A podcast with Steven Rinella and the Director of MT FWP
Managing the ‘plethora of riches’ -Martha Williams on Meateater
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Irrelevant
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I'm a couple back. probably get to it over the holidays. Is it a good one?
I wouldn’t say it’s the best one but it’s not bad. It gives a bit of perspective of how FWP operates. I found parts to be a little out of touch, such as the plethora of riches comment.
I wouldn’t want her job, I know that.
No way to make everybody happy.
BuzzH
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Then don't try to...perhaps try managing by doing what's best for wildlife FIRST, via science based management.
Show some leadership instead of catering to landowners, outfitters, the legislature, etc.
Man the way she talked sounded like SHE didn’t even want her job.
They think they are using science. Multiple references are made to ‘social’ science. From the outside looking in, that brand of science seems to be given a lot of weight in her FWP.
I wonder how much is catering and how much is legislative bullying since in a lot of states the legislature actually makes the rules while G&F has more of an advisory/research and enforcement role.
I bet the legislature isn’t bullying them into trying to lower the 313/316 wolf quota to 1
My money is on social science for that one.
That law background sure seemed to help when answering some of the questions. I never did hear her actually give an answer to any of the questions asked.
I know that's Rinella's interviewing style, but it sure seemed like a puff piece with very few tough questions.
I know that's Rinella's interviewing style, but it sure seemed like a puff piece with very few tough questions.
well he's never really interviewing people so that he can ask questions like "so, now, tell me martha, how come you and your staff have decided that declaring war on ungulates is a good idea?"
that's not the point of these interviews and podcasts, nor would such questions result in anything good for any of the parties involved necessarily
that said, i feel like rinella generally asks some of the toughest questions, when compared to most hunting podcasts you listen to. he rarely beats around the bush.
that's not the point of these interviews and podcasts, nor would such questions result in anything good for any of the parties involved necessarily
that said, i feel like rinella generally asks some of the toughest questions, when compared to most hunting podcasts you listen to. he rarely beats around the bush.
Eric Albus
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Funny, the outfitters I know and associate with are all asking the Dept. for biological management of wildlife instead of social management and "hunter opportunity".
np307
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I'll admit that I'm fairly ignorant of the situation in Montana, but the context of her comment didnt shock me. Compared to when PR/DJ were enacted, I'd say we certainly do have a plethora of riches both in game and money, again comparatively speaking. That's not to say that everything is perfect, just that I felt she was comparing now to then, not now to ideal.
beginnerhunter
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Her lawspeak indicated she understands her boundaries and how to navigate those boundaries. If you read between the lines you can get a sense of how she personally feels. Its easy to say she should go in guns blazing and make decisions without consideration of the public interest, but she is still tied by the laws in the books.
In a perfect world wildlife agencies would be free to operate independently of the legislatures, as some states currently do. Then they could focus on what the science says and not worry about what Johnny Rancher told his brother/local state senator. But apparently that isn't how Montana is setup.
If Rinella went after every guest the way people wanted him to on the forums, he'd have a hard time getting people to be on his podcast. I think he's a genius the way he can gently pull information and opinions out of his guests without insulting them or putting them into a defensive posture.
In a perfect world wildlife agencies would be free to operate independently of the legislatures, as some states currently do. Then they could focus on what the science says and not worry about what Johnny Rancher told his brother/local state senator. But apparently that isn't how Montana is setup.
If Rinella went after every guest the way people wanted him to on the forums, he'd have a hard time getting people to be on his podcast. I think he's a genius the way he can gently pull information and opinions out of his guests without insulting them or putting them into a defensive posture.
BuzzH
Well-known member
I don't think anyone is asking the FWP director to go in guns blazing, just using the latitude they have would be nice. Adjusting season length, setting reasonable quotas, and using page 55 of the EMP would be a good start. I'm tired of the FWP making excuses for simply choosing NOT to manage anything.
I'm tired of people giving them a pass on the things that are in their control that they avoid. I'm not asking them to burn the house down, just to start managing based on science with the tools they have available.
The FWP doesn't even do that...and this director has taken the easy way just like the last several have.
Its ridiculous.
Irrelevant
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I tried to wade through the elk season proposals, and if I was reading it right, they seem to be going in the right direction in a lot of places (Region 1 for example). I'm sure it's not as far as many people want, but they seem to be reducing B tags, and limiting some antlerless opportunities.
Just glancing at those region 1 changes- They got rid of a cow tag that issued 5 permits last year, changed a 7 day wilderness archery season from either sex to antlered bull only, and changed an archery season in a unit with 0.06 elk per square mile from either sex to antlered bull only.
If those changes save more than 5-10 elk, I'd be shocked. The expansion of the the 121 permit area will more than negate that, I'm sure.
I wish I knew a better way to show how dire the situation is in NW Montana. Like @Mtnhunter1 said in another thread, FWP counted twice as many elk on one ranch in central Montana, as what they estimate all of Region 1 has in over 10,000 square miles. Changes like they have proposed are like re-arranging the chairs on the deck of the Titanic.
Elk are being extirpated from a large swath of Montana, and FWP is sitting idly by.
Elk are being extirpated from a large swath of Montana, and FWP is sitting idly by.
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My biggest take away was, she heads up a fish and game commission and doesn't know what an atlatl is. Arguably the most common hunting weapon for all of mankind.
I'm only 20 minutes into it, I'm sure other things were more important. But cm'on. I've known that since elementary school.
I'm only 20 minutes into it, I'm sure other things were more important. But cm'on. I've known that since elementary school.
beginnerhunter
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Haha, well I knew what it was too but couldn't remember what it was called. Didn't realize it was that common though. Did they say that's what they brought with them when the first came into North America?
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