Talk about picking cherries
‘I Didn’t Vote for This’: A Revolt Against DOGE Cuts, Deep in Trump Country
- Thread starter FreeAir84
- Start date
You mean you're waiting on affordability?
- Calls it a "Hoax/Con Job": Trump has labeled the "affordability" issue a "fake narrative" pushed by Democrats, suggesting it's a political distraction, per PBS and NPR.
- Downplays Reality: He claims the economy is strong and inflation has dropped significantly, despite public perception and data showing otherwise for many, according to The New York Times and NPR.
- Contrasts with Past: He contrasts the current situation with what he calls the "worst inflation in history" during a previous administration, claiming his policies reduced costs, according to PBS.
- Shifts Focus: He's reportedly looking to move away from the topic, preferring to discuss immigration, notes The New York Times.
SAJ-99
Well-known member
In your alternate scenario I would be complaining loudly about things I disagreed with instead of saying "let's not talk about politics". There is no point in complaining in this administration. No one is listening unless you can hand them a check.
I think most normal people can agree with the idea of this. A updated immigration system is a foundational strength of America. You and I could probably agree on that legal policy in a couple of hours. Politicans won't because there is nothing in it for them. Consequently we alternate between waves of asylum seekers (some legit and some not) and responses of dehumanizing policies. But in this case we are throwing the baby out with the bath water with things such as cuts to student visas and $100,000 fees for H-1Bs. America will survive, but the damage will be long lasting.
Laszlo Cravensworth
Well-known member
Amid Trump crackdown, illegal border crossings plunge to levels not seen in decades
Over the past 25 years, the only time monthly apprehensions came close to the level recorded in February was in April 2017.www.cbsnews.com
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Which peak? The one after Jan 2021?
In that figure the peak is December of 2023 at 250k. By August 2024 it was 60k and December it was 47k.
Oh, the pain will continue. Look at the effort to put a $12 Billion salve on the wounds tariffs created for soybean farmers. Now they are even more dependent "on the teat" and the bailout is only about 25% of what they've lost. They, and many others will get to bear the pain of bad policies from an administration the majority of them voted for.
Does that mean "Told you so" or "leopard eating faces" is going to convince them to vote otherwise. History says it will not. Saying such, as many D-loyalist do, is arrogant and tries to overlay the critic's values and priorities on people who live completely different lives and whose life experiences result in a different priority system.
Research psychologists have shown that the "told you so" effort only serves to separate us further and results in deeper tribalism. The approach that has a better likelihood with those who feel "I didn't vote for this" is to accept how they voted and treat voting as a separate issue from how they deal with the realities of this moment. Very few who feel they didn't vote for this voted enthusiastically.
Research psychs will tell you that people make up their mind based on personal intuitions. Once that intuition is expressed as an opinion or in this case, as a vote, humans go to great lengths to explain and internally rationalize their position. Even when faced with overwhelming evidence, the human investment in their original intuition makes it very difficult for them to accept a different position. The research on this topic shows that less than 20% of humans are willing to change their minds when presented with the overwhelming evidence.
With that knowledge, we are better of separating how someone voted from what is helpful for them to do in the face of negative outcomes resulting from actions by those they voted for. This is why political parties demand such loyalty. They do not want people separating their vote from the issues decided upon by elected officials. That creates intellectual independence, something antithetical to political parties and tribalism.
In all the messaging we do I state that I don't care how somebody voted. I truly don't. They voted their priorities across many different topics. For me to imply that they should vote differently is arrogant and immediately turns them off to my requests that they take action to cause/prevent a certain outcome; in our case, attacks on public lands, access, and the conservation infrastructure that has provided the hunting we enjoy today.
What I do care about is that they see the issue for what it is. Facts presented before forcing someone to make an intuitive decision lets intelligent people arrive at their own conclusions. And contrary to some who demonstrate a low level of intelligence, I take the position that 90%+ of my audience is intelligent. I'm not here to offend them, nor am I here to coddle them if they have insecurities driven by hyper-partisanship. The majority of folks, no matter what side they lean to, will listen when approached that way. They may arrive at a different position than I do. But I have not immediately pushed them to a differing opinion they feel they have to defend, as happens with the "told you so" or "what did you expect" comments.
If anyone is interested in the research on people's decision making in a summarized collection, the book "The Righteous Mind" is an excellent read.
Nick87
Well-known member
Is there a graph on how many were deported during those 4 years?
406dn
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- Dec 12, 2019
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There are so many variables in monthly illegal border crossings. An obvious one is that the Sonoran desert is not a friendly place to hike in August.
I can admit that Biden's efforts at the border, were too little, too late. One could argue that their late efforts were motivated by realizing the political weakness the border issue was causing for them.
The Trump / Biden debate was brutal wake up call for me. It was so obvious that Biden had no business running for a second term. He revealed himself to me to be a garden variety politician, who places their career, ahead of other considerations. It shows a certain lack of self awareness, that he could have both cemented his place as a statesman, and taken down Trump. If he had, after the midterms of 2022 announced he was not running because his generation needed to pass the baton, it would have kneecapped Trump. Of course, that did not happen, so it's all speculation.
In the months leading to the election, I was very turned off by the unrelenting pleas for donations. I was not enthusiastic about Biden running again. I did give money after the debate debacle. After the election, and learning how much money the Harris campaign pissed away, I'm back to being very resistant donating to any politician. Instead, I often tip very generously to waiters/ waitresses, that provide excellent service. Presently, I have more confidence that they will spend it better than will a politician.
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Laszlo Cravensworth
Well-known member
Biden deported more folks in his last year in office than any years since W. Bush, 2005 I think.
Nick87
Well-known member
I wonder how that compares when compared to how many illegals came in during that time. Gross vs net if you will.
Irrelevant
Well-known member
Do you actually know that? How many illegals have you ever spoken with? Because I've chatted with literally dozens. And picking cherries is to them the American dream. They're some of the best people I've ever met.
Doublecluck
Well-known member
Why pick cherries when you can hang drywall, frame houses, paint, electrical, plumbing, roofing, tile, masonry, etc etc for 70-150k a year?
They are some of the best people I’ve ever met- mainly because they still have family values and Christian (80%) beliefs. Millions of the best people are waiting in line. Can you tell me why these ones that broke the law are better?
Irrelevant
Well-known member
Because there are about 1/10th as many of those jobs as pickers, you get to work outside with 15-30 of your friends and family and still earn +30k a summer. Plus, how much you earn is directly proportional to the amount of work you put into it.
Doublecluck
Well-known member
I have a crew in Bozeman now begging for my work. They want to work 7 days a week, they will cost me 12.00 a ft, they tell me they have as many guys as needed for as many jobs as I can give them. They are registered with the state, they are a LLC, all I need is their comp and liability insurance. They can invoice me and I will 1099 them and whatever happens after that isn’t my problem.
So? Should I hire the boys from Townsend who did well in shop class and pay em the 26-29 dollars per hour that puts my cost at 13.26 ft after taxes, insurance, benefits, etc? Or those guys?
Would you like to know more ways the system only works if everyone plays by the rules? I can write a book on how to play it without any liability.
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Forkyfinder
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There lies the problem.
What will home prices look like if those workers disappear?
