2020 CO hunt brochures are out

[Oak]

There are years in which I have seen 30 or more bears, which seems like a lot for someone who has never hunted bears. That said, I can count on one hand the number I have ever seen while hunting deer or elk. My past experience would not encourage me to purchase a bear license if the price was reduced or the regulations simplified. And you sure as heck wouldn't catch me messing with bears if I had a deer tag in my pocket. I think the lack of a spring season will always severely limit CPW's ability to meaningfully increase the bear harvest.

On another note regarding the leftover and reissue sales, I was surprised to hear comments at one of the recent commission meetings (perhaps Wray) from McDaniels that the secondary draw would likely nearly eliminate all the issues with the sale of reissue licenses because they would be drawn in the secondary draw. I was a bit stunned to hear such a misunderstanding of the current situation from likely the most avid hunter on the commission. And then Bray wondered aloud why CPW would not take preference points from successful applicants in the secondary draw, as if he perhaps he didn't know that they currently don't take them in the leftover draw. He made a comment to the effect of believing if people got the license in the draw then they should lose their points. Based on those comments I would not be surprised if we have not seen the end of the tweaking to the system.

 

[Slm864]

Also surprised I haven't seen a thread dedicated to the change in OTC for the SW units. I bet they get a lot of people down there who don't pay attention to the change and try to hunt it with their OTC tag. CPW should have put that change in huge font or something.

Limited archery elk in in SW CO

For all those that haven’t heard. https://cpw.state.co.us/aboutus/Pages/News-Release-Details.aspx?NewsID=7244

www.hunttalk.com

 

[Mallardsx2]

On another note regarding the leftover and reissue sales, I was surprised to hear comments at one of the recent commission meetings (perhaps Wray) from McDaniels that the secondary draw would likely nearly eliminate all the issues with the sale of reissue licenses because they would be drawn in the secondary draw. I was a bit stunned to hear such a misunderstanding of the current situation from likely the most avid hunter on the commission. And then Bray wondered aloud why CPW would not take preference points from successful applicants in the secondary draw, as if he perhaps he didn't know that they currently don't take them in the leftover draw. He made a comment to the effect of believing if people got the license in the draw then they should lose their points. Based on those comments I would not be surprised if we have not seen the end of the tweaking to the system.

The blind leading the blind....lol

 

[vanish]

Secondary draw

I really have no idea what they think having it is going to accomplish. People who wait until leftover day still aren't going to participate in the secondary draw because they are intentionally putting off the decision on whether to buy a tag*. Additionally, there's been no indication at all that reissues will appear in the secondary draw.

* - I'm assuming this is because they're hoping to draw in another state or something like that. Ever been in line behind an outfitter buying tags for like 30 people? Boy is that annoying.

 

[cedahm]

Secondary draw

I really have no idea what they think having it is going to accomplish. People who wait until leftover day still aren't going to participate in the secondary draw because they are intentionally putting off the decision on whether to buy a tag. Additionally, there's been no indication at all that reissues will appear in the secondary draw.

Well - theoretically any tags that are re-issued in the ~1 week between primary results and June 5 'could' be in the Secondary Draw, but to your point, that's not specified and probably won't be very many if it happens. I'll definitely peek at it though.

I can imagine a small uptick in the amount of true leftovers being grabbed since there was a barrier to entry in the old 'Leftover Draw' and this removes that. Also a small uptick in revenue from the additional $7/$9 fee.

In the end, the only reason I can see the going this route is to cut expenses of administering the 'old' leftover draw (by cutting out mailings, etc and adding the fee, it's probably slightly revenue-positive to do it the new way).

 

[Kiwi]

I have read the brochure and am still unsure about buying a bear licence. I am thinking of applying for 1st rifle elk, can i get an OTC / concurrent bear licence for the same unit? Or do i go into the bear draw, I do have a point if needed. Thanks!

 

[LCH]

I have read the brochure and am still unsure about buying a bear licence. I am thinking of applying for 1st rifle elk, can i get an OTC / concurrent bear licence for the same unit? Or do i go into the bear draw, I do have a point if needed. Thanks!

Look at the map on page 66 of the regulation book. If your 1st rifle elk tag is in one of those highlighted units, you should be able to purchase a bear tag to with it OTC.

I do not think Colorado's system for bear tags puts undue burden on a NR who is likely only going to be hunting for a week anyway. I see the headache for residents who would like to be able to hunt bears for a couple of months.

 

[COEngineer]

I do not think Colorado's system for bear tags puts undue burden on a NR who is likely only going to be hunting for a week anyway. I see the headache for residents who would like to be able to hunt bears for a couple of months.

This just got me thinking that maybe the "headache" is intentional. If residents could buy a 5 month long State-wide tag for bears, that might mess with the CPW's ability to spread the hunting pressure over several seasons and units (or at least monitor it).

 

[Deleted member 28227]

This just got me thinking that maybe the "headache" is intentional. If residents could buy a 5 month long State-wide tag for bears, that might mess with the CPW's ability to spread the hunting pressure over several seasons and units (or at least monitor it).

Crowding is something that CPW addressed at La Junta, and you are correct, it is the main reason for the add on license instead of a OTC license.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I have read the brochure and am still unsure about buying a bear licence. I am thinking of applying for 1st rifle elk, can i get an OTC / concurrent bear licence for the same unit? Or do i go into the bear draw, I do have a point if needed. Thanks!

Depends a bit on the unit.

Say you are hunting Unit 76, these would be the hunt codes to apply for in the draw, for this unit you would apply for bear in the draw
(Elk Tag) E-M-076-E1-R
(Bear) B-E-076-O5-R

Say you are hunting Unit 52 you apply for you elk tag in the draw and pick up you bear tag OTC
(Elk Tag) E-M-041-O1-R

Purchase, before your hunt.
(Bear Tag) B-E-041-U5-R


I agree with with @LCH a NR looking to get a bear as incidental take on a 1 week hunt really wont thing the regs are that onerous. It's more a pain for residents who are trying to have a bear tag in their pocket all season.

 

[Oak]

On another note regarding the leftover and reissue sales, I was surprised to hear comments at one of the recent commission meetings (perhaps Wray) from McDaniels that the secondary draw would likely nearly eliminate all the issues with the sale of reissue licenses because they would be drawn in the secondary draw. I was a bit stunned to hear such a misunderstanding of the current situation from likely the most avid hunter on the commission. And then Bray wondered aloud why CPW would not take preference points from successful applicants in the secondary draw, as if he perhaps he didn't know that they currently don't take them in the leftover draw. He made a comment to the effect of believing if people got the license in the draw then they should lose their points. Based on those comments I would not be surprised if we have not seen the end of the tweaking to the system.

This link should begin at the really good presentation explaining the secondary draw at the November commission meeting. The presentation is about 10 minutes long, followed by commissioner comments. I suggest removing nearby sharp objects before listening to the commissioner comments.

 

[Kiwi]

Look at the map on page 66 of the regulation book. If your 1st rifle elk tag is in one of those highlighted units, you should be able to purchase a bear tag to with it OTC.

I do not think Colorado's system for bear tags puts undue burden on a NR who is likely only going to be hunting for a week anyway. I see the headache for residents who would like to be able to hunt bears for a couple of months.

Thanks! The elk unit I’m looking at isn’t on the map so I’ll need to apply.

 

[Kiwi]

Depends a bit on the unit.

Say you are hunting Unit 76, these would be the hunt codes to apply for in the draw, for this unit you would apply for bear in the draw
(Elk Tag) E-M-076-E1-R
(Bear) B-E-076-O5-R

Say you are hunting Unit 52 you apply for you elk tag in the draw and pick up you bear tag OTC
(Elk Tag) E-M-041-O1-R

Purchase, before your hunt.
(Bear Tag) B-E-041-U5-R


I agree with with @LCH a NR looking to get a bear as incidental take on a 1 week hunt really wont thing the regs are that onerous. It's more a pain for residents who are trying to have a bear tag in their pocket all season.

Thanks for the explanation. I’ll need to apply as the elk unit I’m looking at doesn’t offer otc bear.

Is high bear numbers the reason to offer otc bear tags? I’d really like to see a bear and it would be nice to hunt elk where my chances of seeing a bear is better.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Thanks for the explanation. I’ll need to apply as the elk unit I’m looking at doesn’t offer otc bear.

Is high bear numbers the reason to offer otc bear tags? I’d really like to see a bear and it would be nice to hunt elk where my chances of seeing a bear is better.

Yep exactly, though I've gotten into bears in units that don't have OTC tags.

 

[cedahm]

This link should begin at the really good presentation explaining the secondary draw at the November commission meeting. The presentation is about 10 minutes long, followed by commissioner comments. I suggest removing nearby sharp objects before listening to the commissioner comments.

Thanks, Oak. That was really informative. I didn't know they were doing mass data transfer for weeks to migrate the application data from IPAWS to their current draw system.

As we suspected, the timeline this year will result in 0 or very minimal re-issue licenses in the secondary draw. BUT - it was really good to hear that they are planning to mold the timelines so that payment deadline is before the secondary draw (i.e. many of the re-issued licenses will be in the secondary draw)

Also interesting that they are looking to use IPAWS for the draw itself (though he was careful to say they 'not that we are currently working towards this'). That would eliminate 3 weeks (!) of application data transfer (close to half the time between application deadline and primary results). Sounded like they had a reasonable roadmap for everything except landowner preference. That is great news given the challenges they've had the last few years. I would be shocked to see it before 2022 though.

I screenshotted the timeline - very informative as it's frequently asked "why does it take so long":

 

[Mallardsx2]

Does anybody know if the secondary drawings be issued with random chances or by first come first serve or by the order of preference?

 

[Oak]

Does anybody know if the secondary drawings be issued with random chances or by first come first serve or by the order of preference?

Random

 

[cedahm]

Does anybody know if the secondary drawings be issued with random chances or by first come first serve or by the order of preference?

Random. McDaniels covers it at about 7:33 (and the draw coordinator references it a couple times).

 

[Mallardsx2]

Thanks! I tired to listen to this about 5 times and keep getting interrupted.

 

[Mallardsx2]

Weeeeeeeellllll.....I know I might get burned at the stake on HT and those top tier point bankers, but honestly, I couldn't agree more.
Colorado has a HUGE preference point problem and I feel that If you draw in a secondary drawing for a unit you should loose your preference points for that species. This is why those top tier units are just growing and growing and growing out of touch with reality. I would go as far to say that if you draw an OTC tag you should not be allowed to collect a preference point for that species that year either. If you want to hunt the state you should loose your preference points and your place in line. If you truly want to hunt that once in a lifetime unit then you will wait to hunt the state. End of story.

Also I am sad to hear that the leftover day wont be done away with this year. I was really hoping that it would go away. Its such an unfair joke of a wasted time debacle....but it sounds like (Unless I heard the guy incorrectly) this should be taken care of next year.

Mic drop.