Zinke intends to move BLM HQ, etc

[Oak]

How BLM employees really feel about moving West

Leaked audio from a recent agency meeting is filled with fumbles by leadership and disapproving rumbles, derisive laughter from staff.

 

[Irrelevant]

Brain drain...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2021/01/28/trump-blm-reorganization/?outputType=amp

 

[Bambistew]

This seems like a decade ago.

Like many things that happened in the last 4 years, I have to wonder if the desired outcome was predicted or not. I would have expected many people to just quit vs move. East coast to the west is a huge change of lifestyle, and would be an easy way to get rid of the perceived "threat" under the guise of moving to where the lands are. They could then hire people who are more in tune with the remapped organization?

The fact that BLM is/was/will be morphing into a quasi NPS is a little weird.

 

[Irrelevant]

This seems like a decade ago.

Like many things that happened in the last 4 years, I have to wonder if the desired outcome was predicted or not. I would have expected many people to just quit vs move. East coast to the west is a huge change of lifestyle, and would be an easy way to get rid of the perceived "threat" under the guise of moving to where the lands are. They could then hire people who are more in tune with the remapped organization?

The fact that BLM is/was/will be morphing into a quasi NPS is a little weird.

I simply can't imagine the amount of institutional knowledge that is lost with the 87% leaving. I mean our company would functionally cease to exist at that point.

 

[Bambistew]

I simply can't imagine the amount of institutional knowledge that is lost with the 87% leaving. I mean our company would functionally cease to exist at that point.

Like I said... that could well have been the desired outcome. Has the BLM ceased to exist and function?

While I think there was a lot of buffoonery with the previous administration, I also think there was some really manipulative and super smart people pulling strings that knew exactly what would happen. Do you honestly think they they didn't all sit down and come up with a list of outcomes of these major changes?

Similar to the storming of the capitol. I 100% believe that they fully knew that it was a high likelihood they would go inside. Then what would come from that? More sympathy for the President and further vitriol form the "base" towards the democrats as they looked at impeachment. People are easily manipulated.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Like I said... that could well have been the desired outcome. Has the BLM ceased to exist and function?

While I think there was a lot of buffoonery with the previous administration, I also think there was some really manipulative and super smart people pulling strings that knew exactly what would happen. Do you honestly think they they didn't all sit down and come up with a list of outcomes of these major changes?

Similar to the storming of the capitol. I 100% believe that they fully knew that it was a high likelihood they would go inside. Then what would come from that? More sympathy for the President and further vitriol form the "base" towards the democrats as they looked at impeachment. People are easily manipulated.

Eliminating career employees who had the institutional knowledge to buck bad changes was very much a part of the previous administration's playbook. They didn't want professionals, they wanted sycophants.

 

[noharleyyet]

Eliminating career employees who had the institutional knowledge to buck bad changes was very much a part of the previous administration's playbook. They didn't want professionals, they wanted sycophants.

Which party does not require ideological fealty?

 

[Ben Lamb]

Which party does not require ideological fealty?

Neither.

Its just that the previous party in power is much better at exacting it than the current.

 

[Irrelevant]

Like I said... that could well have been the desired outcome. Has the BLM ceased to exist and function?

While I think there was a lot of buffoonery with the previous administration, I also think there was some really manipulative and super smart people pulling strings that knew exactly what would happen. Do you honestly think they they didn't all sit down and come up with a list of outcomes of these major changes?

Similar to the storming of the capitol. I 100% believe that they fully knew that it was a high likelihood they would go inside. Then what would come from that? More sympathy for the President and further vitriol form the "base" towards the democrats as they looked at impeachment. People are easily manipulated.

I agree that this was the desired outcome. My point was more going forward at how freakin' shitty they're going to function as an organization that is in charge of managed a very large portfolio of assets and interests. And people thought it couldn't get worse. There is going to be some much, "how do we do that?"

 

[Bambistew]

Edit: 41 remained out of 287 HQ jobs... out of 10,000+ employees. So 246 left. From what I saw after a quick search was they were looking to fill like 60 high management level jobs. I know a lot of guys that work at BLM. They're all still there, and many of them have decades of institutional knowledge. I would expect a lot of those positions to be filled from within.

This may well be a huge hit, or it may not be, I have no idea. I would guess that that many of those jobs that were lost were not critical to the operations. I mean for every manager, there was probably an admin assistant or other jobs that could be filled with people that don't necessarily need institutional knowledge. Tossing out % and not backing it up is typical of media.

 

[Ben Lamb]

How many of the 10,000+ employees actually quit after the move? A bunch of them took their ball and went home well before the move. What portion of the total worked at HQ? 10%? I don't know that number, but I know a lot of guys that work at BLM. They're all still there, and many of them have decades of institutional knowledge.

Of the DC executive staff, I don't know, but it's high.

Many were close to retirement, others had entire lives built in the area, including kids, sports, etc and moving isn't in the cards, and there's a legit concern that moving the agency away from Congress means worse representation by only political appointees rather than dedicated public servants.

Others were offered mandatory reassignments to shut them up & keep them from talking to folks, others still were demoted and offered lesser positions in the hopes that they'd just quit - which a few did.

 

[Bambistew]

Of the DC executive staff, I don't know, but it's high.

Many were close to retirement, others had entire lives built in the area, including kids, sports, etc and moving isn't in the cards, and there's a legit concern that moving the agency away from Congress means worse representation by only political appointees rather than dedicated public servants.

Others were offered mandatory reassignments to shut them up & keep them from talking to folks, others still were demoted and offered lesser positions in the hopes that they'd just quit - which a few did.

I would expect a whole lot of the same with the new administration. There was a lot of them that took their ball and went home well before the move.

I couldn't imagine working for BLM and being in a higher position. Its crazy to talk with some of the guys that in the middle management area, and the political crap they have to navigate. They are always talking about their "new" boss. You're just one step away from reassignment at any given time, doesn't matter the administration. They haven't been public servants in a long time (never?).

I can see positive and negatives of being in DC.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I would expect a whole lot of the same with the new administration. There was a lot of them that took their ball and went home well before the move.

I couldn't imagine working for BLM and being in a higher position. Its crazy to talk with some of the guys that in the middle management area, and the political crap they have to navigate. They are always talking about their "new" boss. You're just one step away from reassignment at any given time, doesn't matter the administration. They haven't been public servants in a long time (never?).

I can see positive and negatives of being in DC.

I do think a BLM/DOI HQ in the west makes good sense, but it has to be done in a far more thoughtful manner.

I feel for the guys on the ground & in the middle. The career path for public service means people don't get to spend their careers, or long stints of it, in one spot anymore. Everyone's going after the brass ring & trying to advance, and the model doesn't really encourage that longevity. I have felt for a long time that keeping people in their positions long enough to develop relationships & find the path forward on resource mgt issues are directly tied together when it comes to successful outcomes. Changing hands every 2-3 years doesn't build understanding at the agency, or trust in the local communities.

 

[Sytes]

Last I recall from the BLM move to Co HT threads, seemed a good qty of HT members were supportive of this move. And even more so over the potential UT location.

Bringing management, etc to the mountains vs desk jockeys in DC, etc...

 

[davinski]

The regional office that's been here forever is all but 300 yards from the building where the HQ leases now. I don't know for certain, but I get the distinct feeling that the rank-and-file regional folks who get muddy boots as often as not were less than pleased to have the "echelons above reality" HQ set up shop next door. I understand.

But I also think it's a good idea to move the HQ and senior admin offices out west to immerse them with the people, businesses, and municipalities who have to deal daily with their solutions or problems. Frankly, making them part of a community that is (or will soon be) equal parts oil & gas people living with earth muffin people yet all still manage to live together, get along, and get things done, can only be a good thing. Loss of energy jobs is one conversation on CNN. It's a whole other conversation when you're having it with a laid off soccer dad whose kid is friends with your kid. As is the conversation about Bears Ears monument when you have it with an actual member of the Southern Ute nation who is your neighbor.

So many people forget the first word in the title of our country, I think anything that can be done to stir up bits and pieces of D.C. bureaucracy (east coast blue bloods) and mingle it with the unwashed masses (flyover country) can only be a good thing. IMO, the urban-rural divide across the country is at the heart of a lot of other problems. If we break a few eggs at the BLM in order to get overall solutions and mindsets a little farther along, I'm a fan. Other agencies and systems should model it.

My personal experience in dealing with lettered agencies is more DOT and DOD than DOI. But there seems to be a real problem, spanning several past administrations, with senior admin staff having very little contact with problems "where the rubber meets the road" that their own rank and file employees have to deal with.

Two cents from a guy whose office is a block away from the new BLM HQ.

 

[Irrelevant]

The regional office that's been here forever is all but 300 yards from the building where the HQ leases now. I don't know for certain, but I get the distinct feeling that the rank-and-file regional folks who get muddy boots as often as not were less than pleased to have the "echelons above reality" HQ set up shop next door. I understand.

But I also think it's a good idea to move the HQ and senior admin offices out west to immerse them with the people, businesses, and municipalities who have to deal daily with their solutions or problems. Frankly, making them part of a community that is (or will soon be) equal parts oil & gas people living with earth muffin people yet all still manage to live together, get along, and get things done, can only be a good thing. Loss of energy jobs is one conversation on CNN. It's a whole other conversation when you're having it with a laid off soccer dad whose kid is friends with your kid. As is the conversation about Bears Ears monument when you have it with an actual member of the Southern Ute nation who is your neighbor.

So many people forget the first word in the title of our country, I think anything that can be done to stir up bits and pieces of D.C. bureaucracy (east coast blue bloods) and mingle it with the unwashed masses (flyover country) can only be a good thing. IMO, the urban-rural divide across the country is at the heart of a lot of other problems. If we break a few eggs at the BLM in order to get overall solutions and mindsets a little farther along, I'm a fan. Other agencies and systems should model it.

My personal experience in dealing with lettered agencies is more DOT and DOD than DOI. But there seems to be a real problem, spanning several past administrations, with senior admin staff having very little contact with problems "where the rubber meets the road" that their own rank and file employees have to deal with.

Two cents from a guy whose office is a block away from the new BLM HQ.

Sure. 100% agree with all of that.

The downside I see is that they, DOI, are often at the mercy of Congress when it comes to how to approach topics regarding both your kid's friend's Dad or your neighbor. So now you have even less ability to talk to them-Congress, in person, and provide meaningful input. There is a reason, O&G employ a fleet of people in DC, that's how and where things get done. Not that DOI is or can directly lobby Congress, but being able to meet with people face to face certainly has positives and provide more guidance than an email from CO is going to.

 

[davinski]

Sure. 100% agree with all of that.

The downside I see is that they, DOI, are often at the mercy of Congress when it comes to how to approach topics regarding both your kid's friend's Dad or your neighbor. So now you have even less ability to talk to them-Congress, in person, and provide meaningful input. There is a reason, O&G employ a fleet of people in DC, that's how and where things get done. Not that DOI is or can directly lobby Congress, but being able to meet with people face to face certainly has positives and provide more guidance than an email from CO is going to.

Also true. There's the way things are and the way things should be. It's incredibly hard dealing with both at the same time.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Sure. 100% agree with all of that.

The downside I see is that they, DOI, are often at the mercy of Congress when it comes to how to approach topics regarding both your kid's friend's Dad or your neighbor. So now you have even less ability to talk to them-Congress, in person, and provide meaningful input. There is a reason, O&G employ a fleet of people in DC, that's how and where things get done. Not that DOI is or can directly lobby Congress, but being able to meet with people face to face certainly has positives and provide more guidance than an email from CO is going to.

And honestly, it's a helluva lot easier to get to Washington DC from most of the west than it is to get to Grand Junction.

We tend to think of travel geographically rather than through the lens of windshield time. I can get to DC in less than 8 hours from Casper, Boise, Cheyenne, Helena, Bozeman, Spokane, Seattle, CA, etc. Grand Junction is an entire day between the drive & the flight.

 

[BigHornRam]

One of these days DC is going to run out of office space and this move will help make that day more into the future.

White House Office of Domestic Climate Policy - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[davinski]

And honestly, it's a helluva lot easier to get to Washington DC from most of the west than it is to get to Grand Junction.

We tend to think of travel geographically rather than through the lens of windshield time. I can get to DC in less than 8 hours from Casper, Boise, Cheyenne, Helena, Bozeman, Spokane, Seattle, CA, etc. Grand Junction is an entire day between the drive & the flight.

Not to keep whacking at our dead horse, but I don't think the travel time to/from is as much a negative as the lack of ability to conduct other business in DC. GJT goes direct to/from SLC, DEN, DFW, PHX and most of those airports you list are also a two-leg trip. It's exactly 963 yards (I just checked onX) from where your rollerbag hits the curb at the GJT airport to the front door of the BLM HQ building. So, assuming you're flying, it's not bad.

Sorry, you get the airport engineer's answer, I can't help it.

But no, there won't be many other offices or stops worth any political action nearby. People will just have to kill time waiting for their flight home by suffering through our peach festivals, wineries, and new world class Cameo shooting range! We have no elk hunting anymore, sorry, they all moved away, it's the strangest thing...

@Ben Lamb or anyone reading this, really, if you do find yourself in GJ with time to kill, give me a holler, the first beverage is on me.