Bozeman: is it really that bad anymore?

[Wheatgrass]

I left Bozeman in 1996 after a three years of graduate school. Enjoyed my stay, for sure, but do not regret leaving. It will always be a nice place but I always disliked all the attitude about who does or doesn’t belong there. It gets old, fast, yet it continues to consume people. I met someone a few months ago that just moved to Bozeman from small town Montana, and was already frothing at the mouth about Californians. I do not miss that part of Bozeman and it is not the only nice place.

 

[Straight Arrow]

As someone who has lived in and around Bozeman for six decades, certainly the changes are realized and the various perspectives on this thread are not only mostly accurate, but also interesting and entertaining. The common misconception about the "California" influx remains as a stereotypical description, but is more a phrase than a reality. A few years ago the statistical numbers of those moving to the Gallatin Valley revealed a preponderance of Montanans relocating here from other places in the state. I do think that has changed and expanded the number of those from all over the country and perhaps even internationally.
Timeline relationship to growth certainly points to Maclean's "A River Runs Through It" and more recently perhaps an uptick due to YELLOWSTONE, but I think it's much more complex than that. Montana's tourism has ramped up and been accentuated by huge state ad campaigns. The steady continued growth and popularity of Big Sky has been a big factor, but now with the explosion of development surrounding Lone Mountain (Big Sky, The Yellowstone Club, Moonlight Basin) and the continual expansion of the Gallatin airport, that has played a big part. Additionally, you can't ignore the impact of Montana magnetism attracting the typically vocal celebrities who are widely newsworthy ... as well as the infamous Uni-Bomber story from Lincoln. (BTW, my wife has met her favorite, Sam Elliott; my son has met Dennis Quade. I have met Ted Turner, Jane Fonda, Becky Fonda, Buck Taylor, and seen a few others around. So they're here and out and about.)

My favorite celebrity story is about a real estate acquaintance who had an appointment with someone unnamed to discuss potential rural properties. As he approached the SUV to introduce himself, the door opened and out stepped Michael Keaton. The realty guy was quite embarrassed, as all he could think to say, was, "BATMAN!!!".

 

[Tlrussell]

1875

Is that the new Yellowstone prequel sequel?

 

[375H&H]

I just know the billboard advertising dental surgery could have chosen a better subject…literally the worst possible example of what they are trying to sell. It’s so bad I just drove by it on my way to Butte and was compelled to mention it here.

Those from the area know what I am talking about. Somebody please replace it with a hop zone ad before someone crashes their car.

 

[sacountry]

Five pages of how bad Bozeman is. You are not fooling me. Reading this thread has me thinking that Bozeman is much better than the wind blown, tree less, oppressively hot in the summer and frigid cold in the winter plains of the eastern part of Montana.
I all most forgot to mention the mosquitoes in the summer, -50+ windchill in the winter, dust most of the summer because it rarely rains, gumbo when it does rains, poor health care and a two hour drive on mostly gravel to buy a gallon of milk with more than three days on the expiration date.
The roads are mostly gravel paths that might see a county road grader twice a year. The rest of the year they are full of jaw rattling washboards, that cut up even the best of tires. Cell service is spotty at best even on the highways, mostly none everywhere else. I am sure I am missing some stuff as I have been hardened by the constant misery.
No jobs, and if you do find one it is a deadend with little pay. Not even going to go into the politics, but come on we elected a Maryland transplant Montana wantabe by a wide margin.
Nothing to see, nothing to do, no reason to be in Eastern Montana. If you do find yourself out east it is best to just stay on Interstate 90 or 94, look straight ahead and keep driving until you get to the paradise west of Billings. If you are heading east on 90, keep going, Wyoming is nice. If you find yourself on 94, turn around at the next exit, North Dakota is ahead.

You missed your calling as a tourism director.

 

[Wes Mantooth]

K-hoes….. that place was also fun. We had a knife pulled on us there one night. That dampened the mood. Prolly left there to go to power hour.

Ah, KOs...I bartended there for about 4 years in the late 90s. And yes, I am scarred for life. But in a good way.

 

[Wes Mantooth]

This thread could also be called 'Jackson Hole/Boulder/Austin/Ketchum/Telluride: is it really that bad anymore?'

I grew up in central MT, and moved to BZN to go to college at MSU in 1993. Stayed for the skiing/climbing/fishing/hunting/smoking hot college girls/bartending gigs before I sort of became an adult and got a job, etc. Bought a condo in 2000, then a "real house" in 2004. Thank F'ing goodness I did at that time.

Here is my blast from the past things about BZN that were fun/awesome/questionable:

• KO's at 1am on a Sat. night because we all need more alcohol, drunken bumpin and grindin on the dancefloor and a 1 in 5 chance of a fight in the parking lot.
• Bartending at KO's. It was a good time.
• Breakfast at the Western before it was the "cool Western" thing to do.
• Elk hunting in the Bridgers and actually getting into elk and shooting them on public land. My buddy has a pic of a small bull with the chairlifts at Bridger off in the distance.
• Breakfast at 4Bs after KO's closed with a random posse of fellow barcrawlers. I am still friends with some of them....prison pen pals, sure, but they are nice folks.
• The R Bar back when it is was dirty and real and a 50/50 chance the bathroom was functional (as well as a bartender named Suzie....yikes.)
• Zebra Down Below and a drink innocently named "Liquid Cocaine". It was served in a small pitcher loaded with ice and it lived up to the name. My liver has PTSD.
• Shooting gophers at the "end of the road" off of Ravalli at a buddy's house he rented with 4 other jokers (we used a pellet gun, because safety matters.)
• Going to about 30 parties at that big white house off of West Lincoln St. not too far from Granny's Donuts. I watched a guy once stumble his way from the keg down the hall and then puke INTO a giant hole in the sheetrock in the wall. Resale value cha-ching!
• Skiing Bridger Bowl on a powder day and still be able to park in Lot A and almost get first chair.
• Ice climbing in Hyalite when the road wasn't plowed, you were going to get stuck or help someone else get unstuck, and you might see 5 or 6 other people all day.
• Fishbowls at Black Angus on Main St. (Long gone now). If you know, you know.

After reading through that, it becomes obvious I enjoyed drinking and there are likely 100 stories like it from countless other great places that are getting overrun or "loved to death" by the influx of outsiders. I am very curious to hear the opinion of my son (a 5th grader now and a true Bozeman 'local') in 10 or 20 years.

 

[sacountry]

This thread could also be called 'Jackson Hole/Boulder/Austin/Ketchum/Telluride: is it really that bad anymore?'

I grew up in central MT, and moved to BZN to go to college at MSU in 1993. Stayed for the skiing/climbing/fishing/hunting/smoking hot college girls/bartending gigs before I sort of became an adult and got a job, etc. Bought a condo in 2000, then a "real house" in 2004. Thank F'ing goodness I did at that time.

Here is my blast from the past things about BZN that were fun/awesome/questionable:

• KO's at 1am on a Sat. night because we all need more alcohol, drunken bumpin and grindin on the dancefloor and a 1 in 5 chance of a fight in the parking lot.
• Bartending at KO's. It was a good time.
• Breakfast at the Western before it was the "cool Western" thing to do.
• Elk hunting in the Bridgers and actually getting into elk and shooting them on public land. My buddy has a pic of a small bull with the chairlifts at Bridger off in the distance.
• Breakfast at 4Bs after KO's closed with a random posse of fellow barcrawlers. I am still friends with some of them....prison pen pals, sure, but they are nice folks.
• The R Bar back when it is was dirty and real and a 50/50 chance the bathroom was functional (as well as a bartender named Suzie....yikes.)
• Zebra Down Below and a drink innocently named "Liquid Cocaine". It was served in a small pitcher loaded with ice and it lived up to the name. My liver has PTSD.
• Shooting gophers at the "end of the road" off of Ravalli at a buddy's house he rented with 4 other jokers (we used a pellet gun, because safety matters.)
• Going to about 30 parties at that big white house off of West Lincoln St. not too far from Granny's Donuts. I watched a guy once stumble his way from the keg down the hall and then puke INTO a giant hole in the sheetrock in the wall. Resale value cha-ching!
• Skiing Bridger Bowl on a powder day and still be able to park in Lot A and almost get first chair.
• Ice climbing in Hyalite when the road wasn't plowed, you were going to get stuck or help someone else get unstuck, and you might see 5 or 6 other people all day.
• Fishbowls at Black Angus on Main St. (Long gone now). If you know, you know.

After reading through that, it becomes obvious I enjoyed drinking and there are likely 100 stories like it from countless other great places that are getting overrun or "loved to death" by the influx of outsiders. I am very curious to hear the opinion of my son (a 5th grader now and a true Bozeman 'local') in 10 or 20 years.

View attachment 261629

All of that brings back lots of memories. Dan Maguire and Charlie often working at the R-bar. Glen Kautz made killer fishbowls at the Angus before going to the Bay. And KO would smoke anyone that wanted to take him on in foosball.

 

[Point Creep]

All of that brings back lots of memories. Dan Maguire and Charlie often working at the R-bar. Glen Kautz made killer fishbowls at the Angus before going to the Bay. And KO would smoke anyone that wanted to take him on in foosball.

I was college buddies with Slade, the R-Bar bartender back then. I went to a bar 2 years ago in Red Lodge - Charlie was behind the bar running that place now. The snow creek saloon.

 

[sacountry]

I was college buddies with Slade, the R-Bar bartender back then. I went to a bar 2 years ago in Red Lodge - Charlie was behind the bar running that place now. The snow creek saloon.

About 23 years ago some guy put together a 2 CD set of all the most played songs off the R-Bar Jukebox from those 80's and 90's years. Here's the artwork. It's pretty cool....

 

[shrapnel]

Born and raised in Bozeman, it is hard to see what it is, compared to what it was in the 1960’s. When I was a kid, they built the Buttreys shopping center where Harbor Freight is now. My dad got us all in the car and drove out to see the new development.

We lived on North 4th and just across Peach street was Westlake’s dairy and anything north of that was all agricultural ground, clear to the base of the Bridgers.

When we got to the new Buttreys site, my dad said “Who the Hell is going to drive clear out here to buy their groceries?”

Bozeman has grown tremendously since then, it has lost all the charm it had that attracted all those people to move here. Bozeman is not without it’s charm still, as many keep coming for what Bozeman and Montana have to offer.

When I was a kid, in social studies as we learned about Montana, it was referred to as “The Treasure State” as we had tons of natural resources and agriculture to make Montana one of the most economically sound states in America.

That all changed as they made Montana “Big Sky Country” as Chet Huntley and others did everything they could to promote tourism and scenic resorts. Bozeman isn’t alone in the destructive results of people that move here to get away from where they come from. Hell, we did the same thing to the Indians just 170 years ago.

Being retired, I avoid Bozeman and go to the bank and post office in Belgrade. Whenever I do go to Bozeman, I can’t keep up with the construction and continual change that is shaping it into a place I hardly recognize…

 

[SixPoint]

These figures don’t seem possible but holy cow is it gross. And I thought a river runs through it was a disaster.

https://www.kpax.com/news/montana-news/study-yellowstone-brings-2m-tourists-big-money-to-montana

“

• $376 million in income received by Montana households.
• roughly $1.1 billion in output, or gross receipts, of Montana business and nonbusiness organizations.
• 2.1 million visitors to Montana in 2021 whose decision to visit was the result of the show.”

 

[bigsky2]

About 23 years ago some guy put together a 2 CD set of all the most played songs off the R-Bar Jukebox from those 80's and 90's years. Here's the artwork. It's pretty cool....

View attachment 261825View attachment 261826View attachment 261832

Only been in there a couple times and the music they play now made me leave pretty quickly every time. It looks like I would have actually enjoyed the place back then based on that list of most played music.

 

[sacountry]

Born and raised in Bozeman, it is hard to see what it is, compared to what it was in the 1960’s. When I was a kid, they built the Buttreys shopping center where Harbor Freight is now. My dad got us all in the car and drove out to see the new development.

We lived on North 4th and just across Peach street was Westlake’s dairy and anything north of that was all agricultural ground, clear to the base of the Bridgers.

When we got to the new Buttreys site, my dad said “Who the Hell is going to drive clear out here to buy their groceries?”

Bozeman has grown tremendously since then, it has lost all the charm it had that attracted all those people to move here. Bozeman is not without it’s charm still, as many keep coming for what Bozeman and Montana have to offer.

When I was a kid, in social studies as we learned about Montana, it was referred to as “The Treasure State” as we had tons of natural resources and agriculture to make Montana one of the most economically sound states in America.

That all changed as they made Montana “Big Sky Country” as Chet Huntley and others did everything they could to promote tourism and scenic resorts. Bozeman isn’t alone in the destructive results of people that move here to get away from where they come from. Hell, we did the same thing to the Indians just 170 years ago.

Being retired, I avoid Bozeman and go to the bank and post office in Belgrade. Whenever I do go to Bozeman, I can’t keep up with the construction and continual change that is shaping it into a place I hardly recognize…

I would have liked your Bozeman. @antlerradar you're being promoted from regional Tourism Director to State Tourism Director.

 

[Mackay Sagebrush]

Can you elaborate your idea of a weirdo?
My memories of that time period don't recall a disturbing element. Populace made up mostly of ranching/agriculture/ working class/ University people with a really cool sub culture of hunting fanatics and outdoor people.

I recall when the Rockin R Bar went from being a bar that was full of rednecks and college age cowboys, to a friggin sports bar. I used to college rodeo (riding bucking horses) and stopping in at the Crystal, the Cats Paw, the R Bar and VFW was all in a good night in Bozeman in the 90s.

Lots of cowgirls and buckle bunnies. It has changed so dramatically in the last 25-30 years that it is not even the same place. It seems like every time I drive through, heading for other places, I see a bunch of hipsters everywhere. Better than 50% have to have a $300 daypack on, complete with carabiners. It is like a uniform. They all want to be different, so they end up looking the same.

Frankly I would rather hang out with the "dirtbag loggers, ranch hands, ag/farm workers" and other low rent natives that grew up in places like on the Hi-Line or anywhere else, than the invasive species driving their range rovers and acting like they are still back in So-Cal. Western/central Montana has changed substantially. The exact same thing that happened to Montana has happened to most of Idaho.

 

[Hem]

I recall when the Rockin R Bar went from being a bar that was full of rednecks and college age cowboys, to a friggin sports bar. I used to college rodeo (riding bucking horses) and stopping in at the Crystal, the Cats Paw, the R Bar and VFW was all in a good night in Bozeman in the 90s.

Lots of cowgirls and buckle bunnies. It has changed so dramatically in the last 25-30 years that it is not even the same place. It seems like every time I drive through, heading for other places, I see a bunch of hipsters everywhere. Better than 50% have to have a $300 daypack on, complete with carabiners. It is like a uniform. They all want to be different, so they end up looking the same.

Frankly I would rather hang out with the "dirtbag loggers, ranch hands, ag/farm workers" and other low rent natives that grew up in places like on the Hi-Line or anywhere else, than the invasive species driving their range rovers and acting like they are still back in So-Cal. Western/central Montana has changed substantially. The exact same thing that happened to Montana has happened to most of Idaho.

The original comment on "weirdos" made by the other post referred to late 80's/ early 90's. My observation was made regarding that time period.
As for now, ...I hear you, and concur.

 

[Nick87]

About 23 years ago some guy put together a 2 CD set of all the most played songs off the R-Bar Jukebox from those 80's and 90's years. Here's the artwork. It's pretty cool....

View attachment 261825View attachment 261826View attachment 261832

That's a pretty good mix of tunes.

 

[Cornbread]

I did a day trip to Bozeman when I was up elk hunting in October. No thanks. Traffic, expensive-ass decorating stores, little honeys at MSU whose rich daddy sent them there to get rid of them and it's a "cool" name with attitude. Shitty service at the one restaurant bar I ate at. Oh, did I mention the pretty boys wearing their expensive clothes and $300 backpack. A bunch of California Aholes. No thanks. Billings didn't impress me either. I thought for a second I was back in the Pittsburgh suburbs. I tried to go look for a saddle shop to see what they had. Hell the 2 places listed on white-ages.com had closed 3 to 4 years ago. And the one place I found had 25% of the saddles of my local tack shop here in Florida. White sulphur Springs was great. Nice friendly down home people. Hell, this same migration is happening in South Florida. I hate it. The should slap on a $100,000 impact tax per resident for new "resident".

 

[Point Creep]

I did a day trip to Bozeman when I was up elk hunting in October. No thanks. Traffic, expensive-ass decorating stores, little honeys at MSU whose rich daddy sent them there to get rid of them and it's a "cool" name with attitude. Shitty service at the one restaurant bar I ate at. Oh, did I mention the pretty boys wearing their expensive clothes and $300 backpack. A bunch of California Aholes. No thanks. Billings didn't impress me either. I thought for a second I was back in the Pittsburgh suburbs. I tried to go look for a saddle shop to see what they had. Hell the 2 places listed on white-ages.com had closed 3 to 4 years ago. And the one place I found had 25% of the saddles of my local tack shop here in Florida. White sulphur Springs was great. Nice friendly down home people. Hell, this same migration is happening in South Florida. I hate it. The should slap on a $100,000 impact tax per resident for new "resident".

Where about in Florida do you reside?

 

[Southern Elk]

I did a day trip to Bozeman when I was up elk hunting in October. No thanks. Traffic, expensive-ass decorating stores, little honeys at MSU whose rich daddy sent them there to get rid of them and it's a "cool" name with attitude. Shitty service at the one restaurant bar I ate at. Oh, did I mention the pretty boys wearing their expensive clothes and $300 backpack. A bunch of California Aholes. No thanks. Billings didn't impress me either. I thought for a second I was back in the Pittsburgh suburbs. I tried to go look for a saddle shop to see what they had. Hell the 2 places listed on white-ages.com had closed 3 to 4 years ago. And the one place I found had 25% of the saddles of my local tack shop here in Florida. White sulphur Springs was great. Nice friendly down home people. Hell, this same migration is happening in South Florida. I hate it. The should slap on a $100,000 impact tax per resident for new "resident".