When Hunting became shooting.

[The Hedgehog]

I didn't miss it at all. It's a good point. Now back to my question.. 5 yards, longbow, cedar shaft, obsidian tip, feathers and fingers, treestand whitetail buck on a milk river lease with his head in some spilt apples. More of a hunt than that of a deer/elk on usfs/wilderness, afar from vehicle access, where the guy has a backpack, spotter, 300 mag with a turret? Because the 2nd scenario is so easy right?

Genes a good guy I'm sure. I've met him. Lots of great traditional Bowhunters out there too. But the whole eletitist thing many of them project is a complete joke.

Shooting is part if hunting. Always will be unless you don't take bullets or arrows along.

 

[The Hedgehog]

By the way- genes 1st book was my bible growing up. We used to be pen pals when I was a youth and he came out to visit me when growing up. I gave him a shed to a deer he killed near my parents place in about 1980. The guy is smart - and probably has forgotton more about whitetails than most experts will ever know. That said, he doesn't know shit if he thinks toting a long range rifle is just "shooting."

 

[dustinf]

...stickbow guys on a 3d shoot, every target takes 15 minutes while they dig in the leaves for their arrows.

Yet another reason I use lumenocks...

 

[Bambistew]

IMO, hunting became shooing when the meat was no longer really needed to "make it through the winter."

Face it, hunting is a dick measuring contest, no matter what user group you talk to. If it wasn't they why does every group have their own record book?

Worrying if someone else is hunting the "right way" is just going to piss you off. Hunting is personal, as it should be. If you want to bow hunt, fine. If you want to shoot long range, fine. You want to hunt over a pile of bait, fine. Just don't compare yourself to someone else and belittle them for it.

I think a lot of us get more out of hunting than killing.

I've met the Wensels a few times, seem like great guys, and funny as hell. They're no better than the rest of us though. They're hung up on shooting really big deer, and like to do it with long bows. Big deal... They spend countless days doing so. Having an unlimited time to hunt is definitely an advantage to them, much more over what weapon they use IMO. Also having a chit load of private land managed for big deer is a pretty big advantage to them as well. They're so hung up in the pursuit of big deer that they moved to IA just so they could hunt/kill big deer. I mean if it was just about the hunt, why didn't they keep hunting the Milk River???

This rant is akin to the catch and release fly fishing crowd...

Bowupity is perfectly coined.

 

[sagebrush]

If people want to get all bowuppity on themselves, more power to them. Anyone that uses something other than a weapon system they made from scratch, including the tools and materials, shouldn't be looking down their nose at another's choices. If hunting is generating so much angst in your life, sell your stuff and leave the tags to those of us that still get pleasure from it. Trust me, the youth without a moral compass or civic virtue are not going to read an article, or a post on a website, regarding relative ethics and have an epiphany. Can I have my two minutes back now?

 

[JohnCushman]

Bababooey

 

[idnative1948]

Whoa Nellie! err Matt..
I think you took my comment completely wrong and too bad you did. I will be the first to admit that my generation hasn't done our country any favors in some areas. Sorry, I made you get your panties in a wad and ruined your day.

If you read the article it says the downturn started about 20 years ago. It really bothers me when the "older generation" blames the younger generations for everything. I bet 20 years ago you were the "youngsters" raising your kids and here we are now with problems (if you even believe there are problems now). Like the previous poster said, the Wensels have benefited, but its time for everybody to look in the mirror, regardless of where you are in life. And there's no need to blame one group or generation of people over the other, we all have a role in it.

Matt

 

[HSi-ESi]

I do think that the economics and practices of the 'Hunting Industry' has moved the 'public perception' of hunting. I think that the article portrayed that well.

I think it would be tough if my pay-check was coming from the hunting industry. The companies that sponsor or place advertisements on the web/shows/magazines have a vested interest in making money. By taking their money you are in the least promoting the culture that has moved the baseline of how we are perceived.

It is a fine line that folks in the hunting industry walk. I do appreciate OYOA and Meat-eater for the ethics that they follow, which is why I like to follow them. Some of the others - I don't follow because I don't agree with message they are putting out. They are free to do that, just not my cup of tea.

Just because we don't hear of the kids running through the woods, learning good woodsmanship and ethics doesn't mean they don't exist anymore. I was one of those in the early 80's - and my kids will be those in the short years to come- I have made choices and sacrifices so that they will have that opportunity. That message just doesn't sell from a marketing standpoint.

I've fought some of the 'hunting industry' ethics in my own life. I have family members and friends involved in it. I seriously thought about going down that career road after college. I didn't for one main reason: I didn't want my paycheck to be married to something I love so deeply.

I know that seems ironic - you are supposed to love what you do - right? What happens if you are short of cash with a mortgage looming and Company A says, I'll pay you $$$ to be on this ad. Do I take it since I need to pay a bill, even though I think their product is a piece of crap?

We all play into the gear (hell, I have a MR Crew Cab, Swaro bino's, Leice Rangefinder, tons of hunting clothes, guns, bows, reloading, sleeping bags, tents, etc). And I do use them all the time. Do I need them to be a better hunter? No.

I shoot just as many elk every year now as I did when I was 20, hunting with my Browning BLR-81 in .308, $5 dollar bino's running around in jean's, Army-Navy boots and tons of cotton. I love it just as much now as I did then. I don't spend as many days afield as I used to, but I have a family and serious job to look after first. When I am in the mountains - it is my time. I don't have to share with anyone else. To me, that is worth more than any amount of money I could be paid.

 

[IsThisHeaven?]

Whoa Nellie! err Matt..
I think you took my comment completely wrong and too bad you did. I will be the first to admit that my generation hasn't done our country any favors in some areas. Sorry, I made you get your panties in a wad and ruined your day.

No need to apologize. I'm sorry if I mistook your comment. You didn't ruin my day.

Matt

 

[Big Fin]

IMO, hunting became shooing when the meat was no longer really needed to "make it through the winter."

...............................................................

Worrying if someone else is hunting the "right way" is just going to piss you off. Hunting is personal, as it should be. If you want to bow hunt, fine. If you want to shoot long range, fine. You want to hunt over a pile of bait, fine. Just don't compare yourself to someone else and belittle them for it.

I think a lot of us get more out of hunting than killing.

...................................

This rant is akin to the catch and release fly fishing crowd...

Bowupity is perfectly coined.

^^ What he said, X 2.

 

[idnative1948]

X3
Spending time with dads, brothers, sisters, grandkids is what it is about. But, I still want my grandkids to learn to hunt and get close enough to put one down with the 30-30 I was given when I was old enough to hunt. Therefore my rant on hunting vs shooting. You may not always have the luxury of having a $$$$ rifle in your hands with a $$$$ scope only to find out you are stuck in a H-hole full of blow down and brush with a hi power and not being able to take a shot without knowing you can put the animal down where it stands. I would just like them to learn the odds before they pull the trigger. Old guy talking? Yes.
But, I grew up meat hunting with dad, his brothers and my cousins. Granted I would love to make the perfect 500 yd kill, but at my age I know my limitations and am comfortable because that is how I was taught. They are one of god's creatures and you WILL do your very best as a hunter to keep it from suffering.

 

[The Hedgehog]

Back in the "Golden Years" of hunting, when it was howdy doody and mr Ed on TV, snowshoes were wood, and bowhunting was real... Hilarious stuff right there. I'd pay good money for a Pay per view program starring Gene Wensel & Chris Brackett on bowhunting. Now that would kick ass... BooYah!

 

[RobG]

Seems like the same old whine about how technology will ruin hunting. Imagine what the Indian curmudgeons said when their grandkids used iron instead or flint arrowheads. It's been a slippery slope ever since the atalatl.

 

[katqanna]

It's been a slippery slope ever since the atalatl.

Rob, lmao (well I dont know if that is really possible). I might just have to wood burn that quote onto one of my paleo tools. ;P

 

[Big Fin]

Seems like the same old whine about how technology will ruin hunting. Imagine what the Indian curmudgeons said when their grandkids used iron instead or flint arrowheads. It's been a slippery slope ever since the atalatl.

If you don't think that's funny, then get the heck outta here.

 

[RobG]

Rob, lmao (well I dont know if that is really possible). I might just have to wood burn that quote onto one of my paleo tools. ;P

After I wrote that it occurred to me that my elk hunting rifle, which belonged to my grandpa, is older than the author. If the author thinks he came from a generation of noble hunters it is only because he doesn't know the stories that rifle could tell!

 

[noharleyyet]

seems like the same old whine about how technology will ruin hunting. Imagine what the indian curmudgeons said when their grandkids used iron instead or flint arrowheads. It's been a slippery slope ever since the atalatl.

....like

 

[idnative1948]

Anybody ever flung, flang, flicked, flogged, launched an atlatl? They can be wicked once you have figured them out.Was one of my Boy Scout projects growing up until a buddy ran out to pick up my spear, stepped on it and snapped it.Never did find a spear as straight. Just have to remember how to load it if not really straight spear.Just trying to imagine killing something with it was enough for me.

 

[Devil Diver Down]

IMO, hunting became shooing when the meat was no longer really needed to "make it through the winter."

Face it, hunting is a dick measuring contest, no matter what user group you talk to. If it wasn't they why does every group have their own record book?

Worrying if someone else is hunting the "right way" is just going to piss you off. Hunting is personal, as it should be. If you want to bow hunt, fine. If you want to shoot long range, fine. You want to hunt over a pile of bait, fine. Just don't compare yourself to someone else and belittle them for it.

I think a lot of us get more out of hunting than killing.

I've met the Wensels a few times, seem like great guys, and funny as hell. They're no better than the rest of us though. They're hung up on shooting really big deer, and like to do it with long bows. Big deal... They spend countless days doing so. Having an unlimited time to hunt is definitely an advantage to them, much more over what weapon they use IMO. Also having a chit load of private land managed for big deer is a pretty big advantage to them as well. They're so hung up in the pursuit of big deer that they moved to IA just so they could hunt/kill big deer. I mean if it was just about the hunt, why didn't they keep hunting the Milk River???

This rant is akin to the catch and release fly fishing crowd...

Bowupity is perfectly coined.

Nailed that one Bambi... right up to the part about catch & release. I'm no snob, but I don't see any harm in conserving the resource and encourage others to do the same. As you posted, the meat's no longer needed to get us through the winter. Different conversation for a different time, I suspect.

 

[Biscuit Hunter]

.......