30 Day Background Check

[marksjeep]

Exactly right. 30 days is an arbitrary number. Did the bill writing folks do an analysis on delay times? What's the median delay? How many NICS checks are delayed beyond that? How many delays are resolved, how many result in DQs?

I think a measure to make NICS more reliable, efficient, and effective could garner far more support, politically.

Hopefully some others chime in with good ideas and don't derail the thread. The discussion is worth having.

 

[dcopas78]

It took a lot less time for me to get a BCI background check to volunteering to teach micro classes to my wife's 6th grade science class. And that one even required getting fingerprinted. I believe I was cleared in less than a week and had my ID card with 3 weeks. Im not saying the two systems compare, but 30 days seems excessive and a way to discourage and intimidate an average citizen away from buying a gun. Especially a first time buyer.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Some context from scale of NICS, not an argument, just some interesting info.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

The table above is total instances, if you divided it by unique individuals it would be quite a bit smaller, but HOLY SMOKES IL.

Almost 60% ratio of background checks / population.

 

[stevejfarms]

If we can attempt to keep this a reasonable discussion.

I'm on the fence on this one. I've never been in a position where I had to purchase a firearm quickly. I apply for hunts, months in advance and usually have my gear dialed long before I'm hitting the road.

I can see a gun being lost or destroyed on a hunt and needing to get a quick replacement or perhaps a last minute opportunity.

Generally speaking I'm just not a spur of the moment purchaser of anything, I bug people on the forum about stuff like tents years before I actually buy one.

Aside from the "it's my right" argument, which I understand and am not debating, what other parts of this issue am I missing, what's in my blind spot?

What you’re missing IMO is that this is a delay for the sake of delay. I’m not against a thorough background check, but I think this is nothing more than an attempt to frustrate prospective buyers.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Some brief googling seems to suggest there are ~3 million new first time driver's each year and around 5 million people moving to a new state. So likely DMV annual volume nation wide excluding renewals/titles/registration is 8 million.

* Please keep me honest if these numbers are BS

 

[MarvB]

The background check should only take as long as it takes the system to spit out the yay or nay. No way 30 days are needed. It's not like they are sending Karen down to dig through archived paper files.

^^^* yep, if they need 30 then fix the system! I was told by my banker that Chase and Citi alone have like 200 million cards in their network. If they can instantly track a purchase around the world from a airline to Joe’s corner gas station I would hope the Feds can figure it out. Hell TSA will put you on a plane 30 seconds after scanning your “real id”

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

What you’re missing IMO is that this is a delay for the sake of delay. I’m not against a thorough background check, but I think this is nothing more than an attempt to frustrate prospective buyers.

Comment #17

 

[TheGreek]

The table above is total instances, if you divided it by unique individuals it would be quite a bit smaller, but HOLY SMOKES IL.

Almost 60% ratio of background checks / population.

It was a wild spring and summer here in Chicagoland. The media here has covered some of the surge in gun purchases.

Gun shops see COVID-19 business boom: ‘A very different panic than we have seen in the past’

Illinois State Police declined to speculate on a reason for what the agency described as “an unprecedented number of Firearms Transfer Inquiries,” but the Illinois State Rifle Association pointed squarely at the coronavirus pandemic.

chicago.suntimes.com

Pandemic, civil unrest drive record-shattering increase in firearm permits, gun shopping in Illinois in 2020

With the coronavirus pandemic raging and Chicago at times dealing with civil unrest, Illinois residents shopped for more guns and applied for more firearm permits in 2020 than at any other time in …

www.chicagotribune.com

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

^^^* yep, if they need 30 then fix the system! I was told by my banker that Chase and Citi alone have like 200 million cards in their network. If they can instantly track a purchase around the world from a airline to Joe’s corner gas station I would hope the Feds can figure it out. Hell TSA will put you on a plane 30 seconds after scanning your “real id”

Broad strokes... but NICS budget $19,888,000 IT budget for JP Mogan Chase $9,880,000,000

The entire budget for the FBI for 2019, $9,030,000,000.

So yeah JP's IT budget is more than we pay for the FBI.

Not apples to apples comparison in any way shape or form, but then comparing credit card companies to a federal agency isn't either.

https://www.justice.gov/doj/page/file/1246171/download

https://www.jpmorganchase.com/content/dam/jpmc/jpmorgan-chase-and-co/investor-relations/documents/annualreport-2019.pdf

 

[utah400elk]

I know I will get roasted on this but...

For what its worth, a 30 day extension would not hurt the vast majority of people. Their NICS would still be instantaneous and they would get their firearm the same day (if state law allowed). Well over 100k a year a prohibited person fills out the paper work and the NICS system is delayed. After three days, the firearm is transferred to that person. Once the NICS check comes back and shows they are prohibited then LE has to go retrieve the gun. These NICS retrieval’s can be very dangerous and are often very contentious encounters with armed individuals. Again, over 100K a year law enforcement has to retrieve these firearms. This is a substantial resource drain for LE at every level.

The delays are often results of a person being adjudicated “mentally defective” (not my wording so don’t shoot the messenger). A confinement against a persons will is not sufficient to show they are prohibited. They have to have been adjudicated. Additionally, many times peoples arrest record shows arrest for heinous crimes and or show they are potentially prohibited. These charges can be dropped, old restraining order on file, mistaken ID or ID theft, or there was a data entry error. In these instances the results are delayed. NICS has three days to clear these. At the end of the three days they currently have to allow the transaction. The 30 day extension would allow NICS to verify the arrest and or prohibition in these delayed instances.

I am not advocating for this just explaining...carry on.

 

[Addicting]

I don’t think I would be upset if they wanted to do like here in MI where you have to get a purchase permit from the sheriff’s office or state police in your county. You can get one relatively easy, it just forces you to get a extra screening at the local level. We used to be able to do it with a concealed permit but some folks ruined that for us. I could be ok with any laws that don’t take more than a day or two to process. Any longer than that seem to be borderline unconstitutional. I have no idea how MA gets away with that long of a time line.

 

[Nick87]

It's the government. The way I'm seeing it if you give them 30 days they'll find a way to mismanage it in due time. They'll need 45 days because there backed up and so on....

 

[3855WIN]

An abusive ex boyfriend, etc has threatened a woman. She gets a restraining order, but the ex still seems to be a threat. She attempts to purchase a gun, but has to wait 30 days. That’s along time to wait to be able to defend yourself against a bigger, stronger attacker.

 

[N2TRKYS]

Yeah absolutely, my point is if I'm writing a letter to Michael Bennet I want to have a brief but well reasoned argument.

I'm asking for a discussion to help further that end. I will be writing a letter and making phone calls, as I did on Rep Jackson Lee's bill, I'm working on how I want to frame things up.

Given the nature of life it seems like 30 days is a pretty standard "get stuff done time frame".

Comparing to the DMV, I've never left a DMV without a license, but it has taken me around 30 days at time to get an appointment at a DMV.

Driving is a privilege, not a right.

 

[3855WIN]

'No one helped her': NJ woman murdered by ex while awaiting gun permit

The recent murder of a New Jersey woman by a jilted ex-boyfriend has prompted outrage over the current gun laws in the Garden State after it was learned that the victim’s permit application had been delayed.

www.foxnews.com

 

[Ben Lamb]

The background check should only take as long as it takes the system to spit out the yay or nay. No way 30 days are needed. It's not like they are sending Karen down to dig through archived paper files.

This. It's also why funding NICS operators is critical. Without proper staffing, then there is a defacto waiting period.

 

[N2TRKYS]

If 30 days ain’t so bad, then why not 60 days, a few months, or why not a year? I mean, you’re still getting your firearm, right?

 

[Salmonchaser]

I was on the job way before we had computers in patrol cars, by the time I retired cops carried computers in their pockets. In any event I recall one time I had to let some one walk I knew was dirty but the return didn’t come back. Normally its almost instantaneous . There were likely thousands of cops doing the same thing at the same time around the country. It is a robust system. While I’m a supporter of the back ground checks having dealt with people who should not have access to fire arms on a daily basis, if we accept 30 days that’s what will happen.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

I don’t think I would be upset if they wanted to do like here in MI where you have to get a purchase permit from the sheriff’s office or state police in your county. You can get one readily easy it just forces you to get a extra screening at the local level. We used to be able to do it with a concealed permit but some folks ruined that for us. I could be ok with any laws that don’t take more than a day or two to process. Any longer than that seem to be borderline unconstitutional. I have no idea how MA gets away with that long of a time line.

Yeah it's insane, from receiving my application to my appointment date to get finger printed/interview with police was 6 months, then 10 weeks to get my license after, talking to folks in MA 10 weeks is on the fast end for turn around time, the officer at my interview said to expect 16 weeks. You have to renew every year for the license I got, seems like I should be able to just walk into a shop show that license and walk out with whatever I want right? lol nope, I can't use it to buy guns or ammo in the state, have to go to NH.

Is what it is...