Montana trespass laws

[mdunc8]

Two questions regarding the use of the streams for right-of-ways and hunting.

Can a person only use a waterway to access public land surrounded by private if it is considered a navigable river? I know we can hike or fish any stream, but can we also use them to access landlocked state/BLM sections?

The Montana recreational code states that "The right of the public to make recreational use of surface waters does not include, without permission or contractual arrangement with the landowner: big game hunting except by long bow or shotgun when specifically authorized by the commission." So what does "specifically" mean? Trying to figure out where I'm OK to duck hunt and whether it's OK to hunt small islands that are entirely below the high water mark.

 

[Layin_It_Down]

Check out the "Stream Access Law" in the FWP handbook or on their web-site. It's been awhile since I've read it, but I believe as long as you are below the high water mark, you are fine. Does that mean you can get a map showing designated high water marks along a river or stream? Probably not..... Doesn't mean you won't get shot by the landowner either, but I think you'll be ok. I think there are also different laws during big game season and for fishing. If all else fails, get a lawyer to interperate.

 

[smalls]

Two questions regarding the use of the streams for right-of-ways and hunting.

Can a person only use a waterway to access public land surrounded by private if it is considered a navigable river? I know we can hike or fish any stream, but can we also use them to access landlocked state/BLM sections?

The Montana recreational code states that "The right of the public to make recreational use of surface waters does not include, without permission or contractual arrangement with the landowner: big game hunting except by long bow or shotgun when specifically authorized by the commission." So what does "specifically" mean? Trying to figure out where I'm OK to duck hunt and whether it's OK to hunt small islands that are entirely below the high water mark.

On question 1, assuming your talking about big game hunting, it has to be a "navigable" river but that doesn't mean that a warden isn't going to be an a-hole about it. Two years ago I did this after getting clarification from a gentleman at DNRC and FWP head of enforcement Jim Kropp. I told him where I was going to be, the river bed I was hiking and the section I was to be hunting, he told me I was all kosher.

I got to the place where I was going to start hiking, got 200 yards up the river (it was about a 2 mile hike) and had the local warden start screaming at me over his pa system in his truck to come back to the road. We argued over the legality for two hours and he couldn't get reach of Kropp, who I'd talked to earlier in that day. After he accepted that I was legal he gave me the most thorough check I've ever gone through. I've had one other "run in" with this jackass and to this day it is the only two negative experiences I've ever had with a fish cop.

Remember that you can't "hunt" the area between the high water marks, you can only use that as access. Once you cross the border into public land blast away.

 

[Randy11]

One of you guys might be able to help me on this...

On the ranch I hunt for whitetail, there's a pretty large island (maybe ten acres) on the river between the ranch I have permission on, and the ranch across the river. Legally, I'm pretty sure it'd be considered under high water mark. According to all the land ownership maps, and both ranchers, it's public land, although I can't figure out which department would be in charge of it.

Can I legally hunt this island? can anyone float down the river and hunt it?

 

[Drake4]

I think it depends on the river. But most streams/rivers you can legally hunt between the high water marks (islands included), if you accessed them legally. You just can't retrieve any game (ducks, etc.) that fall outside the highwater mark without tresspassing. That's what makes a lot of them tricky to hunt.

I duck hunt an island on the Gallatin that I have to hike into. I access at a bridge and stay below the high water mark the entire time. The area is somewhat like a floodplain so during the winter there are large, dry, gravel bars, etc.

 

[mdunc8]

Thanks for the clarification.

I work on the Yellowstone and spend about 50 nights during summer and fall camping around my sampling sites. As far as islands are concerned, they're no different the adjacent ranches if they're above the high water mark -- regardless of how big the river is. If it's 10 acres, it's probably safe to say much of it is above the high water mark and is private property. Use the same elevation on the outer banks of the river to figure out if the island is actually an island or a low elevation gravel/sand bar. Typically if I see trees, I don't camp without permission.

 

[thecrittergitter]

It is very true that it must be a "navigable" waterway, which i thought would be easily arguable....not so. It absolutely must be able to be navigated by boat not just by foot access. And yes you must stay within the high water mark, and on some rivers this is impossible because the bank may be vertical on that side and too deep to wade.......

Randy, if the ranchers on both sides of the river say its public land............they would likely be the only ones with issues there, therefore, i would probably hunt it.

 

[Randy11]

I do hunt it at times, but like to leave it alone as it's the main bedding area for the deer during the day. I was mainly just curious what the law would be on it, because it's a fantastic little chunk of land.
Mdunc8, after reading your explanation on high water mark, it's definitely an actual island.

 

[Big Fin]

Not all islands are private. If an island was formed due to accretion, which is the slow changing of the river channel and river bed due to erosion and flooding, the island that formed from the accretive activity of the river is state ground, if it is something that emerged from the river bed, not from the adjacent private land. Wardens hate this stuff, as it always leads to arguments.

There are a ton of islands on the lower Yellowstone that are a result of accretion, whereby the river channel (which is state land under MT law) becomes an island, and therefore is public land. But, expect a lot of adjacent private landowners to say it is theirs. In many cases, it is not, and it will have some of the best bird and deer hunting in the state, if you have a way to legally get there.

Seems like a good place for a cast and blast TV episode.

 

[mdunc8]

Sweet! That opens up a whole new world for me, although I can see myself waking up to shotgun poking in my tent.

 

[mdunc8]

Quit advertising the lower Yellowstone as good deer hunting. It's actually pretty terrible. There's no deer down there. Don't let Big Fin fool you. I'd keep hunting around the wolves if I were you.

 

[Big Fin]

Quit advertising the lower Yellowstone as good deer hunting. It's actually pretty terrible. There's no deer down there. Don't let Big Fin fool you. I'd keep hunting around the wolves if I were you.

I was going to do it last year, but supposedly the blue tongue was a serious hit to the deer on the lower Yellowstone. Some guys I know who hunt that area confirmed a lot of dead deer near the river. It will take another three or four years and the age class will be back, and so will I.

Don't worry. By the time guys sort out what islands are private and what are public, they will throw their hands up in the air and come hunt over here with the wolves.