Time for a new rifle?

[antelopedundee]

The last time I was at the range a gent showed up with some kind of component rifle in 50 BMG. When done it looked like some sort of AR type. Apparently the brake was sufficient to calm the recoil, but it was LOUD.

 

[mtmuley]

That and a rifle that weighs 34lb.
I don't think the recoil is the factor with the 50.
It's more the concussion from the brake.

The .50 I was shooting was a Barret I think. Ran into the guy at our range and he turned me loose with it. The .338 Allen Magnum was 13 pounds I think. 350 grain bullet, wacking steel at 1400. mtmuley

 

[Farmerj]

I’d recommend a .280 Remington.

It seems I’m rather old school and that’s giving way to the .280 AI.

I’d still say the .280 Rem and when you decided if you want to go different, send the barrel off and have it recut to .280 AI then.

About as good as you can get against the 7 rem mag and you can still use a .30-06 bolt head.

 

[old roper 42]

Here is an example of what the 280Ai is all about.

I looked up the loads for the Barnes 140 grain TTSX in both the 280AI and the 7mm mag. Both peaked just under 3200'/sec. 3196 and 3199 respectivly.

I took a load for each at exacly 3169'/sec. The 280AI needed 56.3 grains of R 17 to get here. The 7mm mag needed 68 grains of R-22 to get there.

To get that 7mm mag to 3199'/sec it took 77 grains of "Magnum powder". The 280AI did 3196'/sec with 62 grains of "Hunter" powder

How can anyone not admire that kind of efficiency!

One question why not post your velocity with 280AI? What's your load with 175gr in 280AI or even 180gr?

 

[Farmerj]

The .280 Remington, .280 AI and 7mm win mag are so close together in performance, it speaks volumes about the efficiency of the 7mm chambering.

The .280 Remington load I’m chomping at the bit to run in the rifle I’m building retains 1500 lb-ft of energy out to 900 yards vs the .30-06 load only reaching 700 yards and falling off.

The .280 AI and the 7mm mag don’t really give enough benefit to stretch that out very far.

 

[std7mag]

The .280 Remington, .280 AI and 7mm win mag are so close together in performance, it speaks volumes about the efficiency of the 7mm chambering.

The .280 Remington load I’m chomping at the bit to run in the rifle I’m building retains 1500 lb-ft of energy out to 900 yards vs the .30-06 load only reaching 700 yards and falling off.

The .280 AI and the 7mm mag don’t really give enough benefit to stretch that out very far.

Ok, 2 things i'm looking at.
First is there is a 7mm Win SHORT Mag. Otherwise it would be a 7mm RSAUM, 7MM REM Mag, or 7mm Weatherby Magnum.

2nd is i'm running bullets through Strelok Pro, using max velocities from a load manual for bullets from 140gr through 175gr.
I can get the 175gr ABLR, with a muzzle velocity of 2,700fps to get me 1,500 ftlb only out to 550 yards. Velocity i can keep to 1,500 fps at 900 yards. But not energy.

 

[Farmerj]

Ok, 2 things i'm looking at.
First is there is a 7mm Win SHORT Mag. Otherwise it would be a 7mm RSAUM, 7MM REM Mag, or 7mm Weatherby Magnum.

2nd is i'm running bullets through Strelok Pro, using max velocities from a load manual for bullets from 140gr through 175gr.
I can get the 175gr ABLR, with a muzzle velocity of 2,700fps to get me 1,500 ftlb only out to 550 yards. Velocity i can keep to 1,500 fps at 900 yards. But not energy.

Try here.

Overview - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

Overview The Hornady® 4DOF® (Four Degrees Of Freedom) Ballistic Calculator determines trajectory solutions based on projectile Drag Coefficient (not Ballistic Coefficient), combined with exact physical modeling of the projectile and its mass and ae...

www.hornady.com

I put the numbers in from the hornady manual and compared the .280 with a 166 gr pill and my .30-06 with a 180 gr pill.

4350 in the 280 and 4064 in the .30-06.

My notes are at home in Minnesota and I’m south of Dallas.

 

[std7mag]

Try here.

Overview - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

Overview The Hornady® 4DOF® (Four Degrees Of Freedom) Ballistic Calculator determines trajectory solutions based on projectile Drag Coefficient (not Ballistic Coefficient), combined with exact physical modeling of the projectile and its mass and ae...

www.hornady.com

I put the numbers in from the hornady manual and compared the .280 with a 166 gr pill and my .30-06 with a 180 gr pill.

4350 in the 280 and 4064 in the .30-06.

My notes are at home in Minnesota and I’m south of Dallas.

Yeeeaaaaahhhhhh.
Something isn't quite jiving there.
If Hornady's model is showing you 1,500 ftlb of energy from the 166gr A-Tip at 900 yards, then i'd look elsewhere.

Even at max Hornady book velocity of 2,586 (168gr bullet) using a 24" barrel with 1:10 twist, your at the 1,470fps mark with 798 ftlb of energy at 900 yards.
That cartridge, with that bullet to keep 1,500 ftlb of energy is a 400 yard gun.

 

[ludville1]

I remember a comment about the 460 Wby mag which I think is in my old Hornady reloading book. A powerful rifle is fascinating to many.

I remember a story about the .460 Wby. mag. I used to work with a guy that also held a FFL license. He was a great guy, and gave us some really good deals on guns, scopes, etc. Anyway, he had an opportunity to shoot a buddy's .460 Wby. mag. He shot it 3 times, shooting it very accurately. He said "if that's what you need to hunt elephants, I'm not going!", lol!

 

[Ben Lamb]

338 Winchester Magnum.

If you're going to be a bear, be a grizzly.

Excellent cartridge for timber & distance, recoil is manageable, shoots 210-250 grain pills with superb accuracy & the Remington corlockt 225's are good, cheap & accurate in most rifles.

 

[Farmerj]

Yeeeaaaaahhhhhh.
Something isn't quite jiving there.
If Hornady's model is showing you 1,500 ftlb of energy from the 166gr A-Tip at 900 yards, then i'd look elsewhere.

Even at max Hornady book velocity of 2,586 (168gr bullet) using a 24" barrel with 1:10 twist, your at the 1,470fps mark with 798 ftlb of energy at 900 yards.
That cartridge, with that bullet to keep 1,500 ftlb of energy is a 400 yard gun.

I’ll address it when I get home to my notes and books.

Should be this weekend or early next week.

 

[antelopedundee]

There also used to be a gun shop in the area that had one. For $5 a pop you could go out back and shoot it. Probably $15 a pop now.

 

[Farmerj]

577 T-Rex

 

[old roper 42]

Yeeeaaaaahhhhhh.
Something isn't quite jiving there.
If Hornady's model is showing you 1,500 ftlb of energy from the 166gr A-Tip at 900 yards, then i'd look elsewhere.

Even at max Hornady book velocity of 2,586 (168gr bullet) using a 24" barrel with 1:10 twist, your at the 1,470fps mark with 798 ftlb of energy at 900 yards.
That cartridge, with that bullet to keep 1,500 ftlb of energy is a 400 yard gun.

Hornady manual 11 has max velocity for 280 with 166gr @2800fps with 4 max loads. Data for 280AI with 166gr max 2 loads@ 2950fps. That loads I posted with for my 280AI with 175gr ABLR at 900yds I'm at 1643 lbs energy. I got some Berger 175gr on back order and use those on bull tag next year.

 

[std7mag]

Hornady manual 11 has max velocity for 280 with 166gr @2800fps with 4 max loads. Data for 280AI with 166gr max 2 loads@ 2950fps. That loads I posted with for my 280AI with 175gr ABLR at 900yds I'm at 1643 lbs energy. I got some Berger 175gr on back order and use those on bull tag next year.

Old Roper,
Farmerj specified 4350 for his powder, hence why i used the velocity listed.

 

[BucksnDucks]

I've gone the opposite direction in calibers finding I really enjoy tweaking loads and bullets to get impressive velocities without all that powder. So not alot of input in picking a big 30, but I think you will like the rifle. I've heard great things about the Bergara ridge wilderness and will likely get one as my next rifle.

 

[Don Fischer]

I’m pretty sure several branches of our military are phasing out 300WM in favor of 300PRC so I do not think it will fade away. It is the one I prefer and I have my reasons, those reasons are trivial to most shooters and they are not worth arguing about on the internet.

If I wasn’t a reloader and I wanted to buy a new gun I would only buy the cartridge I could walk out of the store that day with 200 rounds minimum.

Ya know what the 300 mag and 300 PRC have in common. To be of value you still have to hit what your aiming at! As I understand it, Mr Bell killed elephants with a 6.5 Sweed. he quit using it because the long bullet's he used bent on him. Today people need a 458 or better to kill an elephant. In contrast Elenor O'Conner, Jacks wife, killed only one ehephant and did it with a 30-06. Hows these things happen? Little old indian woman in Canada killed the #1 grizzly in the world with a 22 RF! make's me think we'd be far better off improving our shooting skills and what it take to kill than looking for a new bigger rifle cartridge! have a very old box ofRemington 22 short ammo here. Inside flap it say's, Dangerous within 1 mile".

Buying a new gun in a cartridge you could walk out of the store that day with 200 rds of ammo is a good idea! I reload and never think of things like that but early on in reloading, when I bought a new rifle I also bought a box of ammo and stopped on the way home to try shooting the rifle!

 

[Farmerj]

Tim Taylor complex…

 

[old roper 42]

Old Roper,
Farmerj specified 4350 for his powder, hence why i used the velocity listed.

He didn't specified which 4350 he used and you just took lowest and other 2 max 2700fps and 2800fps. I would think he use the 2800fps.

 

[dirtclod Az.]

Where are my glasses,? Time for a new wifel'?