Elk and bison - Bad news in Helena

[RobG]

Hunting, and Fishing are already protected in Montana's constitution. Trapping is sitting in a grey area because it wasn't specifically mentioned, as a method of take.

I would rather see a constitutional amendment to protect trapping rather than see our right to control government, go away.

Without the initiative process, we wouldn't have had I-161, or I-43.

Repealing Outfitter set aside licenses, and banning the hunting on game farms.

Those are good points (although I don't like I-161). Does MT require each county to be on board before a CI can be on the ballot? I think something like that passed as a CI when we prohibited cyanide heap leach mining. I guess that would offer some protection. Maybe we should have a citizens initiative to keep the legislature out of wildlife "management"!

 

[RobG]

Going skiing. Pray it doesn't snow tomorrow again or we might have to rely on a Bullock veto cause people aren't going to want to go to Helena unless we have a helicopter pluck them off the ridge!

 

[Ben Lamb]

It requires a 2/3 vote of all legislators to put this on the ballot, then the people would have to vote on it.

SHoots is right, this limits citizens in their ability to address the wrongs placed upon them by our elected officials.

It would also be the only area of law except for appropriations that would be singled out and disallowed for citizen initiatives. Given the lack of will to enact license fee increases by the leg, and the continued lack of serious conversation related to wildlife funding, this bill, if passed by the Leg and enacted by the voters means citizens would be at the mercy of the MT Legislature to enact laws related to all wildlife issues. Given the legislatures current bent of trying to privatize wildlife, I would hate to see MT's citizens lose their most effective tool to balance the buffalo chip crazy.

 

[theat]

Anyone for from the Missoula area heading to helena tomorrow have an extra seat? I came to town with the family and they need the truck tomorrow, but I can disappear for the day if I can get a ride.

 

[El Jason]

Hunting, and Fishing are already protected in Montana's constitution. Trapping is sitting in a grey area because it wasn't specifically mentioned, as a method of take.

I would rather see a constitutional amendment to protect trapping rather than see our right to control government, go away.

Without the initiative process, we wouldn't have had I-161, or I-43.

Repealing Outfitter set aside licenses, and banning the hunting on game farms.

So you're batting .500? I-43 was great. I-161 hasn't really accomplished anything, any outfitter can still bank on 100% for his clients and the licenses are cheaper.

If the MT legislature wasn't so loony, this might be a good thing. Citizen initiative management of hunting is a very dangerous thing. One only needs to look at CO, OR, WA as prime examples of what can be lost.

Coming from Jent, I would have to assume that this is what he is trying to protect against. Include Republican legislation as part of what's prohibited and you might be on to something.

 

[TLC]

How many stupid ideas can you fit in one bill? Let's see. Here are a few, for straters:

> Disallows Wild Bison from entering the state

is the person(s) responsible for writing this stuff related to this woman?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBVpqXHJ9z8

only takes a few seconds of watching to get the message.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Anyone for from the Missoula area heading to helena tomorrow have an extra seat? I came to town with the family and they need the truck tomorrow, but I can disappear for the day if I can get a ride.

There are some busses with tribal members heading down. Shoot me a PM and I'll see if we can get you on the bus.

 

[RobG]

So you're batting .500? I-43 was great. I-161 hasn't really accomplished anything, any outfitter can still bank on 100% for his clients and the licenses are cheaper.

If the MT legislature wasn't so loony, this might be a good thing. Citizen initiative management of hunting is a very dangerous thing. One only needs to look at CO, OR, WA as prime examples of what can be lost.

Coming from Jent, I would have to assume that this is what he is trying to protect against. Include Republican legislation as part of what's prohibited and you might be on to something.

Just saw an email from Sen. Jent. Yes, it (SB 204) is to prevent CIs from stopping lion hunts, etc.

If anyone wants a ride to Helena from Bozeman tomorrow some people will be meeting at the 19th street rest area at noon. PM me.

 

[RobG]

OK Houston, help me figure out this problem

SB 143 aka "Bison are illegal vermin to be shot on sight" (F&G committee) is to be heard at 3pm in room 303
HB 312 aka "Hunters to pay for FWP to test and slaughter our elk" (Ag. Committee) is to be heard at 3pm in room 472

They are at the same time. How are we going to do this?

FWIW, the Ag. Committee is scheduled to hear two other bills at 3pm.
FWIW2, BigFin said it was room 422 so I think that was a typo.

 

[Big Fin]

So now we get an amendment to HB 312 a half hour before the hearing. The bill is now a mirror if HB 237 from the 2011 session, a bill that got vetoed.

If this passes, hunters get to pay for testing and slaughtering of elk, the same as bison. It requires further reduction of elk numbers in the units around UMP. As if elk numbers are not low enough at this time.

If you are an elk hunter, time to speak up and let your House Rep know what you think on this bill. Most likely, it will pass this committee when they vote in an hour or so. If it passes, it will have a full House vote in the near future.

Time to kill this bill.

 

[sreekers]

At least Wy hasn't gotten this nutty yet.

 

[BuzzH]

...yet being the key word.

 

[Ben Lamb]

SFW testified in support of HB 312.

Apparently they like test & slaughter of elk.

 

[JCS]

SFW testified in support of HB 312.

Apparently they like test & slaughter of elk.

I saw that also. I wonder why?

 

[Ben Lamb]

I saw that also. I wonder why?

Near as I an tell, they don't think elk are as important as cows.

 

[sreekers]

SFW in favor of something crazy that is not best for wildlife? Who would have thought.

 

[Big Fin]

SFW testified in support of HB 312.

Apparently they like test & slaughter of elk.

Not "apparently," ......... certainly.

The same group that screwed Utah anglers out of their stream access rights now wants Montana hunters to pay to have our elk numbers reduced in areas where numbers are already very suppressed. Yeah, that is what they supported today. On the public record. Recorded on camera.

When their guy got up to testify in support I could only shake my head and think, "Certainly they are not going to make such a foolish statement in public, on the record." Well, they proved me wrong. Only a group like SFW could support an idea that uses hunter money to reduce elk numbers and try to pawn it off as something good for the resident hunter.

Any SFW supporter who is reading this, go ask you leaders why they are supporting this kind of stuff. This is not the only bad junk they are supporting. If it is a bad bill for hunters, odds are that SFW is going to support it.

Seems that every year SFW has to publicly show their true colors. Very thankful that they do, giving us a reminder of the many reasons why they should pack their bags and head back to where they came.

 

[RobG]

I though all the opponents gave relevant facts whereas the proponents were unfortunately operating from a base of fear and ignorance. The opponents in sum managed to get out the major points that were discovered by the elk brucellosis working group and the other people studying the issue. Even the ranchers from that group said this was a bad idea. The state livestock vet said it was a bad idea. Slaughtering elk simply isn't going to make the problem go away or change the way cattle have to be managed in the DSA. Having hunters pay to slaughter our own elk is repugnant.

Of course all this means it will fly through committee.

Now that I've seen him speak I have to say that we are incredibly lucky to have Big Fin speaking on behalf of hunters. Wow.

I was stunned by the SFW guy. I had fully planned to catch him in the hall and bitch him out for calling himself a sportsman, and I don't get that confrontational often. I gave him a huge glare after he spoke, but he slipped out the door without me noticing. I had no idea how pathetic and dangerous to hunting that group was. There is not a single thing in this bill that would benefit hunters.

 

[RobG]

As much as I think the group Citizens for Balanced Use is a nightmare for habitat, their support was tepid after the amendment was added. When SFW is demonstratively worse than CBU you know they are bad.

 

[Ben Lamb]

All I can say about today was wow.

Hunters stood with the tribes of Montana and other ranchers who want to put this war on wildlife to bed.

What a day. Proud to be a Montanan.