What if there were no point schemes?

[madtom]

My statement still holds true though, there is plenty of trophy hunting in non GMU states

You've said this twice and still haven't given an example. What whitetail state can I go buy a tag at the gas station and shoot a booner on public land in any corner of the state I choose? Because I'd like to go there.

 

[BrentD]

You've said this twice and still haven't given an example. What whitetail state can I go buy a tag at the gas station and shoot a booner on public land in any corner of the state I choose? Because I'd like to go there.

It works for Iowa. If you are a resident anyway. I don't know what NRs go through.

You should probably move here.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Freedom is not coming back, just the way it works. That is why I am so resistant to limiting OTC elk opportunity here in CO. I lived in Utah for a few years where there is not much opportunity, it sucked, at least for me. I am fine with limited units if it is biologically required, but when people start proposing more limited bull elk units in CO I get concerned. When you go from being able to hunt bulls in much of western CO one year to realizing the only elk tag you can get the next year in UT is a spike tag, crowded OTC units in CO don’t seem all that bad.

I definitely see your point, but how to you combat social media wrecking units, i.e. top rut odds show X unit had great harvest rates in 2018, or eastmans publishes an article, etc. and then in 2019 that unit has 3x as many archers. The current systems allows for a massive over harvest in archery season, and because the state has a shit system for hunter surveys it's hard for them to even see it happening. (Obviously this is hyperbolic)

I think a good option would be to keep OTC archery and rifle, but you have to pick a unit when you get a tag, and there is a floating cap set at 10% of 5 year average, so that no one unit can get totally pounded in any particular year.

^ This issue aside, the fact that their isn't mandatory reporting in every western state just blows my mind, it would be so easy to implement, seems like a major missed opportunity to collect data.

 

[bushman13]

Neither of us specified Public Land during our GMU statements.

You've said this twice and still haven't given an example. What whitetail state can I go buy a tag at the gas station and shoot a booner on public land in any corner of the state I choose? Because I'd like to go there.

 

[madtom]

It works for Iowa. If you are a resident anyway. I don't know what NRs go through.

You should probably move here.

Lived there for 24 years.

NR have GMUs

It’s 95%+ private, so is largely managed without the need for GMUs anyway...

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

You've said this twice and still haven't given an example. What whitetail state can I go buy a tag at the gas station and shoot a booner a deer on public land in any corner of the state I choose? Because I'd like to go there.

Montana

 

[BrentD]

Lived there for 24 years.

NR have GMUs

It’s 95%+ private, so is largely managed without the need for GMUs anyway...

Well come back, because as a resident you can hunt public land all over the state on one tag, and booner are out there. It meets your stated requirements.

 

[madtom]

Neither of us specified Public Land during our GMU statements.

You were saying how the west has so much public and we don’t need to manage where people hunt because all the whitetail states don’t (but they do, either with GMUs, land ownership, or both).

We aren’t on different pages. We’re reading different books.

 

[madtom]

Montana

Has GMUs (some quota, some general), and NR have to draw tags (to my understanding)

 

[madtom]

Well come back, because as a resident you can hunt public land all over the state on one tag, and booner are out there. It meets your stated requirements.

Not windy enough and too many relatives there.

I’d rather hunt elk even though the gosh darn state tells me when and where I legally can. Somehow there’s always still been elk in my freezer when the season is done.

 

[bushman13]

I believe statewide herd management is possible, using a random draw with a specific number for allocation. I also believe the age class can be managed as well, with antler restrictions.

You were saying how the west has so much public and we don’t need to manage where people hunt because all the whitetail states don’t (but they do, either with GMUs, land ownership, or both).

We aren’t on different pages. We’re reading different books.

 

[madtom]

I believe statewide herd management is possible, using a random draw with a specific number for allocation. I also believe the age class can be managed as well, with antler restrictions.

I would venture to guess that the overwhelming majority of big game managers in the country would disagree with you, but that’s an entirely different discussion than the preference point debate that started the thread.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Has GMUs (some quota, some general), and NR have to draw tags (to my understanding)

There are no whitetail permit hunts in MT you can hang your deer tag on any whitetail in the state. The season dates vary a little bit in a few regions.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

I also believe the age class can be managed as well, with antler restrictions.

Bring up the deer antler restriction in CO and be prepared for an earful... managing by quota in small geographic areas has proved to be the best method of improving age class (hence why it was mostly rolled back across the state).

 

[madtom]

There are no whitetail permit hunts in MT you can hang your deer tag on any whitetail in the state. The season dates vary a little bit in a few regions.

That's pretty sweet. I assume you still have to draw the deer combo license, which isn't always guaranteed? Still a crazy lot of opportunity once you have the tag though.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

That's pretty sweet. I assume you still have to draw the deer combo license, which isn't always guaranteed? Still a crazy lot of opportunity once you have the tag though.

Right! and yeah you have to draw the combo.

 

[----]

There are no whitetail permit hunts in MT you can hang your deer tag on any whitetail in the state. The season dates vary a little bit in a few regions.

This is not true. The VAST majority of units are open for whitetail, but not all.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

This is not true. The VAST majority of units are open for whitetail, but not all.

Which unit? I checked the regs just now and couldn't find one, the 2019 permit application packet only uses the word "white-tailed" once for unit 455-60 but only for rifle season. Is there a unit that is completely draw?

 

[----]

Which unit? I checked the regs just now and couldn't find one, the 2019 permit application packet only uses the word "white-tailed" once for unit 455-60 but only for rifle season. Is there a unit that is completely draw?

I assumed we were talking rifle hunting, my bad.

 

[BrentD]

Not windy enough and too many relatives there.

I’d rather hunt elk even though the gosh darn state tells me when and where I legally can. Somehow there’s always still been elk in my freezer when the season is done.

We have been hitting 40 mph with sustained regularity. And 60 mph is pretty frequent. Do you really need more?

All those relatives can help you get access to private and you can always go hunt elk in Wyoming - which BuzzH tells us is just a screamin' good deal for NR's.

I don't see any down side for ya.