Im bowing out

[Deleted member 28227]

You sure about that? It's about right for a college professor at a state university in a red state. In fact, pretty close to exactly right.

I'm 100% correct find me a classroom K-12 teacher in the united states who makes 114k. 38k was my parents salary (each) when they purchased their home for 300k. The equivalent salary for current teachers with the same level of experience is ~52K in the same district.

If it salaries kept pace with just inflation not housing they would be, 69k for the exact same job.

Are you comparing apples to apples, salary of say a beginning professor in 1998 and a beginning salary in 2022? It's not the same thing as saying you personally started at 38k at the beginning of your career in 98 and then end at 114k.

Housing + inflation have dramatically outstripped wages for the vast majority of Americans.

 

[BrentD]

I'm 100% correct find me a classroom K-12 teacher in the united states who makes 114k. 38k was my parents salary (each) when they purchased their home for 300k

Find one that made $38k in 98. That was about an assistant prof's starting salary in in a STEM field 98.

. The equivalent salary for current teachers with the same level of experience is ~52K in the same district.

If it salaries kept pace with just inflation not housing they would be, 69k for the exact same job.

Are you comparing apples to apples, salary of say a beginning professor in 1998 and a beginning salary in 2022?

I of course not, but it's the same ol professor, just like it's the same ol' house.


noIn

It's not the same thing as saying you personally started at 38k at the beginning of your career in 98 and then end at 114k.

I began at less in 92.

Housing + inflation have dramatically outstripped wages for the vast majority of Americans.

True.

 

[rwc101]

We're all suckers. The homeless lady who has lived in her truck across the street from me for two years has spent $0 for housing, and her piece of crap vehicle appreciated 300% in the last year.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I of course not, but it's the same ol professor, just like it's the same ol' house.

My mom's house is the exact same house, same shitty hollow doors, crappy pergo floors, and appliances.

... funny though estate taxes began at $680,000 in 1998... now they start at $12,000,000...

So I guess that's one area that has far outstripped inflation.

 

[DouglasR]

We're all suckers. The homeless lady who has lived in her truck across the street from me for two years has spent $0 for housing, and her piece of crap vehicle appreciated 300% in the last year.

Being homeless was the easiest 3 months of my adult life

 

[rwc101]

Being homeless was the easiest 3 months of my adult life

Even better when you're collecting disability and bilking suckers out of gas, free car repairs, and endless favors.

 

[Nick87]

I'm 100% correct find me a classroom K-12 teacher in the united states who makes 114k. 38k was my parents salary (each) when they purchased their home for 300k. The equivalent salary for current teachers with the same level of experience is ~52K in the same district.

If it salaries kept pace with just inflation not housing they would be, 69k for the exact same job.

Are you comparing apples to apples, salary of say a beginning professor in 1998 and a beginning salary in 2022? It's not the same thing as saying you personally started at 38k at the beginning of your career in 98 and then end at 114k.

Housing + inflation have dramatically outstripped wages for the vast majority of Americans.

While I agree with all of what you said, I feel like there area lot more unnecessary expenditures nowadays. No data to support it just an presumptuous observation.

 

[SAJ-99]

My mom's house is the exact same house, same shitty hollow doors, crappy pergo floors, and appliances.

... funny though estate taxes began at $680,000 in 1998... now they start at $12,000,000...

So I guess that's one area that has far outstripped inflation.

After she passed, I sold my mom’s house in 1996 for $60k. The Zestimate is $144k. I have to disagree with @BrentD and say don’t look at your home as an investment, because that would have been a terrible investment. I brought this up before, there is a lot that goes into the price of a house, and it will never be apples to apples, even the exact same house. It’s mostly because of buyer preferences changing over the years. But I do agree the middle class is all but dead.

 

[thusby]

My 2nd house, nicer than the first one.

 

[AlaskaHunter]

After she passed, I sold my mom’s house in 1996 for $60k. The Zestimate is $144k. I have to disagree with @BrentD and say don’t look at your home as an investment, because that would have been a terrible investment. I brought this up before, there is a lot that goes into the price of a house, and it will never be apples to apples, even the exact same house. It’s mostly because of buyer preferences changing over the years. But I do agree the middle class is all but dead.

I bought my house in 1993 for 110k. Today the market value is above 400k.
Rent over that period would sum to over $200,000.
One investment advantage is no capital gains tax up to $500,000 when selling.

 

[SAJ-99]

I bought my house in 1993 for 110k. Today the market value is above 400k.
Rent over that period would sum to over $200,000.
One investment advantage is no capital gains tax up to $500,000 when selling.

That’s supporting my point. What is that, like 4.5% annual price return for 30yrs? That is horrible. And it doesn’t take into account maintenance costs and taxes. If you put down 20k when you bought and borrowed the rest, I would think you didn’t even break even given mortgage rates at the time and the interest paid (even after tax benefit gained) over 30yrs. Only way it makes sense is to compare it to what rent would have been over the same time frame. Your home should be viewed as shelter and general life stability. At the end of working life it is usually an American’s single biggest asset, but as an investment it tends to be pretty bad. Only way to make money(I.e a good return) in RE is to borrow a lot, and the cheaper the money the better.

 

[Irrelevant]

I've always understood that housing prices around here increase 10x per generation. My grandparents bought their house for something like 7 k, my parents 53k, my first was 187k, I expect my kids will pay 1-3 million. I really don't think we're seeing anything that unusual. The only way to make houses cheaper is to make more of them, but that takes away from existing open space. I'd rather keep being sasshole and not build many more homes. Save what open space we have for critters and hope people quit having so damn many kids.

 

[AlaskaHunter]

That’s supporting my point. What is that, like 4.5% annual price return for 30yrs? That is horrible. And it doesn’t take into account maintenance costs and taxes. If you put down 20k when you bought and borrowed the rest, I would think you didn’t even break even given mortgage rates at the time and the interest paid (even after tax benefit gained) over 30yrs. Only way it makes sense is to compare it to what rent would have been over the same time frame. Your home should be viewed as shelter and general life stability. At the end of working life it is usually an American’s single biggest asset, but as an investment it tends to be pretty bad. Only way to make money(I.e a good return) in RE is to borrow a lot, and the cheaper the money the better.

By renting I would have lost over $200k so what is the annual return on that loss?
I prefer an positive return by owning, plus no capital gains tax on $500,000 than losing my money via rent to a landlord for their investment.

 

[SAJ-99]

By renting I would have lost over $200k so what is the annual return on that loss?
I prefer an positive return by owning, plus no capital gains tax on $500,000 than losing my money via rent to a landlord for their investment.

I didn’t say owning wasn’t a better decision than renting. I said it typically has a horrible ROI and shouldn’t be considered a good investment. There have been a lot of attempts to compare renting vs. owning. It is a hard analysis to do. If you live in the same house for a long time, you typically end up ahead. But if you move a few times the transaction costs eat the return pretty fast.

 

[Flatbrimmer]

While I agree with all of what you said, I feel like there area lot more unnecessary expenditures nowadays. No data to support it just an presumptuous observation.

 

[Nick87]

If you live in the same house for a long time, you typically end up ahead. But if you move a few times the transaction costs eat the return pretty fast.

I can vouch for that.

 

[Irrelevant]

Getting to be lots of little green downward arrows.

 

[TOGIE]

Getting to be lots of little green downward arrows.
View attachment 232252

shouldn't downward arrows be red?

 

[Irrelevant]

shouldn't downward arrows be red?

Down = good.

I mean if you're looking at zillow you're looking to buy.

 

[TOGIE]

Down = good.

I mean if you're looking at zillow you're looking to buy.

i spend at least 30 minutes on zillow a day and i ain't looking to buy.

too subjective, lacks clarity, not unambiguous.... 4/10.