What will the future look like for colleges?

[PrairieHunter]

I think the biggest changes will be at the AD's of public schools. We are already seeing schools drop sports and I fully expect to see some FBS teams move back down to the pee wee leagues of FCS and D-2.

Take the University of Wyoming for example. 45 millioin $ Ad budget, almost half is a subsidy as they do not have much income. They play in the same league as UT who has a 219 million $ ad budget with 0 subsidy.
They gutted the UW budget about 4-5 years ago. I know in the college of ag the dean left, head of animal science left, and the person in charge of each of the ag research stations. I assume others were similar. They they ran the president off.

Then the state decided to allow other 2 year schools in the state to offer 4 year degrees which will hurt enrollment on a school that is desperate for growth.

Then coal and NG prices fell even more.

Then the Corona virus hit.

Then oil prices tanked.

It does not take a genius to see that there are going to be some major cuts at UW coming up as they are going to get hit at every angle on the budget. Will there still be 20 million $ available as a subsidy to operate the AD, pay for a football program that loses millions, or keep a BB or WBB program that plays in front of a few hundred fans most nights in a 10k seat arena? I don't see how that will keep going unless they operate the AD on the states rainy day fund. Things have simply changed and unless there is fan support through ticket sales a lot of these sports could become club level.

One of the easiest ways for schools in the G-5 to cut costs is to simply drop sports and many only cost a few hundred thousand to keep going football is one that costs most state taxpayers millions in subsidy to pay a coach and his assistants millions of $ while flying a team all over the country.

 

[Old man bob]

! pointer You wanna pay 70K a year to go to a Private School . And its not gonna get You any farther . I don't see it. You spend 3/4 of your life paying off Student loans. not trying to argue with you I just don't see an advantage unless you are in a real specialty field that makes you 3 times as much. Rocky , I don't see where an accounting degree would help in the construction buss. like I was in. Even a Buss. Degree. I had a few buddies that had Buss Degrees in the same buss . as me. Didn't really help at all.If You want office jobs then it does. But is it more $ , No in most cases. My Son is just finishing his Political Science and Buss Degree, But He wanted nothing to do with the Construction world. I His case He just want an office enviroment. Then You have your ones with the Law Degree. Most are Thieves , and Butholes including My neighbors and a Brother in Law. Just My 2 cents. Seen many people without degrees that are multi million ares. (Can You tell I didn't take English. LOL..............BOB!

 

[Old man bob]

Sorry I didn't read more posts on here before I posted 15 minutes ago. Yes there is gonna be that 10% that has an elite Education. And its needed. When I was Driving Truck up in the oilfield while Construction was down here in Phoenix for 5 years we made well over 100K a year . about one third of our drivers had Degrees. I felt I was the dumb one ,LOL. I had a Couple live next to me in a High end Phoenix suburb and She was a DR. at the Mayo clinic , a Highly specialized Internal medicine Dr. She said She went to school for 13 years. I said how did You do it? She said after 8 years in there was no lookin back now. Wonderful Lady and thank God some People wanna do it. She is in that 10%. She was under 40 and owned a 2 Million $ home. Her Husband had a degree but just a normal job ,nothin special. I guess what I am saying is if your gonna be in a field that makes You 60K a year , Don't go to Vanderbilt or Stanford. and if you have a great degree ,use it don't work at Target. I can't argue with some of You here I know You are smarter than Me. . I said Some. All have a great weekend. And to those of You in a special field using Your Degree . Thank You for what You do. I am Semi retired and to much time on My hands and can't go anywhere with the lockdown. I allready spent 2 weeks in the woods and got burned out there too.............BOB!

 

[PrairieHunter]

! pointer You wanna pay 70K a year to go to a Private School . And its not gonna get You any farther . I don't see it. You spend 3/4 of your life paying off Student loans. not trying to argue with you I just don't see an advantage unless you are in a real specialty field that makes you 3 times as much.

Not all private schools are created equally. One simple indicator is endowment. You can tell who has all the wealthy alumni quite easily.

So some private schools are likely worth it if you have big dreams. Not so much of you plan to have a career making less than 100k per year.

So all the really elite privates in the ivy league, PAC 12, Rice, etc... will be fine but a lot of these other bible schools and non elite privates will likely be in trouble unless they can scam the government out of tuition payments like a lot of these academically questionable schools have done for years.

 

[.270]

In my opinion, I hope the current college system remains in tact. I feel the social interacts you learn as a young adult are just as important as the actual education you would learn from a professor. I believe the greatest benefit from any education is human interaction. Just my two cents. I completed high school early and went straight into the Navy at 17. I learn a lot from that environment, more then when I completed my check mark undergrad and graduate degrees from ASU online. I just welded something the neighboring farmer broke on his tractor and I feel more accomplished doing that giving business advice.

 

[MTelkHuntress]

I agree that public and private schools wont become obsolete but I do hope there are some changes. The University of Montana has been making cuts (questionable ones) for years and from my understanding enrollment has been down quite a bit.
I was very lucky to get into a private college and have a big enough scholarship that it was cheaper than going to the local university. I was extremely behind the other students but luckily I was able to catch up after the first two years. I believe I had better opportunities and a better education than if I had went to local university. After graduating, I was able to get a job (and almost a free Masters if it wasnt for budget cuts) at a different university that I dont think I would have gotten without connections and advanced lab training. Hopefully it will open more opportunities in the future. Obviously not all private schools are the same but I'm pretty grateful for the one I was able to attend, even if I wasnt the average student there.
That being said, I agree that private school isnt for everyone, it depends on what you want to do.
College isnt even for everyone and I think the high schools pushing all the students that direction isnt very helpful. I wish the high schools (at least the ones here) did a better job having students explore careers and what they actually enjoy.

I just dont see online school replacing time in the classroom. Being able to speak to a professor in class or office hours really helps boost understanding as well as speaking to peers and joining study groups. Sure you can have the same content online, but there's more to learn in a classroom where different ideas lead to new questions that may not be on topic but are still important. I agree with Europe in that college is far more than the diploma, there's many other aspects that dont get emphasized enough.
I know my friend in law school absolutely hates doing class through zoom because taking exams online has some challenges and none of the students participate in class. The first half of my EMT course will be through zoom and I'm a little nervous about missing out on in person classroom time.

 

[rwc101]

I got an email last night from the president of the university I work for. They are expediting their plans to increase online courses, and it doesn't seem like it is just for the virus. As a librarian, my fear is that online courses will be like e-books. Not a whole lot of people really like them, especially for academia, but they're too convenient for the provider to pass up. Online courses could be a cash cow for schools tired of fluctuating funding from state legislatures that they won't be able to resist even if students don't really want them.

 

[MTGomer]

I know it’s throwing a wrench in clinical and graduate research in the medical field.
My wife was going to do her doctorate research on the Navajo reservation. Now she isn’t allowed up there.
Almost All of the people in her program that are in the classes ahead of her have had their graduation dates pushed back (indefinitely) because hospitals around the country have stopped all student clinicals.
That should create a bit of a higher demand for certain class types when this is over. There will be a rush to catch back up.

 

[2rocky]

Rocky , I don't see where an accounting degree would help in the construction buss. like I was in. Even a Buss. Degree. I had a few buddies that had Buss Degrees in the same buss . as me. Didn't really help at all.If You want office jobs then it does. But is it more $ , No in most cases.

Not a degree Bob....Background...Maybe some basic classes in Accounting or Construction Management. But not 4 years. If your talent is a Trade you need to be able to see that the Professionals you HIRE are doing the right things for you.

 

[bayoublaster7527]

It seems that higher education has become much more of a business over the last 10-20 years, all the schools are competing for that tuition money. In order to compete they spend inordinate amounts on high priced facilities and amenities in order to bring in more and more students (and their tuition). It’s a vicious cycle that brings us to the point we are currently at, sky-high tuition and tons of student loan debt. You would think at some point the system will break, we will see. Better facilities doesn’t always equal better education but it does equal higher tuition. More focus on learning and less on sports and million dollar facilities would be nice. However I do believe there is definite value in college education.

 

[2rocky]

Here is my Question:

If you are in a Hiring position and you usually hire employees with College degrees, are you going to look at non College graduates?

i think that the possession of a degree denotes that they can start and finish something. it is a good First Weed Out when there is a lot of candidates.

I think colleges who can offer degree programs at minimal cost will benefit and the Universities with "more IVY on the Walls" will have to keep focusing on advanced degree programs to keep their enrollment. JC's with guaranteed 2 year transfer programs will thrive. Land Grant Universities will find more traction with Extension programs being taught remotely, which ironically makes it MORE accessible to people in rural areas because they don't have to travel to a Field Day. Wireless Broadband has become more accessible to folks in the country.

I say this as a member of the local Junior college Animal Science Advisory Committee and a former High school Ag/FFA advisory committees.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

JC's with guaranteed 2 year transfer programs will thrive

The transfer process from a community/JC could sure be easier. My oldest daughter had quite a battle to get some of her credits transferred.

 

[2rocky]

JLS, I think 4 year schools realize transfer students have much higher graduation rates. There is a disconnect between the Admissions and the counseling departments on both sides.

Online classes aren't limited by seats in a lecture hall. The JC students who have had trouble that I know couldn't get that Prerequisite class to transfer. (Or that was their excuse)

 

[JEL]

I work relatively closely with a couple UMW professors and this seems to be a very good way to get a lot of learning in. It sets students up to be responsible. No cutting class because you didn't feel like it (I'm guilty of that). If you miss you miss a week's worth of classes. The natural resources classes get field time, geology students get an intense course that I'm not sure I'd be able to handle. Our soils crew usually takes students out for a day of "this is what you really need to take from this course" kind of field day. I'd support more of the block scheduling.

Two of my boys graduated from Western with degrees in environmental science and environmental interpretation. They loved the block program. Really allows you to get into the class subject and allows for a lot of field work. Worked great for them. Pretty reasonable cost wise as well. They both got out without debt.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

Two of my boys graduated from Western with degrees in environmental science and environmental interpretation. They loved the block program. Really allow you to get into the class subject and allows for a lot of filed work. Worked great for them. Pretty reasonable cost wise as well. They both got out without debt.

My niece graduated from there as well. She absolutely loved the block program.

 

[LuketheDog]

After this mass hysteria dies down and in hindsight everybody will see how foolish and damaging our actions have been over the past few months, but education will resume more or less as it was before. The repercussions will be that due to bloated budgets some private schools may have to fold and state institutions will be bailed out by our tax dollars, most athletic programs will be audited and some college level sports will suffer or go away, online course loads will increase, and the value of a degree will diminish overall. I think a large portion of high school seniors will just head to college per usual because they have no idea what else to do with their life and learning trades is, frankly, too difficult for them. Anyone notice how trade workers have been so continually diminished by politicians over the years, but that they are a vast majority of the 'essential' workforce who are still earning paychecks while others sit at home and twiddle their thumbs? My HVAC guy makes $160K a year with only one employee and has more work than he knows what to do with, and he can't find an apprentice out of high school who is willing to earn that kind of money, it blows my mind!

 

[Old man bob]

I agree with Rocky that the JC's will thrive. Here in Arizona they allways have. There are 6-7 in phoenix metro and then all over the state. The only bad thing is they cut out their Football programs 2 years ago. Think they still have other sports...............BOB!

 

[1_pointer]

Not all private schools are created equally. One simple indicator is endowment. You can tell who has all the wealthy alumni quite easily.

So some private schools are likely worth it if you have big dreams. Not so much of you plan to have a career making less than 100k per year.

So all the really elite privates in the ivy league, PAC 12, Rice, etc... will be fine but a lot of these other bible schools and non elite privates will likely be in trouble unless they can scam the government out of tuition payments like a lot of these academically questionable schools have done for years.

The small, private school I went to has about a $350 million endowment for 850 students. I think they'll be okay...

I'm still a believer that education is never wasted, but I also understand that not all education translates directly to the W2.

 

[Europe]

Excellent thread with great posts. Very informative and thought provoking. Just a couple of thoughts

oldmanbob--Go to college and start your own business will also work. At least it did for us and "campus" college gave us a bit of a leg up on working with a variety of personalities.

Elkduds--post 55--both your serious comment and your attachment are correct, IMHO (-;

NP307, best of luck on your paper

prairehunter, good point

mtgomer. sorry to hear that. I hope she doesn't let that stop her from getting her Doctorate best of luck to her

Mtelkhuntress It is so refreshing to see the younger generation making the point (s ) you made about attending classes as opposed to taking them on line. Also thank you for the flowers, they made my day (-: (-: (-:

If this was discussed and I missed it, my apologizes . My granddaughter went to a private grade school. When she got to High School, she was so far ahead of the other students ( Academically ) that they suggested she enter something called "Running Start"
She attended high school but also attended the local Junior College while in high school. When she graduated from high school she was only a couple of credits away from having her Associate degree. Thanks to her high school and junior college councilor she only took courses that were transferrable to a 4 year college. She had her Bachelors degree two years after high school. The cost of the private school during grade school and Junior college ( that she attended during high school ) was waaaaay less than the extra two years of college she would have had to pay for. Just another thought for those with young children. BTW--she was able to participate in sports --but she HATED the uniforms she had to wear in grade school (-:

When I went to college, running start, meant you got to start running before the cows were let out of the trailer (-:

 

[Little Big Man MT Chris]

As for Colleges................


and you know what that means .....


but some would say ............


as for me ..... is it ..... September yet ?