Why my pack sucks: Kifaru, Stone Glacier, Exo, Seek, Mystery Ranch, Kuiu, etc.

[RockChucker30]

I did try out a Seek Outside pack back in 2013 when I was also looking at the Stone Glacier. I took it on one backpack hunt and one of the shoulder straps tore off when I went to put it back on the first day out after lunch. It was probably loaded with around 40 or 50 pounds max at the time and I just picked it up by one shoulder strap to put it on and the stitching on the strap just failed. I had noticed the stitching looked a little suspect when I got the pack but thought it was just looks and wouldn't affect performance. I was able to cobble things together with some extra rope and some spare buckles I happened to have with me but it was far from ideal and no way was I going to have faith in the pack after that. The fit and finish on the Seek Outside pack was no where close to the Stone Glacier and it wasn't much cheaper. It did have load lifters that could go an extra 2" higher than the Stone Glacier, but that would have been too high for normal use and I never got a chance to see if it would have actually helped or not since I was just trying to keep the pack together. The customer service was good and they did give me a full refund on the pack though.

That's the only failure like that I've heard of. Glad we took care of it for you.

For what it's worth, fit and finish and construction can be very misleading. Our lead design sewer has 40+ years experience and used to handle all of Marmot's repairs when they were still a colorado company. So our construction may not be as smooth or hidden as some brands, but that's because we try to build stronger. The packs do look a lot more refined today than they did in 2013.

 

[BluegrassBilly]

Mystery Ranch Cabinet

Bought for hauling heavy loads to enable more "backcountry" whitetail day hunts in the Appalachians, and it works well for that purpose. Even made carrying a steel climber not so bad. My only gripe is that it doesn't have a side water bottle/rifle butt sleeve or straps for securing a bow. Seems like those would have been obvious additions for a $450 pack they market for "backpack hunting." In reality, I'd call it more of a day hunting pack with extreme hauling ability, though.

 

[Jape]

You guys go slack lining together after shooting your creedmoor’s?

At first I was like, "wait a minute" and then realized I shot my bull elk last year with a 6.5 CM and hauled it out with an EXO.

For the record, I don't slack line, man buns are weird, and Ryan Callahan is a nice "fella".

 

[ida homer]

and Ryan Callahan is a nice "fella".

A nice "mug."

Haha, hey at least you got er done. Most CM's last year were used to shoot towards elk.

 

[sn.outdoors]

My current pack is a Kifaru Fulcrum w/26" tactical frame - 2 seasons, packed out 5 elk/1 moose/1 pronghorn/8 deer/2 javelina
Cons- heavy, HUGE(if you're not into that kind of thing), and expensive.

Mystery Ranch Crew Cab - 5 seasons, packed out 5 elk and 15 deer
Cons- the frame is too short to put the weight on your hips without crushing your shoulders. It's heavy. It's expensive.

Other packs I tested in the off season or used for work but decided weren't as good as the crewcab or Kifaru:
-Exo 3500 and 5500 w/K2 frame -- cons: fabric and stitching are not nearly as durable as MR or Kifaru, frame was not solid compared to the other packs either... still expensive
-MR Metcalf w/guide light frame (borrowed from a friend) -- cons: better than the crew cab as far as comfort, but not enough for me to buy one / heavy / also expensive
-Gregory Baltoro 65 -- great pack for less than 50lbs / not durable / can't carry weight comfortably
-Tactical Tailor MALICE pack -- cons: heavy, short frame, terrible waist belt, expensive
-Kuiu icon pro 5200 -- cons: stitching separation w/80lb sandbag test (not as durable as MR or Kifaru) / not comfortable with heavy weight (basically the same as the Gregory baltoro)
-Eberlestock Warhammer -- cons: short frame, heavy, useless waist belt

 

[iHunt]

I have an Eberlestock Team Elk - Biggest complaint is it's rather one dimensional - but in that dimension it is amazing. Its made to hunt, and works awesome for it! When it comes time to packing out an animal, I did pack a 2 1/2 bull rear quarter out in it on the first trip, but had some interesting strapping for the rest of my gear, and I would rather not put the quarter inside the main bag like I did for this so the weight was closer to my center of gravity. I do a lot of shed hunting, and the strapping system isn't very good for multiple antlers (whitetail) or how an elk antler hangs (with the fixed lower bar). A system that would do what I like would be a modular system, and likely cost 2-3x so ill stick with it and use a pack frame when needed!

 

[Botch]

Kifaru Woodsman, 1 season.
Kifaru Tahr 2 seasons
Kifaru mountain warrior 1 season

Love/hate the need to customize.
Packets are generally busy.

 

[LuketheDog]

Kuiu Ultra 3000, 4 seasons
MR Pintler, 2 seasons
MR Beartooth, 1 season

I kept breaking the quick release buckles on the Kuiu when cinching heavy loads and had to carry extras, otherwise I liked it. I tend to constantly lose the velcro strap retainers on my MR packs, so I have long straps flapping all over the place while I'm walking.

 

[kmott]

I love my exo 3500. should have upgraded from the cheap packs years ago. who knew?
my only issue with the exo and it is not a big deal to me is .. on the rollup part on top of the pack. it has on female snap where a male snap should have been.

I'VE no doubt exo would make it right if I contacted them but to me it's not worth the trouble. I actually didn't even notice it till my 4th trip

 

[Drewski]

Cabela's Instinct Pack-1 Season.
Pro's- Inexpensive and lots of pockets. Built in gun/bow sling.
Cons-Uncomfortable with light load after a day. Thin shoulder pads and waistbelt.

Kifaru Crater- Going on 2nd season. (1 Cow Elk)
Pro's- Great Frame and good padding on shoulders and belt. Customizable. Load shelf. Has plenty of storage. Comfortable. Well built..slid down on my rear about 400 feet with loaded pack and quarter. Also can take a 10 minute hard rain without soaking through the bag. Was surprised with a thunderstorm and had no rain cover. Nothing got wet inside the bag..Also love the xpac lid. A good waterproof lid that holds a lot of gear and helps with organization.

Cons- Pricey but worth it. Size, to big for most of my needs but that was on me for thinking I needed a big bag.

Kifaru Shape Charge-1st season- Mainly use to haul camera equipment around but will be using for day hunts in a blind or tree stand.
Pro's- Comfortable. Small and perfect for and EDC bag. Carry on friendly. Nice Pockets and organization.
Cons- None yet.

I am wishing I would have waited a little longer and bought the 44 magnum Kifaru bag this year. Seems to be more up my alley and perfect sized. The pro about that is after buying the duplex lite frame. the bags are not too expensive. Great quality and well built. Good customer service.

 

[BRP]

Badlands sacrifice- padding is too thin on shoulders. Internal frame is marginally effective. Saggy feeling when really heavy (65+lbs.)

 

[BRP]

Another Con of the badlands sacrifice is my wife keeps using it as a reason not to get another pack!

 

[Oregon_Ryan]

I currently have a MR Pop-Up 18 and just got a Pintler from the Scheel's sale (that was an unbeatable price). I've used the Pop-Up for elk / deer / bear scouting in the Coast Range this summer, but haven't gotten the Pintler out yet. For comparison, my previous packs have been either medium / large ALICE rucks or the generic semi-framed "Pack, Assault, 3 Day". Compared to the ALICE or the assault pack, the MR packs I have fit and carry weight like a dream.

Pop-Up 18:
Pro: Compact, fits me great and is very low profile when moving through brush. Also, the pack moves with me when scrambling over and under dead fall and I haven't had an issue where the pack "swings" and shifts balance when I'm scrambling. Hauls everything I need for a day in the mountains, but not enough that I weigh myself down with unnecessary items. MOLLE webbing on the waist belt makes mounting GPS holster and "forager" pockets easy. I did an 8 mile training ruck with a 40 lb bag of cat litter on the load shelf and it did great.

Con: Side "water bottle" pockets aren't that great since the side strap clips to a buckle inside the pocket, making it a little too tight to put the bottle back with the pack still on. I made that a little workable by keeping a nalgene sized steel cup in the pocket, which keeps the pocket open. The limited carrying capacity (18L) means that after loading in hydration bladder, first aid, utility kit, toilet paper, kill kit, lunch, small stove and fuel I'm pretty much maxed out, with limited room for an extra layer or even a full set of game bags. You could mitigate that by putting the extra layer and game bags in a dry sack on the meat shelf, cinched down between the pack and frame.

Overall: It's pretty much as advertised- a small day pack with good load carrying capability. It's a little undersized for late season or cold weather hunts, but you can work around that to a certain degree. It fits me well, moves with me and is pretty much what I'm looking for. The cons can be worked around with a little ingenuity.

 

[OleRedbeard]

I have had multiple packs still looking for the perfect one that does it all but have realized that it doesn't exist. I was a grunt in the USMC and had humped more miles with heavy loads than I care to remember by the age of 24. I was a connoisseur in the art of taping foam in places that needed it on the packs we used while I was in. The MOLLE packs and the FILBE packs made by Propper and I think Arcteryx seemed like the bees knees till the plastic frame broke.
First one I used after getting out other than the ones I acquired while in the service quite extensively were a couple of Kelty freighters because I could not afford anything else. They did the job but I had no clue just how much better it could get.
Experimented with various other backpacks made for backpacking and not hunting and realized that they shined in that department but sucked when it came to hauling meat.
Bought a Elberlestock (cant remember which one) and really loved it till I packed out a fall bear and realized it was terrible for heavy loads.
Sold it shortly after season closed and bought a Kuiu since it touted being light and streamlined. I really liked the pack and how comfortable it was with average weight. The frame had a little flex but it didn't seem like a big deal till I hauled out a couple of deer and a bear with it and realized that there was way too much flex in it and if you carried anything out bone in you could really feel it even if you broke it down at the sockets. Sold that pack after the season ended.
Next I bought a Kifaru. It was heavy. It was bulky and it had a ton of straps. It reminded me a lot of my packs in the military and didn't really lend itself to being a daypack very well. It did however haul heavy loads amazing and it shined in this department. What it lacked in being streamlined it more than made up for (as far as the frame went anyway) in its ability to haul heavy and not cause hot spots. Loads were easily adjustable and carried close to the back like they should have. Other than the simple fact the pack was really bulky when not hauling meat I liked it. I hauled several bear and probably a dozen or so deer out with it before some SO*^()$BiT#^% stole it along with several other things out of my tent one day. He was wearing a set of wolverine boots that is about as far as I got in finding him out since he was kind enough to leave his prints beside of my wall tent.
Next... trying to find a solution for what the Kifaru lacked I bought a Exo k2 3500. I like this pack quite a bit other than a few small things.
I don't like the small belt pouches. They are not big enough for anything ( I hear they improved them and now sell larger ones though) The pack also has zippers that are solid and well built but at times can be hard to unzip. Part of this is due to them having the rubber outer sewn into them to assist in keeping water from seeping in by way of the zippers. Its simply the nature of the beast and is a trade off when you have this particular design.
I have only hauled out a couple of deer with the Exo so far but it seems to handle a load really well. Its much stiffer than the Kuiu but not as stiff as the Kifaru.
I can say this.. Exo has amazing customer service. They are top notch and seem to really go the extra mile. I cannot comment on the others since I didn't really speak to any of them about anything other than placing the order.
I think that as far as a everything pack it simply doesn't exist for me personally and my style/area that I mostly hunt. I like the Exo since it can expand out and get me out for a 3 or 4 day trip or compress and only hold what I need for a day trip which is what most of my trips are since its simply easier to get more of these hunts in. I do a lot of walking through big timber when I hunt so its compact enough not to be getting caught on everything there is when I am trying to be quiet.
I plan on getting another heavy hauler to keep in the truck but its hard to justify a good one that you don't use as a primary that simply stays in the truck most days.
I like the idea of a modular system but it seems like you sacrifice on something when you do. A smaller pack on a large frame good for hauling makes for a bulky setup. A big pack on a small frame makes for a saggy uncomfortable load experience. An in between pack leaves you wanting one thing one day and one thing the other.
Id like to try one of the Mystery Ranch Packs or Stone Glacier soon since I have a buddy that swears by them and has put tons of miles on his Metcalf working for the Forest Service.
I wish there was a place a guy could go and test them out before he dropped the cash on one and abused it before finding out what it lacked and what it didn't.
One of these days though I'm going to find that perfect combination of what I am looking for. Something has to give sometime though because with the money I have spent and continue to spend on them I could have bought one helluva set of mules or Lamas. Heck.. maybe even a cheap milsurp helicopter.

 

[Highlands Hunter]

That's the only failure like that I've heard of. Glad we took care of it for you.

For what it's worth, fit and finish and construction can be very misleading. Our lead design sewer has 40+ years experience and used to handle all of Marmot's repairs when they were still a colorado company. So our construction may not be as smooth or hidden as some brands, but that's because we try to build stronger. The packs do look a lot more refined today than they did in 2013.

I purchased a SO Unaweep 4800 this year and the fit/finish is excellent. I used this pack on a mountain goat, mule deer, and elk hunt; packing out all 3.
1. These packs are very modular and may take a little extra time getting use to it.
2. The pack has no zipper, top load only.
3. There are a lot of straps. This allows for the modularity.
4. The dual hip belt buckles are very nice for getting the fit just right, especially when you have a load, but at times it’s annoying buckling 2.
5. The frame is 2 pieces of aluminum tubing and they connect at the bottom. Dirt can get in the connection and cause the frame to squeak when walking. Just a matter of cleaning it when you get home.
Overall the pack is lightweight, carries weight very well, frame extensions are available, waterproof, comfortable, and affordable.

 

[wolfpup]

MR Metcalf - So many straps and buckles while empty and only 1 full length zipper with the top fold access. Needs better organization inside.

 

[Firemedic92]

Outdoorsman optics hunter. Just not comfortable for me.

SO Peregrine live this pack. Very comfortable and handles loads well. Love the xpac fabric. The fabric does get a little loud when it’s really cold. Seems to be a lot of straps that’s kinda confusing until you get used to it. Seems to be a very well made pack so far.

 

[Maxxis31]

I've been through a lot of packs over the years and still haven't found one I am totally happy with. I am currently using the Kifaru UL frame with a Kuiu 5200 Icon Pro bag. So far this has been my favorite setup and I only have a couple of little issues with it see below. I just ordered a new Exo Bro bag for my Kifaru frame which I think will work out really well. I am a pocket guys so I am excited to see it's a 4800 with additional pockets for organizing gear, I also like the new exosystem for attaching the top of the bag to the frame without having to pull load lifters loose. It should be here next week sometime so I should be able to get it all switched over this winter for shed and predator hunting.

I really wish Kifaru would build a decent bag, it seems like they are trying to do their own thing with all the different crap you can attach to each pack but by the time you get all the pockets on there the pack is heavy and has way to many places to get hung up on limbs, fill with needles or fall off. Some people like just throwing all their crap at the bottom of a bag and digging it out all the time. I personally like to have my stuff organized, I use my pack a lot and like to have a spot for everything. I just wish Kifaru would try to make some of each and ditch the mix and match crap on just a couple of decent bags. They have made some definite headway in the last couple years but they start to get a decent bag then sew 5lbs of webbing to the back, just add a pocket or two and call it good. Another major problem I have with Kifaru is they seem to use the same straps to tie the bags to the frame as they do to compress the bag, this means you can't access your stuff while your packing meat without loosening your load, not all of them but 90% are designed this way. I really wish they would come up with a decent bag because I love their frame.

I really considered going with an entire exo setup but I haven't tried one yet and with all the changes every year with the frame design I assume they are addressing issues. I know the material they use on the shoulder straps is the same as what Horn Hunter used and I couldn't stand having the webbed material on the shoulders because dry pine needles would get stuck in the little holes and they were a PITA to dig out so I was constantly having needles poke me in the back. With the Kifaru material that is a non-issue, I noticed that Exo switched materials on their hip belt, I really hope they follow suit on their shoulder straps as well.

Sitka Flash 20, great daypack, wore this pack for a couple of years,
pro's;
lightweight
great organization
comfortable

con's;
Small
cannot carry much weight
uncomfortable with much weight
not durable (sitka replaced it for me after the hip belt wore through)

Sitka Bivy 30, also a good daypack, very organized
Pro's;
Organized well
comes with rain cover
comes with sitting pad
Light weight
Breathes well and Comfortable for day hunts

Con's;
Cannot Carry a load well
Hip Belt is too thin
hard to clean
Expensive for just a day pack

Horn Hunter Full Curl System, used for a couple years, Hard to beat for a budget pack.

Pro's
Inexpensive for a frame pack
Hauls weight pretty well
Cool Design with sewn-on batwings
Can be used as daypack easily
Hauls meat on the stand-alone frame so no bloody bag

Con's
Bulky when additional packs are added
Heavy and Large when fully loaded
Isn't as comfortable under really heavy loads as Higher End packs
Small Hip Pockets that are fixed in position.

Kifaru Timberline 2 (not duplex)

Pro's
Comfortable
Decent pocket layout
Decent Price if found used
Stuffs down for a daypack nicely
Hauls a load comfortably

Con's
Have to carry meat inside of the main bag (big con for me and the reason I sold it)
Fixed layout design
Not as rigged as the newer style frames

Kifaru UL frame (with Grab it)

Pro's
Super comfortable
Very Adjustable
Hauls a heavy 100lb+ load very comfortably
Very customizable
Rigged and can be used stand-alone
It can be adapted to other bags easily
Works stand alone with hip pouches and Grab it for additional trips for quarters.

Con's
Durability? Had to send it in once for a belt repair
Not really any other cons and the belt has been great since repaired but it did have stitching come apart on it.

Kifaru Nomad Bag
Pro's
Allows use of other bags in between
Small and Light
Attaches to frame well

Con's
Horrible Design, cannot sandwich gear or meat without crushing everything in the bag.
Outer Pockets filled easily with debris since they were open-top, gear also got wet, pretty much useless
Had to empty entire side to get to gear near the bottom
I really don't have much good to say about the Original Nomad bag, I had high hopes after using the batwings on the HHFC system, but hated it from day one, they ended up discounting and redesigning them in short order.

Kuiu Icon Pro 5200 (Bag Only)
Pro's
Very organized
Folds down to daypack size easily
Lightweight
Well thought out design
Built-in weapon carrier
Lots of attachments on back
Fits Kifaru frame with very little modification

Con's
Original zipper design on the main pocket is dumb, you have to unzip from the bag from the bottom to top. I pulled and flipped the zippers so you can enter top first like a horseshoe. Make it really nice and functional, the two zippers meet at the very top center instead of on either bottom corner.
Too much material and cord around snow collar
Bag attaches to frame weird
The lid is huge and flops around when full or empty, the only time it's really usable is during times when your filling everything fully and need the extra space.
You lose access to a lot of the availible pockets when in daypack mode


Kuiu Icon Pro 1800 (Bag Only)
Pro's
Very organized
Folds down to daypack size easily
Lightweight
Well thought out design
Fits Kifaru frame with very little modification

Con's
Too Small even for me for shed hunting I just couldn't get enough in it

 

[Deleted member 16014]

One thing I've learned from this thread is that the hunting backpack business is doing pretty well! You're just not a cutting edge dude anymore if you're lugging around an MR NICE frame. Lots has changed in the last 10 years.

 

[wyoboypt]

I've been through a lot of packs over the years and still haven't found one I am totally happy with. I am currently using the Kifaru UL frame with a Kuiu 5200 Icon Pro bag. So far this has been my favorite setup and I only have a couple of little issues with it see below. I just ordered a new Exo Bro bag for my Kifaru frame which I think will work out really well. I am a pocket guys so I am excited to see it's a 4800 with additional pockets for organizing gear, I also like the new exosystem for attaching the top of the bag to the frame without having to pull load lifters loose. It should be here next week sometime so I should be able to get it all switched over this winter for shed and predator hunting.

I really wish Kifaru would build a decent bag, it seems like they are trying to do their own thing with all the different crap you can attach to each pack but by the time you get all the pockets on there the pack is heavy and has way to many places to get hung up on limbs, fill with needles or fall off. Some people like just throwing all their crap at the bottom of a bag and digging it out all the time. I personally like to have my stuff organized, I use my pack a lot and like to have a spot for everything. I just wish Kifaru would try to make some of each and ditch the mix and match crap on just a couple of decent bags. They have made some definite headway in the last couple years but they start to get a decent bag then sew 5lbs of webbing to the back, just add a pocket or two and call it good. Another major problem I have with Kifaru is they seem to use the same straps to tie the bags to the frame as they do to compress the bag, this means you can't access your stuff while your packing meat without loosening your load, not all of them but 90% are designed this way. I really wish they would come up with a decent bag because I love their frame.

I really considered going with an entire exo setup but I haven't tried one yet and with all the changes every year with the frame design I assume they are addressing issues. I know the material they use on the shoulder straps is the same as what Horn Hunter used and I couldn't stand having the webbed material on the shoulders because dry pine needles would get stuck in the little holes and they were a PITA to dig out so I was constantly having needles poke me in the back. With the Kifaru material that is a non-issue, I noticed that Exo switched materials on their hip belt, I really hope they follow suit on their shoulder straps as well.

Sitka Flash 20, great daypack, wore this pack for a couple of years,
pro's;
lightweight
great organization
comfortable

con's;
Small
cannot carry much weight
uncomfortable with much weight
not durable (sitka replaced it for me after the hip belt wore through)

Sitka Bivy 30, also a good daypack, very organized
Pro's;
Organized well
comes with rain cover
comes with sitting pad
Light weight
Breathes well and Comfortable for day hunts

Con's;
Cannot Carry a load well
Hip Belt is too thin
hard to clean
Expensive for just a day pack

Horn Hunter Full Curl System, used for a couple years, Hard to beat for a budget pack.

Pro's
Inexpensive for a frame pack
Hauls weight pretty well
Cool Design with sewn-on batwings
Can be used as daypack easily
Hauls meat on the stand-alone frame so no bloody bag

Con's
Bulky when additional packs are added
Heavy and Large when fully loaded
Isn't as comfortable under really heavy loads as Higher End packs
Small Hip Pockets that are fixed in position.

Kifaru Timberline 2 (not duplex)

Pro's
Comfortable
Decent pocket layout
Decent Price if found used
Stuffs down for a daypack nicely
Hauls a load comfortably

Con's
Have to carry meat inside of the main bag (big con for me and the reason I sold it)
Fixed layout design
Not as rigged as the newer style frames

Kifaru UL frame (with Grab it)

Pro's
Super comfortable
Very Adjustable
Hauls a heavy 100lb+ load very comfortably
Very customizable
Rigged and can be used stand-alone
It can be adapted to other bags easily
Works stand alone with hip pouches and Grab it for additional trips for quarters.

Con's
Durability? Had to send it in once for a belt repair
Not really any other cons and the belt has been great since repaired but it did have stitching come apart on it.

Kifaru Nomad Bag
Pro's
Allows use of other bags in between
Small and Light
Attaches to frame well

Con's
Horrible Design, cannot sandwich gear or meat without crushing everything in the bag.
Outer Pockets filled easily with debris since they were open-top, gear also got wet, pretty much useless
Had to empty entire side to get to gear near the bottom
I really don't have much good to say about the Original Nomad bag, I had high hopes after using the batwings on the HHFC system, but hated it from day one, they ended up discounting and redesigning them in short order.

Kuiu Icon Pro 5200 (Bag Only)
Pro's
Very organized
Folds down to daypack size easily
Lightweight
Well thought out design
Built-in weapon carrier
Lots of attachments on back
Fits Kifaru frame with very little modification

Con's
Original zipper design on the main pocket is dumb, you have to unzip from the bag from the bottom to top. I pulled and flipped the zippers so you can enter top first like a horseshoe. Make it really nice and functional, the two zippers meet at the very top center instead of on either bottom corner.
Too much material and cord around snow collar
Bag attaches to frame weird
The lid is huge and flops around when full or empty, the only time it's really usable is during times when your filling everything fully and need the extra space.
You lose access to a lot of the availible pockets when in daypack mode


Kuiu Icon Pro 1800 (Bag Only)
Pro's
Very organized
Folds down to daypack size easily
Lightweight
Well thought out design
Fits Kifaru frame with very little modification

Con's
Too Small even for me for shed hunting I just couldn't get enough in it

I feel like you should try a tactical frame with a guide lid, then use a big duffel for when you’re packing camp in ect. It’s way lighter, and more simple, and you can always access your necessities in the guide lid. Mine holds my water bladder and complete down gear and rain gear. I just attached a pouch for food on the back of that. Bags are just too heavy to be lugging around. Here’s my whole whitetail and camp on a tactical with the guide lid on top as always,
Bottom line is- if you want to save weight, you can’t be a pocket guy, unless it’s a 1 pocket guy