Silencers/Suppressors legal for hunting.....

[wingman1]

Was the suppressor legal? Serious question. 19k for the poached animals seems cheap but 20 years sounds like an NFA violation.

Were the clients araigned as well?

Man you beat me to It. I was going to say " you proved your point with your post" legal or not poachers do what they want. They are poachers.

 

[Big Fin]

Exactly my point.

What exactly is your point? Guess I missed it, being I wasn't weighing in one way or the other on this thread.

Everyone has their own agenda.

But, I think I get your point about "Everyone has their own agenda." You do a good job of making that very obvious. Thanks for your efforts to do so.

So your not going to help me with this idea.

Hell yes, I will help you with that idea. Let's just add my riders about fixed wing aircraft to the bill, so it is something we can both find useful. That a deal, or is this idea all about "agendas?"

Hope you don't cry when I go by you at devils elbow headed to the wilderness areas in a 42 ' trawler with a 25 ' skiff in tow. I think its just a coincidence. Ive been waiting to do this for five years.

Cry? - No crying on my end. Life’s too short to cry and whine. I leave that to the “little minds.”

Enough crying comes from those who think they own every piece of public land they ever stepped foot on and do their best to claim it as their own. More than enough crying comes from those types, so no need for anyone else to cry.

Should have seen these two cry babies I ran into last year on a Montana elk hunt. Claimed they had been hunting there for years, so they decided to plop down right in front of us on opening morning. Given how much they whined and moaned, it was easier to pack up and hike a couple miles further away from our camp and let them have "Their spot."

Funny as hell, I tell ya. Funny as hell. I just watched a first draft of that show. The best part is that all the whining and crying is going to make for one hell of a storyline to a public land TV show. I almost need to thank those guys, even if they did cry about us being there.

So, no crying for me.

Plenty of room near Devil's Elbow for lots of bear hunters up on Kuiu and Kupreanof, unless of course, some unsuspecting public land hunter happens to step on some turf that the cry baby types you refer to in your post may have previously hunted. I probably better know which of that public land the cry baby types have hunted in the past, so I don’t interfere with “their spots?”

Good luck with that hunt. If you have been waiting for five years, you have wasted a few seasons. Next year will be draw only for self-guided bear hunting up there. Hope you find a big one.

Do you want the exact time of when I am going to be there and the exact locations I will be glassing? Imagine if we were to bump into each other out there and some cry baby decided to come and set up in front of you and I, just like some cry babies did on my MT elk hunt last year.

I like the coincidences of where you will be hunting. Looks like we might get to share some more pleasantries. Hope you are as excited as I am.

You already have the coords of where I will be elk hunting in MT this fall. Will be nice visiting with you there, again I suspect. Hope I don't run into some whining cry babies this time who think they own the damn place.

I mean after all, it is public land. I am more than willing to share, but some guys can get pretty damn possessive about "their spot." Hope you don't run into any of those crying guys when you go in there this year. But if you do, it will add great humor to the day.

Got four other guys who are excited as hell to be joining us this year. We have booked the entire archery season with the helicopter guys. None of them are cry babies. All four are good guys and we will have a hell of a time sharing the public land with anyone else who might show up.

Hey, if you are going to get that law passed, you better hurry. Final transmittal from the legislative committees is the 24th, so you have about a week, to find a sponsor to carry your legislation.

 

[The Hedgehog]

I'm betting he's going to threaten to sue you if his face is on the episode. Best to blur it out - like some of the inner-city stars on "Cops" Should be a funny one. Will cough-silencers be illegal if this bill goes through?

 

[JASON LEE]

Did I miss anything?

 

[Dinkshooter]

Will cough-silencers be illegal if this bill goes through?

That is not funny, elk are hard enough to kill. Don't make it harder.

 

[Lawnboy]

First the cough silencer and then what next the "Butt out" tool. My hunting is ruined

 

[thecrittergitter]

Fin, you mentioned 4 that have the archery season booked in there...............i suppose that does't that count the 4 that are going with me???

Turns out i have a good friend in Lewistown that has committed to flying us in there (he knows the area well), he is going to take care of necessary permits and such.....

That is of course because only guys with planes should be able to hunt spots, not helicopters Seriously........

Its gonna be a "friendly" archery season in the middle of Montana. We are going for 12 days, how long you gonna be there?

Greenhorn, who are you riding with?

 

[thecrittergitter]

oh, and to get back on track...............supressors, well, don't really see a positive use for them. I can imagine that if they are allowable, lots of big elk will die in September illegally, lots of big bucks in november will die illegally.

You guys are right, poachers will probably poach regardless of the silencer issue, but they would have a FAR EASIER time poaching animals knowing people couldn't hear the shot!

I don't own any, never will so guess for me that this is a total azz waste of time........

 

[The Hedgehog]

Don't you never mind.. just refer to me from now on as "The Elk Shepherd" or "Bull Goal-tender"

Elk hunting is a TEAM sport.

 

[Brudno]

oh, and to get back on track...............supressors, well, don't really see a positive use for them. I can imagine that if they are allowable, lots of big elk will die in September illegally, lots of big bucks in november will die illegally.

You guys are right, poachers will probably poach regardless of the silencer issue, but they would have a FAR EASIER time poaching animals knowing people couldn't hear the shot!

I don't own any, never will so guess for me that this is a total azz waste of time........

Have you ever heard one on a 300 win mag? I bet the farm you'd hear it. A better idea would be to ban high quality optics, you ever think of the number of high dollar eye emiting scopes that provided enough light for a poacher to shoot an elk or deer on a snowy night? Or just slighty past shooting time?

Really the "I dont use one and I dont have any credible info on them, so anyone interested in the legal use of one, should pound sand" argument is really weak.

 

[tjones]

Don't you never mind.. just refer to me from now on as "The Elk Shepherd" or "Bull Goal-tender"

Elk hunting is a TEAM sport.

Damn September can't get here soon enough. I never thought of archery elk hunting as a spectator sport. I will be here in the cheap seats watching.

 

[Big Fin]

Fin, you mentioned 4 that have the archery season booked in there...............i suppose that does't that count the 4 that are going with me???

Nope, a different group.

Make sure your guy can land on that road I told you about or you will get in trouble. Not too far of a hike from there. I might leave some of our water and stuff in there for you guys. We can probably carry more weight than you.

Do you think your guy would fly us in for shed hunting? Would give you a better look around and we could probably snag some big sheds. Just not sure of the snow situation in April. Would like to be the first person in there. Easy pickens, for sure.

I have a couple friends loaded up with bonus points, so I might have them apply for rifle. I am zeroed on bonus points, so the odds of me drawing again are slim. But, I would love to go in with some other rifle hunters and help them.

We are going archery, come hell or high water. Send me a PM and we can visit on the details. I will let you know who all is coming in with us.

 

[onpoint]

yup, that explains it. after reading some of the posts in this thread, it's easy to see why of lot of the distinguished gentlemen and ladies we have introducing bills in Montana got elected......

 

[Brudno]

I dont follow your logic... so your suggesting f&g's archery season is unconstitutional? Because you can not use your rifle?

This a joke? Or are you serious?

I dont see anyone making that point.

We all recognize there are certain seasons to give animals more of an advantage and hunter more oppurtunity. i.e. Archery and Muzzeloader traditional seasons. I think we have a great responsiblity to retain the integrity and tradition of primitive seasons. To within reasonable extent. Otherwise we defeat the purpose of those season entirely.

Rifle season or any weapon seasons are clearly different with different goals. Hunter sucess rates and oppurtunity are maximized. Obviously its still hunting and it has many variables. We also of course for the big game and other desirable species set aside rules and regulations to increase hunter safety and provide an ethical hunt under what we determine to be fair chase regulations. Hence why we have laws against hunting elk with night vision scopes, planes, etc.

There is no unfair or unethical advantage associated with the use of one. It doesnt affect your ability to make a quick, clean, ethical kill. Cleary there aren't really any significant advantages to lugging one into the back country to hunt. But if someone's rrfle is tuned to shoot with one, and there willing to deal with the negative aspects of using one in the back country to harvest an animal with there tag in the any weapon or rifle season, why should anyone incriminate him. It doesnt violate or go against any or the reasons we have laws and govern our game species.

I still get the impression many think of movies and think of a whisper quiet sound exiting the barrel. When anything you would use to hunt big game, doesnt sound anything like that. It bring the shot into an area around 135-140 decibels, just on the good side of the permanent ear damage treshold. Last time I checked we all hunt with rifles that fire supersonic projectiles that create a tremendously loud sonic crack and arive at there point of impact long before a deer or elk hears it anyways. Hunting with a "silenced" weapon like a bow, doesnt give us an extra shot oppurtunity any more times than hunting with a rifle does anyways, so that agrument is blown out of the water as well.

 

[The Hedgehog]

Yes, I love technology
But not as much as you, you see
But I still love technology
Always and forever

 

[Lawnboy]

Yep that's the tool I gotta holster that slips on my belt that holds that gem. Remember what coach said "There's no I in Team."

 

[Sytes]

I follow with the understanding you do, Brundo...
My question in attempting to understand how this "constitutional infringement" relates to FWP's regulation of what may and may not be used for the purpose of hunting.
The idea - if I follow along with this discussion boils down FWP regulating what may be used - following that marker, FWP is infringing on the rights of Americans by saying they are NOT permitted to use a firearm? By requiring it as archery only?
That is what I am getting at... I believe that is a stretch... Analogy wise relating to FWP able to regulate what is used for hunting, silencer or not...

What is there reasoning behind decisions that won't allow lighted pin sights?

I can understand weight draw mins on a bow (falls back into ethical arguments)

WV, I assume it has to follow along the basis of non "natural" additions, modifications? IMO, it boils down the the primitive useable manner of a bow... if that makes sense.
Located the regs on this...

• The following are not considered a hunting bow or legal archery equipment during the Archery Only Season or in an ArchEquip Only area or hunting district:
• Crossbow.
• Any device with a gun-type stock or incorporating any device or mechanism that holds the bowstring at partial or full draw without the shooter’s muscle power.
• Any bow for which a portion of the bow’s riser (handle) or any track, trough, channel, or other device that attaches directly to the bow’s riser contacts, supports, and/or guides the arrow from a point rearward of the bow’s brace height. This is not intended to restrict the use of standard overdraw systems.
• Electronic or battery-powered devices attached to a hunting bow.
• A bow sight or arrow which uses artificial light, luminous chemicals such as tritium, or electronics.

EDIT ADDED:
Here is the firearm restrictions for hunting... Considering some may view this as infringment by restricting uses of certain types of muzzleloaders, etc... I simply do not follow the reasoning these restrictions (be it supressor or not) violate our 2nd Amendment...

Weapons Restriction Areas
• Weapons restrictions are in effect in some hunting districts. Such restrictions are stated in the license / permit description and/or with aspecific date range.
• The following equipment restrictions apply to Weapons Restriction Areas:
• Muzzleloader
• must not be capable of being loaded from the breech of the barrel;
• may not be loaded with any pre-prepared paper or metallic cartridges;
• must be charged with black powder, pyrodex, or an equivalent;
• must be ignited by a percussion, flintlock, matchlock, or wheelock mechanism;
• must be a minimum of .45 caliber;
• may have no more than two barrels; and
• must only use plain lead projectiles, not sabots or similar projectiles.
• Traditional Handguns:
• is not capable of being shoulder mounted;
• has a barrel length of less than 10 ½ inches;
• chambers only a straight wall cartridge, not originally developed for rifles.
• Shotgun:
• a shouldered, breech-loaded or muzzle-loaded firearm with a smooth bore and/or rifled barrel and/or rifled choke device designed to fire shot or slugs.

Is it an infringment on our 2nd amendment that FWP states a traditional handgun may not have a barrel length less that 10.5 inches or no shoulder mounted application? Or Muzzy's not able to use sabots? IMO, no...
2nd edit added: source - http://fwpiis.mt.gov/content/getItem.aspx?id=42208

 

[The Hedgehog]

You have a butt-out holster? Scary. I just slide several of them on my moly-webbing, next to my cough silencer and bundle of cotton plugs.

 

[Drake4]

I have a question...why would you want to use one? (The suppressor, not the butt tool..the benefits of the butt tool are obvious).

Is there a good reason to use one? Please educate me, I am willing to learn.

Onpoint..you sound like you are angry at life.

 

[Lawnboy]

Holsters the only way to role brutha. I could show a few things you know. Sorry for hyjacking the thread Drake