Maybe we can’t have more hunters

[Hammsolo]

I think the biggest issue with non consumptive user taxes is that those folks will, like hunters want tangible benefits from their dollars.

Hunters want refuges created, animal populations studied and restored, and lands protected.

Skiers and bikes want more place to ski and ride which just creates more impact on the landscape.no need for more ski resorts. My friend owns one and it’s a battle. Climate changes and cost have really impacted them, and there is no demand for more.

Riding a lift with a bike is dumb.

Hell yeah man! We should go ride! We could pedal up. We’ll do something moderate… a couple mile climb. 25 mph average down… 20 foot gap jumps… 10 foot drops… 2 to 3 miles of adrenaline. I sense your a !!!

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Hell yeah man! We should go ride! We could pedal up. We’ll do something moderate… a couple mile climb. 25 mph average down… 20 foot gap jumps… 10 foot drops… 2 to 3 miles of adrenaline. I sense your a !!!

15 up and you got a deal.

 

[Hammsolo]

I think the biggest issue with non consumptive user taxes is that those folks will, like hunters want tangible benefits from their dollars.

Hunters want refuges created, animal populations studied and restored, and lands protected.

Skiers and bikes want more place to ski and ride which just creates more impact on the landscape.

The second and third paragraph aren’t necessarily tru. I’d love to think the 2nd was. I know plenty of hunters that want to expand private lands and want to increase exclusivity. I don’t want that.

I also know loads of skiers and mountain bikers that want refuges created, animal populations studied and restored, and lands protected; and they’re not hunters.

We need to be careful of absolutes and presumptions.

 

[Hammsolo]

15 up and you got a deal.

Hell yeah, we pedal up Mount Spokane weekly. It’s a grind, but 50 mph down dirt trails is worth it. What kind of bike do you have?

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

The second and third paragraph aren’t necessarily tru. I’d love to think the 2nd was. I know plenty of hunters that want to expand private lands and want to increase exclusivity. I don’t want that.

I also know loads of skiers and mountain bikers that want refuges created, animal populations studied and restored, and lands protected; and they’re not hunters.

We need to be careful of absolutes and presumptions.

I’ve never seen a bike group advocate for anything other than trails, trails, and more trails. Pretty much one trick ponies… one of the biggest antagonists of creating wilderness areas near my home town was the bike club.

I agree with you on absolutes and I’m certainly not suggesting everyone who bikes… but advocacy for non-consumptive user groups seem to always to be about “consuming” wilderness.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Hell yeah, we pedal up Mount Spokane weekly. It’s a grind, but 50 mph down dirt trails is worth it. What kind of bike do you have?

More of a cross country bike, Kona Process. Biked a lot in my 20s haven’t done as much the last couple of years.

 

[Hammsolo]

More of a cross country bike, Kona Process. Biked a lot in my 20s haven’t done as much the last couple of years.

Nice! I ride a YT Capra Elite.

Evergreen East in Spokane, Washington does advocate for trails, but in my experience tries to be environmentally and conservationally
responsible. In my time here we haven’t tried to open completely new areas, but focused on improving and maintaining areas already with mountain biking.

I have heard nightmare stories about all sorts of other groups in other areas. Bike groups, mountaineering groups, equestrian groups… even hunting clubs. Maybe everyone not on hunttalk are just a bunch of Aholes….

The current crap show is around e-bike use. Most true mountain bikers I know recognize them as motorized, and follow the rules.

 

[rwc101]

Everyone wants to shit on mountain bikers but they're the only ones who I've seen with shovels and Pulaski's working on trails.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Everyone wants to shit on mountain bikers but they're the only ones who I've seen with shovels and Pulaski's working on trails.

They do love trails…

 

[rwc101]

They do love trails…

So do hunters, equestrians, hikers, and a whole host of other public land users. Never seen any of them doing work to maintain trails. Hunttalk loves itself a self-righteous anti-cyclist circlejerk though. A bunch of Wilford Brimley looking hunters trailering up their horses with mud up past the fetlock are the epitome of rugged individualist public land users while cyclists who dedicate weekends to fixing their postholes are whiney and self-centered.

 

[rwc101]

They do love trails…

And you know exactly how much of a bullshit, cop out response that is.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

So do hunters, equestrians, hikers, and a whole host of other public land users. Never seen any of them doing work to maintain trails. Hunttalk loves itself a self-righteous anti-cyclist circlejerk though. A bunch of Wilford Brimley looking hunters trailering up their horses with mud up past the fetlock are the epitome of rugged individualist public land users while cyclists who dedicate weekends to fixing their postholes are whiney and self-centered.

I routinely see backcountry horse clubs doing trail projects. I’ve cleared trails while riding horses, scouting for hunting, going hunting, and riding my mountain bike.

Bike clubs do some great work. Usually it’s so they can go faster. That isn’t always a good thing, but it’s fun.

As a whole, I think it’s fair to say most mountain bikers are very conscious of trail maintenance, but wholly ignorant of the impact their trails can have on wildlife.

 

[SAJ-99]

Never seen any of them doing work to maintain trails. Hunttalk loves itself a self-righteous anti-cyclist circlejerk though.

Hey wait a second…
I’ve never seen a biker with a chainsaw on their back riding in to clear downfall.
I’m not anti-cyclist. Anti millennial and Gen Z? Sure. But I love old ladies on bikes riding to tennis lessons.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

I’ve never seen a biker with a chainsaw on their back riding in to clear downfall.

There’s a hardcore bunch around here that has done this to clear a pretty epic trail system after some major fires.

 

[SAJ-99]

More of a cross country bike, Kona Process. Biked a lot in my 20s haven’t done as much the last couple of years.

You go too fast biking to pick up all the Mylar balloons?

 

[SAJ-99]

There’s a hardcore bunch around here that has done this to clear a pretty epic trail system after some major fires.

That is awesome. I assume they ride in slow. Can’t image hitting downfall on a bike.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

That is awesome. I assume they ride in slow. Can’t image hitting downfall on a bike.

It has consequences for sure,,,

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

And you know exactly how much of a bullshit, cop out response that is.

That’s fair it is, honestly the only time I ever did any trail work was, a minor amount in high school and college, with bike groups.

Bike groups do put a tremendous amount of time and effort into trails, no question.

Trails are in-roads to the wilderness, sure they are better than people just running amuck, and it’s a chicken or the egg thing more people, more trails and human use.

Call it a Matt Rinella esk. opinion but I preferred the shitty cow path trails in my home town, all the trail work has made it a total cluster-f seemingly year round. It’s not bike groups fault, I also don’t like it.

 

[rwc101]

Hey wait a second…
I’ve never seen a biker with a chainsaw on their back riding in to clear downfall.
I’m not anti-cyclist. Anti millennial and Gen Z? Sure. But I love old ladies on bikes riding to tennis lessons.

Come to Laramie then. We do it all the time. We even have a Facebook group where people report downfall so one of us can get out there ASAP and get it cleared. Laramie cannot be the only place that happens. I can't even begin to figure how many trees I have cleared and I am one of the least active members.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

@rwc101 this quote comes to mind.

“ To build a road is so much simpler than to think of what the country really needs. A roadless marsh is seemingly as worthless to the alphabetical conservationist as an undrained one was to the empire-builders. Solitude, the one natural resource still undowered of alphabets, is so far recognized as valuable only by ornithologists and cranes.
Thus always does history, whether or marsh or market place, end in paradox. The ultimate value in these marshes is wildness, and the crane is wildness incarnate. But all conservation of wildness is self-defeating, for to cherish we must see and fondle, and when enough have seen and fondled, there is no wilderness left to cherish.” -Aldo