RMEF? Waste of money?

[Bambistew]

Can someone explain exactly how the average hunter benifits from the actions of the RMEF.

I'm kind of in the camp, that they really havn't done anything to improve elk numbers, nor have they helped with any access issues.

I know they have helped to secure quite a few conservation easements, but do you really think that helped the average hunter? Most of those places where off limits to hunting before and still are.

The elk populations seem to be in great shape and over objective in many places. Has the RMEF caused this?

 

[ARCAT]

I'm in the same camp with you. I was really involved for several years in a local chapter. It became a huge chapter against chapter competiton where dollars raised in competiton were discussed more than elk. I also didn't have the personal funds to give so that left me an outsider. Money available to donate personally was much more important than time and energy as a volunteer. It reminded me alot of SCI. A member who took a private land bull that cost 20,000 and scored 380 was held in higher esteem than a guy who went DIY and killed a 275 6x6. If you want to rise in the ranks of RMEF and become a board member or get you picture in the magazine you just need to donate alot of money.

 

[MNHunter]

IMO, RMEF is in the business of securing land for elk. Though their constituency is made up of hunters, they are not in the business of providing more hunting opportunities per se. One could argue that increased elk numbers (as a by-product of their work) should lead to increased hunting opportunities but I haven't looked at it to see if that is in fact true.

 

[Hntnhrd]

RMEF started out as great organization. Grass roots protection of elk country. It has turned into a good old boys club were a few people are making great money and they jusitfy it with "NUMBERS" of acres they have "PROTECTED".
I am a life memeber and was a committee Chairman in a state that was a good 800 miles away from the closest wild elk. When I moved to Montana I had banked enough money to take the whole fall off from work to "GOOF OFF" hunting. Since I knew a couple higher up employees and they knew I was not working I was asked to come in and help with the wharehouse during the christmas season (THEY have since outsourced the catalog and 5 people in missoula have lost their jobs). I had to go to a temp agency to apply for this job (WTF) then RMEF paid the temp agency 18.00 an hour for me and I was paid 8.25 ( Once again WTF). While I was there they fired 6 people a week before christmas that were making around 25K a year. They were in Lands and committee services departments. Two days later there was an aritcle in the missoulian that RMEF was trying to Hire a Forest Service chief that had gotten in trouble for downloading porn on his work computer. SO the money to pay this schmuck was saved by letting go the 6 other employees.
The warehouse supervisor was pretty disillusioned by the whole thing so he went on the computer and showed me the pay scale on the proposed budget. There were 6 employees Including the President making over 100,000 a year plus expense accounts. Prettty good pay for a nonprofit group that is main concern is quality elk habitat.
One day the computer tech that is on staff ( by the way there were two full time employees on the computer tech staff) came and had us overnight ship an empty cardboard box to a feild rep. His laptop wasn't working so he was to ship it back so they could fix it. It cost 32.00 to ship an empty box. That was 2 dollars more than one membership at the time. I could go on and on about what I saw during the couple months I was there.
Needless to say they will never get another penny out of me. MAybe with a new president the orgainzation may start back in the right direction. We'll see.

 

[Bambistew]

A good friend of my dads was on the MT board for quite a few years and quit last year. He couldnt' take the BS anymore.

 

[TheTone]

My membership is currently up. I plan to renew, but I also plan to include a letter about how sad their efforts in Idaho have been of late. I know some back story on why, but would rather not share it. Idaho's elk herd is still strong, but the distribution of them stinks compared to what it could or should be. There is definitely some good ole boy things with the higher ups in the org. Lower level things are pretty good from what I've seen although the chapter I dealt with the most I think just mainly had get togethers and didn't do a lot of field work, etc. Mainly just planned for an annual banquet.

 

[jmcd]

I was on a local banquet commitee several years ago. I was shocked by two things 1) how much money was raised at that single event(~$70k) and 2) the fact that that amount was about the same as the salary of the district guy (I forget his exact title) who, outside of attending one of our meetings, as near as I could tell was GROSSLY overpaid.
They definately piss away a ton of money on things that don't help their "Mission." They've done some great stuff in the past, but I'm kind of in the same boat as several of you; wondering if they are worth belonging to anymore. The problem is, I don't know of too many other conservation orgs that are much better or have done more than RMEF.

 

[Bambistew]

WOW, this is impessive. A ranch is donated to them, and they pimp it out. Nice...

http://www.rmef.org/AboutUs/TWC/Hunt/HuntRatesInfo.htm

 

[Oak]

RMEF is one of the worst-rated wildlife organizations.

http://www.charitynavigator.org/index.cfm?bay=search.summary&orgid=4406

 

[Dinkshooter]

WOW, this is impessive. A ranch is donated to them, and they pimp it out. Nice...

http://www.rmef.org/AboutUs/TWC/Hunt/HuntRatesInfo.htm

What the hell else are they suppose to do with it? Subdivide and sell ranchettes? Oh you want access for your $35 membership fee It is not like that ranch was at one time attainable to average folks. Wasn't Ross Johnson on there getting about the same for the hunts?

Big money maker letting us low budget smucks on there. $16,000 sure adds up a lot faster than $35.

I wouldn't say they were perfect, I am pretty sure their rating use to be higher. They just got rid of Dart so maybe it will turn around.

 

[Bambistew]

Uh, maybe they could open it to the public? Just a thought. Course that wouldn't fit the Elite "image" of the RMEF. Its all about the money.

I think its cheaper to hunt Turners?

I wrote them off when I found out how much the shelled out for that new headquarters building. I wonder how many 'hunts' they had to sell?

Thanks for the link Oak.

I looked at the NWTF, and just happened to notice, they started roughly the same time, and they have 'enhanced/protected' over twice as many acres... Course they don't have a high dollar bull turkey ranch to hunt either

 

[Calif. Hunter]

Yeah, they traded some ground with the state of New Mexico at the same time they got that ranch so that they could block access to a huge chunk of National Forest. You used to be able to access the NF through state land. Then the RMEF closed it off. I doubt that any more elk are there than were there before the RMEF took it over. The difference is that now you have to pay big money to get to hunt the NF that belongs to all of us. If they want to buy ranches and make them exclusive, private preserves - that is fine. I don't like them locking up large chunks of public land for the personal use of their insiders.

 

[Dinkshooter]

Its all about the money.

That is exactly correct, the ranch was donated as a way to Raise money for the org. Open to the public? And raise what? $35 and and a thank you? That pays the light bill for 1/2 a day. The goal of the organization is to raise money to pay for elky type projects...................hence it is all about the money. Maybe you can go work for the that turkey place for free for a year? Oh wait it is all about the money to you.

Again this ranch was not open to the common Joe before, why now?

Turners=Dink Ass Montana Bulls, not whopper New Mexico slammers

 

[Dinkshooter]

Yeah, they traded some ground with the state of New Mexico at the same time they got that ranch so that they could block access to a huge chunk of National Forest.

Prove it. Sounds like redneck hunting rumor mill.


Again I am not in love with them other than sending them some scratch once in a while. But I always love the internet crying about conservation Orgs boohoo.

 

[Hntnhrd]

OAk good info. & years ago they were rated as one of the best.
Notice Dart's salary was 203,000.00? I think that with all the multimillionaire members that they could put there time in if they are truley concerned about elk and elkcountry that they don't need to have a 200,000 salaried position.

As far as the double h ranch it was donated to the elk foundation in the owners will with an endowement to continue to run it. They do raffle a couple hunts for the average guy (very few). I do think they should raffle all the hunts on the place. Give every member an equal shot. And spread them throughout the banquets around the country.
It has turned into an organization that caters to it's wealthy memebers and the heck with the average elk hunter.
You should see the crap I get mailed begging for money because I am a life member. But the jokes on them I ain't got any money huh!

That new building is also a joke. The old building wasnt great but it worked. Especially for an organization that is supposed to be putting money on the ground! Oh and they sold the old building and then rented over half it back. Paying back the new buyers their investment in about 5 years. Smart money move!

 

[Oak]

Their rating did used to be higher, but generally lower than most of the bird orgs (NWTF, DU, PF, etc.) I was a bit surprised to see how low DU is now rated.

I've been a member of RMEF for several years. I'm given the membership by a family member for Christmas every year. If I didn't, I would probably still support them solely for their conservation easement efforts. I'm more concerned about mule deer than elk, but there is not a good mule deer org out there right now. I don't think the RMEF mission should be to improve access for hunters. It does rub me the wrong way to see how the good old boy network is at work with hunting rights on some of their properties. I think that anybody with a paid position with RMEF should not be elegible to hunt any property that the general public can't access. JMO

In my mind, the biggest issue facing big game in the west is development of winter range. The RMEF does enough work protecting those areas that the membership would be worth it to me.

 

[Dinkshooter]

"Bob gifted all 95,000 acres of the Double H Ranch and a $4 million endowment to the Elk Foundation. The foundation renamed the ranch the Torstenson Wildlife Center (TWC) to honor Bob’s conservation ethic and his conservation education vision".

I guess when you "DONATE" this kind of wealth, you probably get a say how it will be managed for the future. Seems fair to me.

 

[Bambistew]

It is my strong belief that our young people and future generations should have opportunities to hunt and fish in wild places, and that wise conservation and management of such places will promote the continuation of a tradition of lawful hunting and fishing which has meant so much to me.

Not many young people can afford a $16000 elk hunt.

 

[Dinkshooter]

Not many young people can afford a $16000 elk hunt.

Maybe the $16,000 will buy a 1/2 acre somewhere else where a youngin will be hunting.

 

[Calif. Hunter]

Sorry, Dinkshooter, I did not take pictures of the now-locked gate and the sign on it. Another poster on this site (Gila Monster) who is now in Iraq was almost arrested for trying to access the NF through the very same gate a few weeks after I was there. The sheriff and one of the ranch managers told him about the land swap and let him go "this time."

I'm not about to provide you with a title search.

Keep drinking the koolaid and keep sending them your money.