Taxidermynut
New member
Looking at Fin's big antelope and seeing that he stated he dried it wrong for the 60 days got me thinking. What is the best to do with a big buck for the 60 day drying period. How much is normal loss during this time?
60 Day Drying Period
- Thread starter Taxidermynut
- Start date
Not sure how much is normal shrinkage, but losing 3/4 inch at each base is probably not the result of doing it the proper way.
I shot a buck in NV that officially netted 80" exactly. He was not nearly this massive, but only shrunk 1/8" at each base, assuming I did my field measurements correctly.
I think the answer to the question probably depends upon how much mass you are talking about. Massive bucks seem to shrink a lot more.
Here is what the bottom looks like now, due to the shrinkage I let happen. Looks like someone put a hose clamp around them and cinched it down.
Here is a view of the mass from a different angle. Makes for a strange looking mount when you have bases that have shrunk that much, but the rest of the horns only shrunk 1/8 inch from the green score.
The two base measurements shrunk a combined 1 4/8", while the entire rest of the measurments only shrunk 1 2/8". I guess that is total shrinkage of 2 6/8". Should have been closer to a total of 1 4/8", if I knew what I was doing.
Eli Grimmett promises when I shoot another one that big, his Dad, being a taxidermist, will show me how to keep shrinkage to a minimum. I promised him I would probably never shoot one that big again, so he need not worry.
I shot a buck in NV that officially netted 80" exactly. He was not nearly this massive, but only shrunk 1/8" at each base, assuming I did my field measurements correctly.
I think the answer to the question probably depends upon how much mass you are talking about. Massive bucks seem to shrink a lot more.
Here is what the bottom looks like now, due to the shrinkage I let happen. Looks like someone put a hose clamp around them and cinched it down.
Here is a view of the mass from a different angle. Makes for a strange looking mount when you have bases that have shrunk that much, but the rest of the horns only shrunk 1/8 inch from the green score.
The two base measurements shrunk a combined 1 4/8", while the entire rest of the measurments only shrunk 1 2/8". I guess that is total shrinkage of 2 6/8". Should have been closer to a total of 1 4/8", if I knew what I was doing.
Eli Grimmett promises when I shoot another one that big, his Dad, being a taxidermist, will show me how to keep shrinkage to a minimum. I promised him I would probably never shoot one that big again, so he need not worry.
Taxidermynut
New member
Hoping Eli will chime in. Grandma shot a buck 2 years ago that we green grossed at 87 and Netted 85. After drying he grossed 85 and netted below 83. Thinking we are doing something wrong. Maybe he could help us.
BuzzH
Well-known member
From the B&C website:
HORN PREPARATION
Shrinkage of horns (pronghorns, goats, etc.) has been a concern of many trophy owners over the years. It is acceptable to remove horns from the skull, clean them, and then have them reset with a bonding substance as long as the horns are not altered in the process. If a bonding substance is used to enhance the horn's circumference, the trophy may be disqualified.
HORN PREPARATION
Shrinkage of horns (pronghorns, goats, etc.) has been a concern of many trophy owners over the years. It is acceptable to remove horns from the skull, clean them, and then have them reset with a bonding substance as long as the horns are not altered in the process. If a bonding substance is used to enhance the horn's circumference, the trophy may be disqualified.
trevore
New member
Darn near impossible to add any measurable circumference without cracking the horn.
Slip your horns by putting the horn plate or skull in a black garbage bag in the sun for a couple days. Take the core/skull and clean it. Macerate it, beetle it, or boil up to you. Take your horns and invert them and fill them with some bleach water and let set while the skull/cap is being cleaned. When it's clean dump the bleach water and reattach your horns using plaster/vermiculite mix. The water inside the horn won't affect the kick of the plaster. You can also add some tempo or something similar to the plaster. This will keep bugs away.
Then store the horns in a cool dark place. Keep them away from anything that will draw too much moisture out of the horn. Direct sun, the heat of the garage, your truck cab, etc, etc. As long as you don't add any moisture the horn you should be good to go.
Slip your horns by putting the horn plate or skull in a black garbage bag in the sun for a couple days. Take the core/skull and clean it. Macerate it, beetle it, or boil up to you. Take your horns and invert them and fill them with some bleach water and let set while the skull/cap is being cleaned. When it's clean dump the bleach water and reattach your horns using plaster/vermiculite mix. The water inside the horn won't affect the kick of the plaster. You can also add some tempo or something similar to the plaster. This will keep bugs away.
Then store the horns in a cool dark place. Keep them away from anything that will draw too much moisture out of the horn. Direct sun, the heat of the garage, your truck cab, etc, etc. As long as you don't add any moisture the horn you should be good to go.
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EliAGrimmett
Member
To prevent base shrinkage you have to bondo the bases onto the horn cores ASAP. Sometimes this causes the bases to crack a little, but it will prevent them from getting the "hose clamp" effect. All horns are different - some will crack, some won't. There's no rhyme or reason. Generally the bucks that have more ridges and grooves in the bases will crack more often. It seems kind of counterintuitive as you would think those kinds of horns would have more "accordion-like" properties, but they don't. The problem with this is that if the horns do happen to crack it's now up to B&C's discretion as to whether or not you were trying to "enhance" the circumference measurement.
Like Randy said, the more massive a buck is, the more it will shrink. The thinnest, longest bucks, will hold their score the best.
I just taped my NM archery buck the other day that officially scored 90 B&C and I was sick to my stomach at how much it has shrunk after the initial 60 days of shrinkage. It's score was almost all mass as it was only a tad over 15" long with prongs just over 5". Also, my buck was taken within a couple miles of Randy's buck! (Side note - Randy, I'm starting to think bucks in that area shrink an abnormal amount. The more heads we kill in there the more we're noticing it. Possibly because of the tremendous mass on bucks in that area. Kind of a catch-22.)
Other than that there's not much you can do. I know of several people who swear that storing their horns in a friendlier local (say in Flagstaff instead of Phoenix) helps a lot. I also know some people who have tried all sorts of methods including freezing their horns in blocks of ice. I'm sure B&C wouldn't approve of most of the bizarre things I've heard of, but the bucks ultimately shrank just the same regardless of the crazy methods attempted.
Some things I've seen that are definitely NOT going to help your bucks score:
1. Letting the horns stay attached to the horn cores for 60 days. And it smells awful.
2. Removing the horns from the cores and then letting the horn sheaths sit around for 60 days. There was one guy who brought us a 90" buck where the horns wouldn't even fit over the horn cores because the bases had shrunken so much.
3. Anything with extreme heat like boiling or microwaving.
Taxidermynut
New member
Thanks for the responses. on a side note, Eli what forms do you like to use for your mounts? Could you show us a couple?
EliAGrimmett
Member
I believe the Joe Coombs Wall Pedestal is my favorite. Don't quote me on that, though, as my Dad does all the taxidermy work and I know he uses a few different forms from different makers. I'll ask him when I see him again which ones he's using now. I'll try to get some photos too if you want.
Taxidermynut
New member
That would be great. Lots to chose from these days. Would love to see a couple photos.
EliAGrimmett
Member
He said he mostly uses McKenzie forms and a few Coombs. Said the McKenzie are a lot easier to mount on because the hides fit a lot better. Must mean they're more anatomically correct.
I remember that the Coombs give the bucks a more macho look while the McKenzie's give them a daintier look.
I'll be over there today and try to remember to take some photos.
I remember that the Coombs give the bucks a more macho look while the McKenzie's give them a daintier look.
I'll be over there today and try to remember to take some photos.
EliAGrimmett
Member
The first photo is the Coombs. The second is McKenzie.
Dinkshooter
Well-known member
That does not look very "dainty".
Ridonkulous big.
Ridonkulous big.
Taxidermynut
New member
Thanks for the photos. I've used the Mekenzi form before, but don't care for their head. Just looking for something more correct. You don't happen to have pics of you archery buck or you buck from wy mounted do you. Would just like to see how they turned out.
EliAGrimmett
Member
The top one on the Coombs form is my archery buck. None of my Wyoming bucks have been mounted. Maybe one day...
greatbasin
Member
I Pack my sheaths with Borax and set them aside until the skull or mount is ready, then just wash and scrape the inside with a butter knife They come out clean and disinfected, with minimal shrinkage.
bonedogg
Well-known member
Any chance Eli we could have a sneek peek of your trophy room? seeing these two bucks on Pedestals made me ask myself what the rest of the room looks like?
El Jason
Well-known member
Good Lord those are big bucks!
The dreaded shrinkage! Incredible buck pics on this post!
I've gotten to the point that I no longer boil antelope skulls/horns due to cracking and the ring it often leaves around the base. As mentioned above putting the horns and skull in a black trash bag ASAP for a few days and leaving in a warm area is about the easiest way to pop horns off the skull. It may take longer for larger based horns and during cooler conditions.
The next thing to do is to bondo the horns to the sheaths ASAP. It may be a good idea to mark on the horns or note where the horns line up the sheath and how deep the horns lie on the sheaths. I usually put bondo on the sheaths and inside the horns and let the excess ooze out. You may want to wrap duct tape around the horns so you don't get any bondo on the horns and it prevents them from expanding (and cracking) around the base. Obviously you don't want to pack the bondo so thick that it cracks the horns but the tighter the fit the less shrinkage. I've hardly had my horns shrink after doing this.
I've gotten to the point that I no longer boil antelope skulls/horns due to cracking and the ring it often leaves around the base. As mentioned above putting the horns and skull in a black trash bag ASAP for a few days and leaving in a warm area is about the easiest way to pop horns off the skull. It may take longer for larger based horns and during cooler conditions.
The next thing to do is to bondo the horns to the sheaths ASAP. It may be a good idea to mark on the horns or note where the horns line up the sheath and how deep the horns lie on the sheaths. I usually put bondo on the sheaths and inside the horns and let the excess ooze out. You may want to wrap duct tape around the horns so you don't get any bondo on the horns and it prevents them from expanding (and cracking) around the base. Obviously you don't want to pack the bondo so thick that it cracks the horns but the tighter the fit the less shrinkage. I've hardly had my horns shrink after doing this.
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