Officially student loan debt free
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VikingsGuy
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Too broad a range of folks for universal advice. But in the most simplistic, unless you have a clear line of sight to a high paying career I would definitely focus on quality in-state universities. No need to spend 2-3x to go out of state or private if you are just getting a psych major. As said by others - take all the free money you can get - pell grants, scholarships etc. Use 529 funds to build funds. If you are an under motivated or resource challenged student, find a good university system like U of MN that lets you take your first two years at state community college for super cheap but still get full university diploma after transfer for final 2 yrs. If you are pursuing top paying careers and have the credentials go to the best ranked school you can get into - it will pay off. Remember that reasonable amounts of debt put to building credentials in lucrative fields is usually a great investment. Do the math on repayment options - depending on your career choices there are some great deals to be had. Don't use student loan money to f*ck around. If you don't like school and like to work with your hands skip college and go trades -- maybe later go back and combine the trade with more advanced business or later in life jobs (the trades can be tough on 50 yr old bodies). But lots to consider, so one size does not fit all.
SFC B
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I have a law degree and realized in year 3 (after 2 stints clerking/interning) that my personal moral compass would never allow me to practice. That being said, I used the knowledge I gained to not only get jobs but to understand and use the various systems I was involved in to MY advantage. My personal motto is "I may not MAKE the rules, but I WILL use them to my advantage." This is how I was able to retire twice by the time I was 50 and now just work for fun and discounts. The loans I took for that (relatively small since I was also using the GI Bill) took a few years to pay off, but are long gone. Through the hobbies, extra curriculars, etc throughout the years I have done and seen things that I KNOW I would have been happier doing during my work life, but then I would NOT be where I am currently. Life is strange trip that we only have SOME control over. I haven't been thrilled with my now 26 yo living at home the last couple of years BUT he also paid off his loans from grad school and is now debt free. The youngest has her undergrad completely paid for from various sources as well.
I am a firm believer in the military service to GI Bill path. Not only does it fund the education, but it MAKES you grow up and mature quite a bit beforehand......along with teaching time management skills. Even folks that aren't gung ho about the warfare aspect can pick jobs in various services (looking at you AF
) that are VERY marginally military, come with almost no risk and garner all the same benefits. If any of you have any kids thinking about this and have questions feel free to ask and I will give brutally honest answers.
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
Ya - we have a lot of folks who do "what society tells them" without actually working through the details of if/how it makes sense and then blame society for following like sheep.
Nick87
Well-known member
Yah, I don't know that all or many kids at all are ready to make that sort of decision at 18 years old. Society tells them though right after high school it's time to college up. I'm going to urge my kids to maybe don't make any sort of decision that ties you one way or another for a couple years after high school. That's the slippery slope though of actually going back to school after being out. Idk what the answer is all I know is that not everyone is ready to make that decision at 18 years old without some more life experience. I certainly wasn't. A lot of kids don't have a choice either and have to earn there way.
SAJ-99
Well-known member
Don't have them. They have a negative financial NPV. If you make the mistake and do have them, follow the other advice- put money in the 529 early and often, in-state schools, and majors that translate to careers.
VikingsGuy
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Another reason kids with strong families have a leg up - they can help the 18yo with context and advice. And not just parents -- family friends, relatives, teachers -- many adults can help with this if they would educate themselves first, take politics/philosophy out of the question, and avoid just reciting the conventional pablum of the day.
Nick87
Well-known member
For sure, still gotta make the decision for yourself though. What's the old saying? "Good judgement comes from experience and experience comes from poor judgement" an 18 year old kid knows neither.
Khunter
Well-known member
like marriage and having kids for example among many ripe for picking.
We are closing in on a well-planned retirement. Pretty easy to see how we wold not be getting close if had kids.
To be clear, we did not want to have kids as the reason we did not. Was not part of the financial planning calculus.
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AvidIndoorsman
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For an 18 year old today, federal loans, using @VikingsGuy advice for selecting schools.
Upon graduation select the SAVE plan, along with having the lowest (usually) monthly payment, the government subsidizes the interest. So if your income driven payment doesn’t cover the interest your loan accrues the government pays it, so your loan won’t get larger. Then once your student has their first job and has a general ideal of their trajectory they can either stay on SAVE, go to a standard or refinance private. Pros and cons to each and various scenarios when you would want to do each.
All of this could completely change if a Republican wins the election.
unless you planned well for retirement while having kids.
kids don't necessarily change the game - financial planning and sticking to the plan is what makes retirement possible.
i'd wager most people who had kids and are unprepared for retirement would be unprepared for retirement if they didn't have kids.
Nick87
Well-known member
I think this is something that gets very overlooked. Having that military time opens a ton of avenues/preferences as well. As it should imo.Even folks that aren't gung ho about the warfare aspect can pick jobs in various services (looking at you AF
Definitely 529s. In state.
One of my kids wasn’t sure what he wanted to do after high school. He decided to join the Guard and worked full time for the Guard for 2 1/2 years. It was the right decision. I think he would have flunked/burned out of college his first year.
He decided he wanted to go to college and started last week. GI Bill is paying for it along with a few other Army programs including ROTC. No money from Dad except for some living expenses and money my wife might sneak him.
Daughter has three nominations for the Naval Academy and is trying to get an appointment. Her application is a little light so I’d be surprised if she gets an appointment but maybe. Fingers crossed.
I have 2 children in college currently. Both are in state schools, University of Illinois and Illinois State. Tuition, dorm and meal plan for UIUC was about $42,000 per year. $32,000 for ISU. Pretty hard for any family to save that kind of money for their kids education as well as saving for retirement and still have money to live on.
I dumped about $50,000 for each child into the states 529 plan . As you can see by the costs of college this wasn't enough. I will say this though, the 529 money was safe from my ex-wife when we got divorced. If it was in an account that she had access to she would have taken it and it would not have went to the kids. She is a real piece of work.
Community college was mentioned as a way to save money. It is but make sure the school you want to transfer too allows transfers. I know UIUC engineering and computer science may not take transfers since it is so competitive. Actually, I know Comp Sci will not take transfers and actually will not allow current students to change to comp sci.
both kids were able to get some scholarships and grants but still have student loans and i'll have some parent loans to pay off. such is life.
I dumped about $50,000 for each child into the states 529 plan . As you can see by the costs of college this wasn't enough. I will say this though, the 529 money was safe from my ex-wife when we got divorced. If it was in an account that she had access to she would have taken it and it would not have went to the kids. She is a real piece of work.
Community college was mentioned as a way to save money. It is but make sure the school you want to transfer too allows transfers. I know UIUC engineering and computer science may not take transfers since it is so competitive. Actually, I know Comp Sci will not take transfers and actually will not allow current students to change to comp sci.
both kids were able to get some scholarships and grants but still have student loans and i'll have some parent loans to pay off. such is life.
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
It saddens me to see having kids as a financial calculation. Sure, don't have them if you will never be able to afford a basic living for them, but to treat them as similar to expensive pets or unneeded summer home in fiscal calculus loses the entire point of being human. If you literally cannot put a roof over their heads or food in their mouths then folks need to keep their weiners in their pants, but skipping kids to retire a few years earlier or drive a nicer pickup seems like a very nihilistic view of life. My 3 kids are worth far more to me than the cash I put into them. I had my first when $ for rent or food was not always easy to find, but the joy of raising her is the most important part of my life. If having kids is about planning for vacations or early retirement then we really have lost all hope as a people.
Nick87
Well-known member
Sure, blame the guys...
Nick87
Well-known member
Kids aren't for everyone, we all joke about how much they cost or at least I do. But anyone putting an actual price tag on them definitely shouldn't have them.
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Irrelevant
Well-known member
Sure, but how? You have a ton of financial opinions on this thread alone that disagree with each other. I guess I disagree with the idea that making the "best" financial decision means making the choice that gets you the most money because you also have to consider risk, both actual and perceived. I'm not sure that was the point you were making but I felt that it leaned that direction.
But getting back to that idea, how to we actually improve financial literacy? I know I should know more than I do, but it's almost harder to suss out a source than it is to learn what the source is supposed to be teaching you.
Nick87
Well-known member
Can't remember for sure but I think economics was an elective in HS seems like that should be a requirement. like @TOGIE said it should be taught or started at home but that's not always the case. Just about everything I've learned about money and finances (which doesn't amount to shit compared to some here) has been learned the hard way. I wish that wasn't so and it's something that will definitely change with my kids or at least to the best of my ability.
i was lucky to have friends in college and that i lived with after college that very money savvy. i was lucky to learn some more nuanced levels of smart money management from them. the really savvy ones learned it from their parents.
i wish i learned more from my parents about money.
but, i also did learn plenty from them. if nothing else, the best thing parents can do is at least just be an example of proper financial management, even if they don't explicitly teach it. i watched my parents live frugally and avoid wasteful and excessive spending and donate money. you hate it as a child - watching your friends eat out more, have cooler things, go one more vacations, get more/better christmas presents, have computer games and high speed internet and cable. but that's definitely something you carry into adulthood, even if it's something you didn't really comprehend about your parents until you grow up little. but it definitely leaves an impression on your kids from my experience growing up in my household.
i feel like a kid that grew up with parents who mismanage their money or were spoiled, regardless of income, still won't learn much from a high school financial literacy class. though it certainly stands a good chance to help.
