3 Week season for Mule Deer

[8andcounting]

You sure about this? mtmuley

It’s my opinion. Maybe most is wrong word . Some

 

[brocksw]

It’s my opinion. Maybe most is wrong word . Some

I think your main point is that change is hard. And I would agree with that 100%.

 

[huntin24/7]

I have experience in one of the former 3 week zones. Probably 95% private land in this area so take for what it’s worth. I’d say the number of big bucks (most all on private) has stayed very similar. The biggest drop off I see with the 5 week season is with those 3-4 year old bucks, particularly on public/bma. Also, the young bucks with good genetics get cherry picked pretty hard anymore, and because of this, you see very few bucks over 2 years old with good forks and lots lots of 2 and 3 pointers. This is just one example so take it for what it’s worth.

One other thing. I get why guys enjoy the season. Hell, I enjoy the season. I just don’t find it sustainable. But why is MT the only state with mule deer herds with a season structured this way. Makes ya think.

 

[ShootsManyBullets]

The "opportunity" is not what it was 20 years ago and I'd be happy to hunt it less often or have shorter seasons if the hunting was better and there were more quality deer on the landscape.

I've pretty much written off hunting MT since MT wants an arm and a leg for their tag and in my opinion doesn't provide value in excess of the price.

Unless you're retired or unemployed you're not likely using 5 weeks to hunt MT as a NR so I'd wager most of us would be ok with shorter seasons.

 

[mtmuley]

It’s my opinion. Maybe most is wrong word . Some

Pay attention. Like "some" do here. mtmuley

 

[rogerthat]

This ain’t rocket science. As much opportunity as you want….in October.

 

[OntarioHunter]

Quality horns does not necessarily equal quality hunting experience. I have hunted elk the opening week in SW MT the last two years because that's when my brother wants to hunt them and it's condition of my license that I have to hunt with him. He has finally concurred it's not a quality hunting experience even if we did shoot something (or even see something to shoot at). It's an outstanding shitty hunting experience because there's simply too many hunters driving all over the place. A freaking nuthouse! In contrast, the last two weeks of big game season I saw hardly any deer hunters while I was bird hunting. Thanksgiving weekend pretty much nobody. Too cold.. So you guys think that rather than stretch the hunting pressure out over five or six weeks into the rut, move it to three weeks out of the rut. Same number of people will jam up the mountains and coulees over fewer days. More hunters in the field per day somehow translates to less big bucks being shot. Really? And when would the increased per day hoardes of orange hunters be crawling the woods with their noisy boom sticks? Right when comoed up horn hungry elk buglers with bows are trying to preempt their big bulls before that rifle season opens. Yep, I see that plan going over like a lead balloon!

 

[MTLabrador]

Quality horns does not necessarily equal quality hunting experience.

The problem is we don’t have either one right now.

 

[OntarioHunter]

The problem is we don’t have either one right now.

If I can see twenty or more deer a day, I call that quality experience even if none of them have horns. I'm quite sure not a day went by that I hunted birds or deer last year and I didn't see at least five deer, even on the weekends. Often saw dozens. I'm seeing them and that's quality. The barrier to quality horn hunting is commercialization. If you want the big bucks you just have to pay the big money to hunt private property ... or have lots of time and patience (= funds) to hunt public land. I know ... wait till the end of the season when the big bucks roam onto public land in pursuit of does. Shoot them then. But wait ... you guys want to shut off that option too. So big bucks will only be for the boys with the big private land and/or big $$$. Don't be a sucker.

 

[MTLabrador]

I know ... wait till the end of the season when the big bucks roam onto public land in pursuit of does. Shoot them then. But wait ... you guys want to shut off that option too. So big bucks will only be for the boys with the big land or big $$$. Don't be a sucker.

I’ve read it several times and this still makes absolutely no sense. Yes, I would rather not have hunting during the rut. I don’t consider what you described to be a quality experience, but maybe that’s just me.

 

[bigsky2]

If I can see twenty or more deer a day, I call that quality experience even if none of them have horns. I'm quite sure not a day went by that I hunted birds or deer last year and I didn't see at least five deer, even on the weekends. Often saw dozens. I'm seeing them and that's quality. The barrier to quality horn hunting is commercialization. If you want the big bucks you just have to pay the big money to hunt private property ... or have lots of time and patience (= funds) to hunt public land. I know ... wait till the end of the season when the big bucks roam onto public land in pursuit of does. Shoot them then. But wait ... you guys want to shut off that option too. So big bucks will only be for the boys with the big private land and/or big $$$. Don't be a sucker.

I hope the majority of hunters don’t call that a quality experience. Also, there’s a lot more than just deer numbers that factors into the quality of the experience.

 

[rogerthat]

If I can see twenty or more deer a day, I call that quality experience even if none of them have horns. I'm quite sure not a day went by that I hunted birds or deer last year and I didn't see at least five deer, even on the weekends. Often saw dozens. I'm seeing them and that's quality. The barrier to quality horn hunting is commercialization. If you want the big bucks you just have to pay the big money to hunt private property ... or have lots of time and patience (= funds) to hunt public land. I know ... wait till the end of the season when the big bucks roam onto public land in pursuit of does. Shoot them then. But wait ... you guys want to shut off that option too. So big bucks will only be for the boys with the big private land and/or big $$$. Don't be a sucker.

Have you ever hunted Colorado for deer or Wyoming? You don’t know what your talking about…like at all. I’m going to change big to old for my next statement since everyone focuses on that and gets sidetracked. I have passed up a 180” 3 year old mind you. Because he wasn’t old enough. You can’t shoot an old buck if they don’t live to get old.

 

[Unlucky]

Nobody will agree on a specific structure. So what would be best for healthy deer herds on public land. Maybe look at colorado and wyoming.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

If MT goes to a 3 week season in all/some units they will have to go to a limited draw in those same units. Not saying it's wrong or right, just saying you can't have that many hunters out in the field in that short of time and expect the quality of the hunt to be safe or enjoyable.

Then how do WY and ID pull it off?

 

[antlerradar]

You're right. Conditions and populations vary district to district. It doesn't make a lot of sense to whack the season in the district I hunt when the landowners are crying to get the herd thinned. I shot my buck within the first three hours of hunting for deer (second week of the season). He was in a flock of fifteen including a larger buck (that I actually thought I was shooting). We had already seen at least twenty without getting out of the vehicle (I shot mine over a mile from the road). The landowner helped us load it on top of my Jimmy. He said three days earlier he saw more than fifty in one bunch on his winter wheat. No surprise since there wasn't anything for them to eat on the range. He wanted does shot ... badly. Would have helped him out but by the time I got to Havre all the extra B doe tags were gone. I stayed and hunted birds for anither five weeks and saw HUNDREDS of mule deer. Two years ago a couple of young fellas staying at the motel in Malta were about to leave for Washington with an outstanding muley buck and very nice 5x5 whitetail. They'd been hunting three days on BM land up near the border. The one guy kept track of sightings on his phone. Over three days they saw 118 BUCKS! They were putting the stalk on a whopper muley when the whitetail unexpectedly popped out of a coulee. Couldn't pass that up. That year (2020) I saw 26 deer while walking out a large coulee the first morning I hunted them (again, second week of the season - hunted elk the opener). May have seen one doe with two fawns twice. Other than that I'm certain they were all different deer. Where I hunt, there's no shortage of mule deer. Quite the opposite, in spite of abundant public hunting opportunities.

I just want every one to read this again.

 

[brockel]

Fact is - Lots of if not most Montanan’s , and NR that hunt Montana , are not going to be ok giving up opportunities. Montana is an opportunity state when it comes to hunting . Most of the guys and gals who talk the talk on this site and other forums won’t walk the walk when push comes to shove

Haven’t shot a mule deer buck in 13 years. I’d love it if Montana went to a mule deer draw. I’d settle for a general season from October 1st to October 31st. A very limited draw for a rifle rut hunt. Get rid of the damn “traditional” muzzleloader season. Someone wants to hunt with a muzzleloader do it during the general season

 

[teamhoyt]

Just a couple of years ago mule deer in the part of region 7 that our biologist manage were at an all time high. In 2012 these numbers were very low after the bad winter. In 2020 there were 12000 additional muley doe tags issued due to the high numbers of deer. In 2021 it was less doe tags. Montana has had this hunt structure for years, the population was as high as its ever been a couple years ago over here.

So the herd numbers are obviously not affected by the current season structure to the point everyone thinks. Are there going to be less people with tags if the season was only 3 weeks and in October, no. Are there going to be less deer killed if the season was shorter and in October, probably not by much. Are we magically going to have 170 inch deer everywhere if we change the season, no. ND right next door has all rifle tags limited quota, do they have a bunch more big deer than we do, no. Wyoming has most of the state with short week or 2 long hunts, and a million people pounding the woods in that week or 2. Do they have a bunch of big deer because of it, no.

Montana isnt the AZ strip folks. Most 4+ year old deer in Montana are never going to be 170 inch deer if they die of old age. Its just the way it is.

Now to clarify a few things.
I like to hunt big bucks
I dont have any problem with a shorter season and no rut.
I realize im speaking of a small part of region 7 and its a big state, other areas im sure have issues
Of course id like to see more big deer.

Im writing this to say to think about the future and be careful what you wish for. Shorter season lengths equal more people in the field at a time. And there might be another 3 or 4 of them 150 and 160 inch 5 year old deer/100 does on the lanscape but by changing the regs i would argue that there are not going to be any more 200 inch deer running around than there are right now.

 

[brockel]

ND right next door has all rifle tags limited quota, do they have a bunch more big deer than we do, no.

Having spent my entire career working in North Dakota I’m going to have to argue this. I see awesome deer every year in North Dakota. The quality of deer in North Dakota beats eastern Montana and its not even close. Even just a couple miles over the boarder you see the quality difference. Wish I still had even half the pictures of the good deer I’ve seen even in the last 5 years in North Dakota

 

[brocksw]

Then how do WY and ID pull it off?

They aren't, they're just a step behind MT. Both Idaho and WY residents have pushed for changing quotas, limiting NR tags. Idaho has seen huge increases in tag sales in recent history, like record setting years by 50k. WY lacks the population and I would guess has more habitat per resident. Everything is heading towards limited draw for residents and non residents and if we keep improving the pump with out improving the well, it will just happen faster.

 

[brockel]

Having spent my entire career working in North Dakota I’m going to have to argue this. I see awesome deer every year in North Dakota. The quality of deer in North Dakota beats eastern Montana and its not even close. Even just a couple miles over the boarder you see the quality difference. Wish I still had even half the pictures of the good deer I’ve seen even in the last 5 years in North Dakota

Here’s some North Dakota bucks from just the last 3 years on public land. Except the bachelor group. They are about 100 yards from PLOTS land where they bedded every day. Wish I could get a picture of one like this Montana. Been a few years even after season out coyote hunting