw before and it took me 20 mins to actually get to the animal. I did not punch my tag until I reached the animal. Is that a violation? I always make sure I punch my take immediately after validating that the animal is indeed dead.

 

[sra61]

I haven't had my tags checked at a MT game station in years. I assume they stopped doing it just for that reason. Lately they've only asked me what animals I saw and if I harvested anything. Is this everyone else's experience?

They pretty much always check our tags. We specifically asked them how they wanted it done because we were having to check the game bags to see which one had the tag and then show the right one with the evidence of sex. What a PITA! So now every time the tag is on the hind with the evidence of sex, with the tag visible outside of the bag and on top of the pile so it's as easy as possible. The evidence of sex is another thing I would like to see changed. Every time I bag a hind with a rutty stink covered bunch of hair and junk nestled in with my prized meat I want to puke! I take great pains to make sure my meat is as good as possible, and it is good, but every once in a while I get a taste of rut and I know why. Elk are especially bad about it.

 

[belly-deep]

I think a stern warning would have sufficed.

I've dealt with some good wardens and I've dealt with some absolute a-holes. I don't know this guy, but for now, he's going into the a-hole category until I see evidence differently.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Every time I bag a hind with a rutty stink covered bunch of hair and junk nestled in with my prized meat I want to puke! I take great pains to make sure my meat is as good as possible, and it is good, but every once in a while I get a taste of rut and I know why. Elk are especially bad about it.

Sra61, just skin out a the testicle and leave it attached. It fulfills the regulation and is much cleaner. I too don't like hair and dirt on my meat.

Seems to me this was over the top by the warden. As far as pressure from the cameraman, I'm guessing it was more of the warden's personality that allowed him to be under pressure and write a chicken feces ticket. Last year when my friend shot his bull, he had forgotten to sign his license. The elk was properly tagged with evidence of sex but he had neglected to sign his license. They were filming for the Warden's show at the check station where we stopped. Thankfully, the wardens were all cool and even let him borrow a pen to sign his license and we were on our way with no hassle.
I can guarantee you that very few county attorneys are going to be pleased with a warden who writes a lot of these kinds of tickets if they have to prosecute a few of them in court.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

Sra61, just skin out a the testicle and leave it attached. It fulfills the regulation and is much cleaner. I too don't like hair and dirt on my meat.

Agreed, that rule is only as hard as one wants to make it. You can also leave a little section of the pecker. I've never had "rutty" meat because of it.

Regardless of what one thinks of the ticket, it shows that it's important to know what the regs are and follow them. If you do that, then you are no longer at the mercy and whim of the Game Warden to make a decision in your favor.

BuzzH, your friend should have demanded the warden follow him back to the carcass. If he refused, all he had to do was take a picture of the quarter with the tag on it. As Gerald said, prosecutors don't like shitty cases and will usually toss them out in a heartbeat.

 

[sra61]

Sra61, just skin out a the testicle and leave it attached. It fulfills the regulation and is much cleaner. I too don't like hair and dirt on my meat.

I guess it does say testicles, penis, scrotum, udder, OR vulva be attached doesn't it? I read technical and legal stuff all day, every day, but miss something like that! DUH! That's why everyone should read this forum!

 

[ridge-runner]

"that feeling soon soured when a Montana Fish, Wildlife and Parks warden, followed by a TV show videographer, approached Latvala as he was gutting the bull and asked to see his nonresident elk tag"

Must have been a slow day shooting film....

 

[Straight Arrow]

Every time I bag a hind with a rutty stink covered bunch of hair and junk nestled in with my prized meat I want to puke!

Me too and I wish that proof of sex evidence could be handled differently. I now try to seal the attached proof in a plastic bag to separate it from the meat, but it's a pain. With antelope especially, but with rutting bull elk too, any hair or hide will taint the meat if not handled properly.

The tag is supposed to remain with the "largest portion of the carcass" but with a quartered animal, that's not often a clear directive. It would seem reasonable to move the tag when two or more quarters are packed out, but still it's a judgement call.

 

[Ron Wright]

I never understood how tagging the animal would work out when your on a solo backpack Elk hunt. It takes me 3 or 4 loads to get it out, so there is a lot of parts that have no tag. If I only tagged the last load of meat, then there would be antlers and 3/4 of an Elk in the back of my truck untagged, sometimes for 24 hours. I started taking a picture of my filled out tag at the kill site and carrying that with me. I leave the tag at the truck with the first load as this is where I am most likely to see a Warden.

 

[Bambistew]

Me too and I wish that proof of sex evidence could be handled differently. I now try to seal the attached proof in a plastic bag to separate it from the meat, but it's a pain. With antelope especially, but with rutting bull elk too, any hair or hide will taint the meat if not handled properly.

As mentioned above... you don't have to leave all that nasty stuff on there, just a portion. I usually leave a small portion of the penis attached to one hind quarter, the rest is chucked. Its easy to do, and no more clean/dirty than the rest of the carcass. It runs between the rear legs, and if you're careful you can even get a piece to stay on each hind quarter.