Rubs and scrapes

[Nut]

How much do rubs and scrapes determine where you set up?
I believe that rubs are more important than scrapes. (Viperess could have had at least a 9 pointer last fall if I had went with a rub line. It would have determined which way I entered the woods. But dummy me came in the wrong way.)

From what I have read scrapes are visited mainly nocturnally.

What do you think?

 

[1_pointer]

All depends on the time of year. Early I definitely think rub lines are the way to go. If I had my druthers, you would always find me near a hot scrape line right before the rut, when the bucks are running crazy.

 

[Deerslayer]

If you give me the choice of setting up on a rub line or over a scrape.....it will be the scrape EVERY time.

Problem here being you can only hunt scrapes on one of each of the 3 or 4 subsequent ruts.....meaning about the first month, you do not have this option in most areas, at least in the south.....
DS

 

[engman99]

You have to keep in mind that the opinions here represent a very diverse area of land.
Where I am located in Indiana I consider hunting scrapes pretty much a waste of time.
I definatly prefer rub lines.
The bucks here pretty much seem to run scrapes nocturnaly.Rub lines just define a route of travel,be it nocturnal or daytime travel.I feel my odds are way better hunting rub lines.

 

[Delw]

here in AZ and when I hunted washington, I never worry about rubs and scrapes. In washington i would sit at the edge of clear cuts and glass.. here in AZ I sit and glass alot. I dont hunt from a stand most of my hunting is done from spot and stalk or just walking the edges of canyons...To me experiance has alot to do with where i will find deer,but then i have been hunting here for 20 years and know where to look... takes alot of time, but in the long run it pays off... I dont go to knoew areas that much because I have hunt about 75% of all the units here in az for archery deer, bear and coyotes....
like engman99 says every part of the states is different to hunt in..even archery couse deer I glass, dont get me wrong its pretty cool to see a big rub but it just dont work me.

Delw

 

[Deerslayer]

Engman........I chuckled when I read that bucks in your area run scrapes "nocturnally".
Now take this in the spirit in which I write it, no disrespect intended.........but many think that the big bucks making those scarpes are nocturnal or even "ghost bucks" because they are so elusive or wary. I will tell you this for sure, there are situations and circumstances where you CAN hunt these bucks tending their scrapes, but it has to be the right scrapes, and the right place,ie, close to good cover and in an area with little or no pressure.......and these places may not exist where you are at.....but the lack of un-pressured ground and the lack of security cover will make evn running a rub line a nocturnal event.

The biggest difference in scrape lines and rub lines is ALL bucks will rub, but only the dominant bucks will last on a scrape line, so you are hunting a different caliber animal, which means fewer opportunities, which eludes to the "ghost buck" theory.

It is not an easy game, but if you wanna play for the jackpot, you gotta be sittin at the right table.........just my approach, for what it's worth.
DS

 

[josh]

DS,
"Only doninant bucks will last on a scrape line"
Not sure I understand what you mean there????

Ill assume you guys are talking about pre-rut bowhunting season. In my opinion both are a wast of time in the thick of the rut.....Find the does and the bucks wont be far behind

 

[WHITETAIL HUNTER]

DEERSLAYER YOU ARE VERY CORRECT, IF YOU STAY ON THE HOT SCRAPE YOU WILL FIND THE BIG BUCK. I WOULD MUCH RATHER SET UP IN A PLACE WITH A VERY HOT SCRAPER RIGHT WHEN THE RUT HITS THAN SET MYSELF TO FAR FROM IT. THE DEER IN INDIANA DO NOT ALL GO NOCTURNAL AND ARE NOT "PHANATOMS OF THE NIGHT". SO GIVE ME A HOT SCRAPE AND MY 12 GUAGE AND LET IT RIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DKO]

DS, knows whitetails! both are sign posts to his everyday pattern and both can determine the right place and the right time to kill him!

scrapes:
most folks get busted while hunting scrapes and never see the deer, mainly because most mature whitetails check their scrapes from downwind, this distance can vary greatly depending on cover, but most hunters set-up to close to a scrape if not right on top of it therefore putting your scent right where the scrape is!!! 50 yrds downwind of an active scrape in a core area on the right trail can produce better results!

rubs:
can be tricky but if ya find what i refer to as generational rub areas, areas where mature deer have rubbed the same trees in the same areas year after year! these to me are more important than a tore up sapling along a major trail!!! these places exist and are usually not far from the bedding area! hope this helps!!!

im with josh !!! all this scientific stuff goes right out the window when the rut is in full swing!!! when ya see a huge 10 pt standing in a cut over corn field at 1:00 in the afternoon, theres your sign!!!!

 

[engman99]

I am going to explain myself a little better.
Deerslayer,I live in a very high pressure area.Trust me scrape hunting is pretty much a waste of time.I have spent countless hours watching scrape lines and have never been real successful at it.I have set 50yrds downwind,near cover,open ridges,old fields,hillsides,where the scrapline had a corner.Trust me its very high pressure.So why would I want to hunt scrapes when I think I found an easier way to kill em'?
More on that in a minute.
Whitetail hunter,are you from IN?
Here is my ideal set up.This aint something I read in a magazine,this is from personal experience.
I look for a rub line and back track it.If it peters out,I find another one.I keep doing this till I find one that leads me to a bedding area,which will be the bigger percentage of the time a cedar thicket on top of a hill.Now when you get close enough to that cedar thicket that you spot about 20 or 30 rubs along its border then Stop! Turnaround! and get.Now all thats left to do is came back and hunt the down wind side of this thicket.BUT,ONLY HUNT IT IN THE MORNINGS!If you hunt it in the evenings you will more than likely get busted for sure.
What usually happens is the buck will aproach the bedding area and walk along the downwind side of it before entering.So you have to set up at one end to try and catch him in a cross wind.
Now that is my bow season set up for my area.My gun set up is to set up in funnels the first couple of days and wait for someone to run me something.After that I head for the thick stuff.
I am not saying scrape hunting is impossible here,I just think my way works better.

 

[Deerslayer]

You gotta go with what is working for you Engman. If you have a formula that fills your tag with animals you are happy with, what more can you ask.

I think a lot of the problem with peoples views on scrape hunting being a "waste of time" is that they are not hunting the right scrapes. Just as DKO explained a little on the different rubs, such as the sign post rubs(generational) that ALL bucks make, there are different types of scrapes.

The Hot scrapes made by DOMINANT bucks, truely hot scrapes, are VERY VERY hard to find. If you find a likely looking scrape and just decide to set up your stand there, you probably would be easting your time.
But if you find the one big boy left yesterday, and checked again this morning, then you should camp your @ss out there daylight to darl for the remainder of the week, and you just may have yourself a wallhanger, not just a buck.

My earlier comment about only the dominant buck "will last" on this scrape line.....when you find the scrape line mentioned above, after you kill this brute, you will notice the cuts and gashes over his eyes, and the knotts in his neck.....he will be exhausted from kicking butt on every single comer that dared interfere with the little game he is playing with the hot doe he found 3 days ago. He knows she's about ready, and will check in 2 or 3 times a day until she comes in........will you be there?

Like you said Engman, this is what works for me.........I have tried and tested it for close to 3 decades, and have killed over 250 whitetails(VERY LIBERAL bag limits in the south), and a great many that some would label Wallhangers.........if it ain't broke , don't fix it.........
.....but I most certainly do acknowledge that you and everyone else should adhere with what works for you in your respective areas.........
.....good luck to you all in the coming season!
DS

 

[WHITETAIL HUNTER]

YES ENGMAN99 I AM FROM SOUTHEREN INDIANA. I HAVE FOUND SCRAPE HUNTING FOR ME THE LAST TWO YEARS HAS WORKED VERY WELL. BUT I HAVE ALSO HUNTED IN A AREA THAT HAS PREASURE BUT NOT SO MUCH THAT THE NEXT HUNTER IS 50 YARDS AWAY. I AM NOT SAYING THAT YOU ARE WRONG AND THAT I AM RIGHT. THIS IS WHAT HAS WORKED FOR ME THE LAST FEW YEARS. I WILL GO OUT TO A STAND SOON AND START TO SEE WHAT IS GOING ON (PROBABLY WHILE LOOKING FOR SOME SQUIRELS) AND SEE HOW EVERYTHING IS LOOKING. AS YOU KNOW IN INDY WE HAVE HAD A VERY HOT SUMMER SO IT HAS BEEN VERY HARD TO GET OUT AND DO ANY OF THIS. ONCE BOW SEASON STARTS I WILL HUNT A CERTAIN STAND THAT A FRIEND AND I THINK WILL PRODUCE A GOOD CHANCE FOR A BUCK. DEPENDING ON WHAT WE SEE WILL DETERMINE ON WHERE I AM ON THE OPENING OF GUN SEASON. I MAY BE IN THE SAME STAND OR I MAY BE IN ONE 200 YARDS AWAY BUT BOTH ARE IN A AREA THAT IS KNOWING TO HAVE SCRAPES WITHIN 50 YARDS OF THEM.

 

[engman99]

Duh! Now I see where it says IN at the bottom of your post.
So you are from Indy?
I didn't mean to imply that thats the way it was in the whole state,just in my particular area.I live in the middle of the hoosier national forest.Its all hills and hollers with few crops where I am at,with heavy pressure.
I bet you are hunting small patch woods around a lot of crops,and I bet its real flat too aint it?
Deerslayer is in Colorado.I dont know what kind of terrain he is hunting,but he said they had very liberal bag limits,so I would say that the deer population in his neck of the woods is considerably greater than ours.
Habitat,terrain,deer population,buck to doe ratio,hunting pressure,climate,this all plays a big part.
Indiana is a prime example of the effects of climate.Where I live in Southern In(about 10 miles from the KY border)the winters are usually mediocre to mild.The Northern edge of the state gets pretty rough winters.Deer season starts and ends on the same date state wide,I find it hard to believe that the deer are going to be running scrapes at the same time at each end of the state.
I know where I am at the deer really start chasing does about the last week of Oct.(as a matter of fact,the 10 pointer I got with my bow last year was chasing a doe the last week of Oct. until I shot him that is.)I cant believe that deer are doing the same thing at the same time at the other end of the state.

 

[Deerslayer]

Oopps!........I'm sorry engman!......I forget some here don't know I only recently moved to Colorado!....I am from Louisiana and hunted there for almost 30 years. You were probably scratching yout head at how I could have killed some 250 whitetails with Co's 1 deer bag limit!....makes me pretty old huh!

No, the whitetails I speak of come from the swamps of Louisiana and the hills of Arkansas, and the piney woods of east Texas and the River Delta of Mississippi......all these places within two hours drive of my homeand all having very liberal bag limits. I could legally kill over 20 deer a year in these 4 states, and generally did,....but whitetails were the only game in town except spring turkey, so I moved west last summer to "broaden my horizons"..........
Sorry about not being clear about where I was hunting whitetails, so many here know, I sometimes assume.....
DS

 

[1_pointer]

Hey, WH, don't tell them how you shot one of your BUCK out of MY stand with MY gun after Dad had shot a BUCK out of MY stand with MY gun the day before because I couldn't make it home from school!!!! Just joshin' with ya bro.

Give ol' WH a big Moosie welcome!!!! He's my brother so I get to pick on him.

 

[Deerslayer]

Welcome Whitetail Hunter............I knew you made a lot of sense in your post, being 1-pointers brother explains it!
DS

 

[Nut]

Welcome to Moosie's WH!


Thanks all. Very informative responses.
I put a few things in my need to know files

 

[WHITETAIL HUNTER]

YES 1-POINTER IS TELLING THE TRUTH MY 1ST WAS KILLED OUT OF HIS STAND WITH HIS GUN. BUT THE LAST ONE WAS KILLED OUT OF A DIFFRENT AREA THAT I HAVE STARTED HUNTING WITH. ENGMAN99 I LIVE IN THE VERY SOUTHERN END OF THE STATE ALSO. (ROCKPORT AREA AND HUNT IN THE OAKLAND CITY AREA) IT IS NOT A SMALL PATCH WOODS BUT ALONG A RAILROAD TRACKS AND THE RIVER. WE HAVE ALOT OF SWAMP AREA THAT WE CAN NOT EVEN GET INTO AND THAT IS THE PLACE THAT WE WOULD MOST LIKE TO BE IN. BUT THE SCRAPE AREAS ARE BECOMING SOMETHING VERY POSITVE FOR US TO HUNT. THE ONE THING THAT I MUST SAY ABOUT 1-POINTER IS THAT I HAVE LEARNED A GREAT DEAL ABOUT DEER HUNTING FROM HIM AND HE IS MY YOUNGER BROTHER BY 7 YEARS. I MISS HIM GREATLY OUT IN UTAH AND YES HE IS VERY KNOWLEGEABLE ABOUT HIS HUNTING. THANKS ALL FOR THE WELCOME I WILL TRY TO ADD WHAT I CAN AND SOUND LIKE I KNOW WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT. AS OUR DAD ALWAYS TAUGHT US BE RESPONSIBLE AND TAKE A YOUNG ONE HUNTING FOR IT AND SPORTS IS WHAT KEEP ME AND 1-POINTER OUT OF ALOT OF TROUBLE. THANKS ALL

 

[Deerslayer]

Hey Whitetail......just a friendly tip...........ease up on that "Caps-lock" button,.......people will respond better when your not yelling at them!
DS

 

[WHITETAIL HUNTER]

Thanks DeerSlayer just a habit I have of leaving it on when I type.