De-publicize, De-glorify and De-monetize Western State Hunting

[X13]

@mtnprst is this an example of the hunting gore you're looking to squash? https://www.hunttalk.com/threads/elk-lets-see-them.252485/

I think he meant ones like this


Edit: I'm done feeding the troll. He's got enough free proofreading from me.

 

[88man]

I'd add a third demonetizing step - Identifying hunting industry manufacturers which readily sponsor or produce glorified western hunting media with volumes of dead animal photos, video taped kill shots, etc., and working to boycott those companies.

As well, creating a hunting media "code of conduct" for hunting industry manufacturers, and identifying those companies who agree the gore is political suicide for the future of hunting, and and agree to avoid it in all marketing.

can you post your 990
Revenue from members dues ?
Donors over $10,000?

Gotta be some silent money to get you to stir the pot and make sure the dead cat is seen swinging by all who could be offended

 

[88man]

I think he meant ones like this
View attachment 181267

wants their Donors

 

[mtnprst]

A 4th demonetizing step .... require a hefty state permit fee for any commercial hunt filming. Federal permits are already required to film commercially on federal land, but I'm not aware of a state fee (I could be wrong).

Since the states own the wildlife being hunted, this should be required. Hunting self-promoters and/or industry manufacturers are commercially monetizing hunting for state-own wildlife, and they should pay a fee to the state's G&F department accordingly. I'd start at $1,000/day or $10,000 minimum, whichever is greater.

A 5th step - requiring a fee from online platforms which use western-state hunting statistics and/or geographical info for commercial purposes ... i.e. gohunt.com, huntingfool.com, onx, basecamp, etc.

 

[HandgunHunter]

A 4th demonetizing step .... require a hefty state permit fee for any commercial hunt filming. Federal permits are already required to film commercially on federal land, but I'm not aware of a state fee (I could be wrong).

Since the states own the wildlife being hunted, this should be required. Hunting self-promoters and/or industry manufacturers are commercially monetizing hunting for state-own wildlife, and they should pay a fee to the state's G&F department accordingly. I'd start at $1,000/day or $10,000 minimum, whichever is greater.

A 5th step - requiring a fee from online platforms which use western-state hunting statistics and/or geographical info for commercial purposes ... i.e. gohunt.com, huntingfool.com, onx, basecamp, etc.

You should probably brain storm this stuff in private and then try to get maybe 10-20k followers of your movement before you go about this the way you have so far.....

On another note. I made your website traffic go up 1.

Good job on trying to make your moral and ethical limits apply to everyone.

The shot distance crap is about as enforceable as minimum draw weight on bows.....which is not enforceable in the field.

When a movement....well this isn’t even that.....a few people who have an idea.....has the desire to drive a wedge between everyone else it quickly becomes a cancer that needs to be removed.

Dividing hunters is about the most stupid idea I have yet to see.

Make sure my company is the first on your boycott list....because I don’t want your money.

I can’t wait to share this crap with the industry.

 

[Ben Lamb]

A 4th demonetizing step .... require a hefty state permit fee for any commercial hunt filming. Federal permits are already required to film commercially on federal land, but I'm not aware of a state fee (I could be wrong).

Since the states own the wildlife being hunted, this should be required. Hunting self-promoters and/or industry manufacturers are commercially monetizing hunting for state-own wildlife, and they should pay a fee to the state's G&F department accordingly. I'd start at $1,000/day or $10,000 minimum, whichever is greater.

A 5th step - requiring a fee from online platforms which use western-state hunting statistics and/or geographical info for commercial purposes ... i.e. gohunt.com, huntingfool.com, onx, basecamp, etc.

You would likely face constitutional issues for unequal application under the law & first amendment issues relative to utilization of the public resources. Having permits for impacts due to commercial filming is applied across the board - movie production companies, commercials, etc. Singling out one commercial enterprise within the entire entertainment industry is a fast-track to a lawsuit & having to rescind the rule/law and possibly facing damages for civil rights violations.

 

[Rancho Loco]

A 5th step - requiring a fee from online platforms which use western-state hunting statistics and/or geographical info for commercial purposes ... i.e. THE STATES THEMSELVES?

 

[mtnprst]

Great point and this has been on our radar.

This summer we plan to research the prolific marketing efforts of the state G&F media Departments including dead animal pics/kill shots, being put out by the Departments.

This year Wyoming is selling ads in the hunting regulations booklet. We asked this week for the financial arrangement between the G&F department and the nonprofit selling the ads.

 

[HighCountryCommando]

A 4th demonetizing step .... require a hefty state permit fee for any commercial hunt filming. Federal permits are already required to film commercially on federal land, but I'm not aware of a state fee (I could be wrong).

Since the states own the wildlife being hunted, this should be required. Hunting self-promoters and/or industry manufacturers are commercially monetizing hunting for state-own wildlife, and they should pay a fee to the state's G&F department accordingly. I'd start at $1,000/day or $10,000 minimum, whichever is greater.

A 5th step - requiring a fee from online platforms which use western-state hunting statistics and/or geographical info for commercial purposes ... i.e. gohunt.com, huntingfool.com, onx, basecamp, etc.

More like Mountain Circus.

Did you hire 10th generation Russian and bare chested uber outdoorsman Vladimir Putin as your policy wonk?

I'm out as well. Good luck in your endeavors.

 

[El Jason]

Ironic all of this is coming from someone who claims to be a victim of cancel culture. I agree with some of your views, but some of these are bat shit crazy. Good luck.

 

[X13]

This thread needs cheese

 

[longbow51]

Better be careful with cancel culture. Gone way too far already. I wrote a facetious post earlier regarding just labelling writing about trophy hunting as classist and racist and it would disappear, but you seem serious. Never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.

 

[Hawk Tuah]

Great point and this has been on our radar.

This summer we plan to research the prolific marketing efforts of the state G&F media Departments including dead animal pics/kill shots, being put out by the Departments.

This year Wyoming is selling ads in the hunting regulations booklet. We asked this week for the financial arrangement between the G&F department and the nonprofit selling the ads.

When you do stuff like this, it makes changes that actually matter difficult for F&G departments because they get distracted when they have to sift through this meaningless noise.

 

[longbow51]

This thread needs cheese

I thought hobbits and dwarves were the preferred troll food

 

[Point Creep]

Mountain Pursuit has less presence than a typical teenager's "first day" appearance on social media, and it's been around for "years". As nice as it is to see somebody dream big, these ideas are completely bat shit crazy.

 

[HandgunHunter]

Mountain Pursuit has less presence than a typical teenager's "first day" appearance on social media, and it's been around for "years". As nice as it is to see somebody dream big, these ideas are completely bat shit crazy.

That’s what I saw when checking social media and their website traffic. Basically dead.

 

[X13]

I thought hobbits and dwarves were the preferred troll food

My wife brought some of this home the other day and it's quite good. What's everyone else been exploring in the cheese world?

 

[Hawk Tuah]

I'd add a third demonetizing step - Identifying hunting industry manufacturers which readily sponsor or produce glorified western hunting media with volumes of dead animal photos, video taped kill shots, etc., and working to boycott those companies.

As well, creating a hunting media "code of conduct" for hunting industry manufacturers, and identifying those companies who agree the gore is political suicide for the future of hunting, and and agree to avoid it in all marketing.

You and your initiatives in the hunting community are sort of like the flat-Earthers in the scientific community.

 

[BuzzH]

Do some research yourself what has happened when Montana has tried to increase resident fees in the past? You do realize that MT has the cheapest Resident elk tag in the nation, by far, it’s not that much higher than CO’s was in 1952 and CO needs to double the price of their tag. @BuzzH has made some good points about it not being about money. Yet we see allocation debates and then when residents are asked to pay $25 dollars for an elk tag the bitch and moan.

Good luck raising that money without NR.

I’m curious to here what the necessary resume requirement is for an opinion.

Randy has lived in MT longer than I’ve been alive.

Since apparently this is how we have to identify, I’m a 4th generation Coloradan and I was born and raised on the western slope. I left for school came back for a while, left for Montana while my wife went to school came back, I own a property that’s been in my family for close to 100 years .

I believe folks drop the “xx generation” card as a preemptive ad hominem attack I don’t have a lot of facts and I’m not gonna try real hard, but f-you I’m better.

Buzzh and Randy have my respect because of the work they’ve done I have no idea how many generations of whatever BuzzH, he fashions the facts into a giant club and beats you to death with it. We disagree, but man does that guy show up, same with Randy.

Anyway, thread has peaked, I’m out.

@BuzzH I see your argument, I do worry about the precedent lowering to 90/10 sets for residents in Utah, NM, MT etc who see themselves not drawing and say look WY did it, let’s cut ours to 5%. That said I’m not sure I would like a guide rule like Alaska in lieu of no draw allocation. That’s MSG, for elk and deer, I did the math and realized as a CO resident I would never draw and I can hunt elk and deer every year so whatever.

I’m far more worried about general tags in MT and WY then permits and LE.

My point over all is 90/10 might make some Residents feel like they got some justice, but it’s divisive and doesn’t solve any problems.

Do you honestly think that my reasons for supporting 90/10 is for "justice"?

Hardly, and you should know better by now.

IMO/E, the way we're going to save hunting, the traditions of hunting, protect habitat, make sure Forest Plans, etc. favor our desires in each state is because of the efforts of Residents.

Like I said, its great that Non Residents provide more license revenue, but its one small part of a whole buffet table full of problems that need to be solved.

What I'm saying is that those that do 90% of the work in the State, ensuring that wildlife, habitat, public lands, migration corridor protections, attending scoping meetings, serving on committees, commenting at public meetings, etc. etc....those 90% deserve 90% of what they're fighting for.

The best advocates for important wildlife issues in Wyoming, are those that live here, make lives here, and deal with these issues every day.

I'm not seeing enough benefit, or advocates being created defending what we value in Wyoming to give NR's 25% of our sheep tags....or 16% of our best LQ elk tags away.

I'm much more inclined to give more tags to people who have earned them, and who actually WILL advocate for Wyoming public lands, Wyoming State lands, Wyoming wildlife, etc.

If all NR's are going to hang their hat on is strictly the money they provide...well, don't expect residents to think you're going all out, because you're not. Like I said, the money is great, but its the very, very, very least a NR can do when they run hooks, bullets, and arrows through another states wildlife every 1-5-10 years. Wildlife that only exists because of the herculean efforts of the residents...

 

[HandgunHunter]

Do you honestly think that my reasons for supporting 90/10 is for "justice"?

Hardly, and you should know better by now.

IMO/E, the way we're going to save hunting, the traditions of hunting, protect habitat, make sure Forest Plans, etc. favor our desires in each state is because of the efforts of Residents.

Like I said, its great that Non Residents provide more license revenue, but its one small part of a whole buffet table full of problems that need to be solved.

What I'm saying is that those that do 90% of the work in the State, ensuring that wildlife, habitat, public lands, migration corridor protections, attending scoping meetings, serving on committees, commenting at public meetings, etc. etc....those 90% deserve 90% of what they're fighting for.

The best advocates for important wildlife issues in Wyoming, are those that live here, make lives here, and deal with these issues every day.

I'm not seeing enough benefit, or advocates being created defending what we value in Wyoming to give NR's 25% of our sheep tags....or 16% of our best LQ elk tags away.

I'm much more inclined to give more tags to people who have earned them, and who actually WILL advocate for Wyoming public lands, Wyoming State lands, Wyoming wildlife, etc.

If all NR's are going to hang their hat on is strictly the money they provide...well, don't expect residents to think you're going all out, because you're not. Like I said, the money is great, but its the very, very, very least a NR can do when they run hooks, bullets, and arrows through another states wildlife every 1-5-10 years. Wildlife that only exists because of the herculean efforts of the residents...

I can see the 90/10 argument

I also know we also get un guided access into the wilderness which is huge.

I can also see where a 10% cut in clients for the guide/tourism/food and so on is huge.

It’s kinda like walking into any established business and escorting a portion of the customers out the door and telling the shop owner their revenue is cut immediately even tho they have been established and following their business plan for x years.....

That’s pretty brutal and will cost jobs.

The sword cuts both ways.