Which Caliber?

[VikingsGuy]

Dang, I posted on the wrong thread, haha

There are so many of these it's like closing your eyes and throwing darts. Just post your thoughts about preferred elk cartridge randomly on any HT thread and there is a good chance you were on topic.

 

[BuzzH]

Out to 400 anything between .243 and .338 will work for big-game including elk.

Past 400 there are advantages to the .284-.338 on elk.

IMO/E, the times I've found myself shooting past 400 are pretty rare...but there are times and specific places where that's the way it happens.

All I'll say is that I spend a lot of time and money setting myself up for the one opportunity I find myself in where a shot beyond even 300 happens. I rarely find myself in the right place, time, and conditions to shoot past 500 with the confidence I need before pressing the trigger at animal at that range.

Most of the time its not about the capability of the particular rifle/cartridge, more about the conditions and capability of the dude pulling the trigger.

I like to remember that the very worst thing that can happen by trying to get closer is risk spooking the animal or have it slip away...what can happen by taking a chance on an iffy shot are much worse.

 

[belshawelk]

do not shoot elk with a creedmore unless you really know what you are doing, Then at close ranges only. Elk cartridges for bull elk barely start with .27 and get better when the start with a .30.

 

[BuzzH]

do not shoot elk with a creedmore unless you really know what you are doing, Then at close ranges only. Elk cartridges for bull elk barely start with .27 and get better when the start with a .30.

How many elk have you shot with sub .30's?

 

[MTLabrador]

do not shoot elk with a creedmore unless you really know what you are doing, Then at close ranges only. Elk cartridges for bull elk barely start with .27 and get better when the start with a .30.

The biggest bodied bull I’ve ever seen shot took two 100 grain Partitions from a .243, staggered for a couple of seconds, and died. The bull I shot last year took two 180 grain TTSX from my .300 Win Mag, staggered for a few seconds, and died. I’ve mostly used a .270 and seen them shot with a .22-250, .30-30, 6.5 Creedmoor, .308, .30-06, 7mm Rem Mag, and .338 Win Mag. They all died with the correct bullet and shot placement.

 

[ImBillT]

do not shoot elk with a creedmore unless you really know what you are doing, Then at close ranges only. Elk cartridges for bull elk barely start with .27 and get better when the start with a .30.

Just gonna have to flat disagree with that. A 140gr-156gr .264” hunting projectile fired from a 6.5 CM will do just fine on an elk at the ranges that most hunters are comfortable with. Bigger is almost always better, but what I mentioned is fine. A .338 Lapua is probably better at killing an elk under certain circumstances than a .300 Win Mag, but frankly I don’t have plans to use either one. There are factory ammo options in .270Win that don’t meet the criteria I mentioned for the 6.5 CM, but have probably killed plenty of elk despite being “inferior” in my opinion.

 

[Carl 9.3x62]

There are so many of these it's like closing your eyes and throwing darts. Just post your thoughts about preferred elk cartridge randomly on any HT thread and there is a good chance you were on topic.

Pretty much!

 

[belshawelk]

How many elk have you shot with sub .30's?

Its not about that. These new inexperienced hunters think they become snipers overnight and want to take the 6.5 out and shoot elk at 500-600 yards. That caliber was NEVER designed for that. The enegy is just not there. To answer your questions, several and so have the hunters I have helped hunt. Any of them hit in lungs, liver or heart all died. When hit elsewhere like a shoulder or missing a good vital shots all created problems. I personally will cow hunt with a 270WSM or more but for a good bull and moderate rangers around 300 -400 yards I wont even take the shot with less than a .300. And yes I can shoot very well. But out at those ranges things change and what should be a good vital shot hits the shoulder or something. I know all the stories of little guns doing there job, growing up I probably saw a dozen deer drop with heads shots from my with dad with his .22 open sights. They way people hunt ( probably form watching TV) has changed.

 

[Brian in Montana]

As a target/bench rest rifle, I'd take a 6.5 CM. For hunting, .308 all day long.

 

[BuzzH]

Its not about that. These new inexperienced hunters think they become snipers overnight and want to take the 6.5 out and shoot elk at 500-600 yards. That caliber was NEVER designed for that. The enegy is just not there. To answer your questions, several and so have the hunters I have helped hunt. Any of them hit in lungs, liver or heart all died. When hit elsewhere like a shoulder or missing a good vital shots all created problems. I personally will cow hunt with a 270WSM or more but for a good bull and moderate rangers around 300 -400 yards I wont even take the shot with less than a .300. And yes I can shoot very well. But out at those ranges things change and what should be a good vital shot hits the shoulder or something. I know all the stories of little guns doing there job, growing up I probably saw a dozen deer drop with heads shots from my with dad with his .22 open sights. They way people hunt ( probably form watching TV) has changed.

I think many that have commented on this, have recommended dialing back the distance from 500-600 yards with the smaller rounds, probably to 400 and in.

Elk shot poorly, with any round is going to give you problems.

I'm more in the camp of starting people with rifles that are fun to shoot, those get shot more and those shooting said rifle become better shots. Which, means the odds of hitting animals correctly and where they need to be hit greatly increases.

Also, IME, "energy" is greatly over-stated and surely not as important as shot placement and bullet construction.

Elk aren't armor plated...

 

[Losing_Sanity]

Its not about that. These new inexperienced hunters think they become snipers overnight and want to take the 6.5 out and shoot elk at 500-600 yards. That caliber was NEVER designed for that. The enegy is just not there. To answer your questions, several and so have the hunters I have helped hunt. Any of them hit in lungs, liver or heart all died. When hit elsewhere like a shoulder or missing a good vital shots all created problems. I personally will cow hunt with a 270WSM or more but for a good bull and moderate rangers around 300 -400 yards I wont even take the shot with less than a .300. And yes I can shoot very well. But out at those ranges things change and what should be a good vital shot hits the shoulder or something. I know all the stories of little guns doing there job, growing up I probably saw a dozen deer drop with heads shots from my with dad with his .22 open sights. They way people hunt ( probably form watching TV) has changed.

You make some good points and your concerns are valid. I think, with me anyway, it's difficult to think of such a small caliber to be so effective. But it has been proven and has some great reviews. Unbelievable from a small bullet. I still prefer the old 30-06 or the 7 mm STW. But that's me. It does not mean the 6.5cm won't do the job.

I personally don't feel it's my responsibility to suggest something based on my impression of who might be reading it. More so, I will make recommendations based on what I know and what is truthful. I believe and feel the truth is that the 6.5cm will do the job. Now it's up to the shooter's to do their job.

 

[Mako]

I was in the same boat as you recently; debating between 6.5 creed and .308 for the same game. I went with 6.5, although I will primarily be hunting Whitetail sized game and pig with it. I got a sweet deal on a Bergara B14 Ridge through gallery of Guns. Whatever you decide to buy, check on there first and see if any of the FFL’s you deal with are affiliated. You will likely get a much better deal on whatever brand of rifle you decide to go with.

 

[belshawelk]

You make some good points and your concerns are valid. I think, with me anyway, it's difficult to think of such a small caliber to be so effective. But it has been proven and has some great reviews. Unbelievable from a small bullet. I still prefer the old 30-06 or the 7 mm STW. But that's me. It does not mean the 6.5cm won't do the job.

I personally don't feel it's my responsibility to suggest something based on my impression of who might be reading it. More so, I will make recommendations based on what I know and what is truthful. I believe and feel the truth is that the 6.5cm will do the job. Now it's up to the shooter's to do their job.

I get and fair enough. I have just seen to much weird stuff hunting and guiding others. I shoot a bigger caliber for elk and bear, (but it works for me cause I don't mind the recoil). I will take a quartering shot all day and take out the shoulder or even both if possible. I just like to break em and down an anchor them. Same with bears. Break both front shoulders. I have never had a elk or bear take a single step when I quit trying to make the perfect vital shot.

 

[brockel]

I’ve done a ton of long range practicing for that “bull elk at 650 yards”. Longest I’ve killed one is 430 I think and most have been under 150. Last years was 40 yards. But the long range practicing sure makes the short shots seem like chip shots. I’d be looking at 7mm Remington or 6.5 PRC with appropriate bullet that helps cheat the wind as that will be your biggest issue. I’d go those routes over the 300 win mag or bigger as those just beat me up after a morning of long range practicing.

 

[RaiderRich]

Based on the OP adding the comment of "Let's cut it down to 300 yards" I think either will work but I would personally go with the 308 as a general purpose deer, antelope, elk, other critters cartridge. I love the idea of the 6.5 Creedmoor but personally if I wanted the long range BC benefits of the 6.5 I would be more likely to consider a 6.5 PRC, 6.5-284 or heaven help my shoulder 6.5-300 WM. The 308 within 300 yards will give you plenty of stopping power for anything elk sized and under. While you could potentially use either out to 600 yards the question becomes more of a "should you" with those cartridges.

 

[buffybr]

In my opinion, anyone who asks on the internet which of two, what I consider minimum elk cartridges, would be better to shoot an elk at 600 yards, doesn't have any business shooting an elk at 600 yards. So my answer to the OP would be neither, cut that distance at least in half, and with proper bullet placement, either of those cartridges could quickly and humanely kill an elk.

I've killed a pile of elk, and I've killed elk with sub-.30 caliber cartridges, but I've never killed an elk at 600 yards, and I can't remember killing an elk at even 300 yards. My favorite elk rifle now is chambered in .300 Weatherby, and the last two elk that I killed with that rifle, I spotted at about 300 yards, and I then stalked to within half that distance and dropped both bulls in their tracks with a single shot each. I'm proud that my closest shot on an elk was 10 yards.

I go to our range at least once a week, all year. Part of every trip, I shoot one or two rifles from field positions at the steel gongs at 200, 300, and 430 yards. The Weatherby Vanguard chambered in .308 Win that I have now, I specifically bought for inexpensive, light recoil range shooting at these gongs. I enjoy laying down prone and shooting a string of 10 shots at the gongs at those 3 distances and ringing them with each shot. Every week for a month or so before I go on any hunt I'll also bring the rifle that I'll be using on that hunt to the range and also shoot 10 shots at those 2, 3, and 430 yard gongs with that rifle.

Elk are not bullet proof, but they are big animals that can absorb a lot of lead from poorly placed shots, or shots that did not penetrate into the vitals. A poorly hit elk can run for miles and be lost to another hunter or just lost and become coyote and magpie food. I believe that a mature bull elk is one of the most magnificent animals in the woods, and I believe that we, as hunters when we hunt, should strive to kill that animal as quickly and humanely as we can instead of trying to kill it as far away as we can or with as small a cartridge or bullet that we can.

 

[Mako]

I’ve done a ton of long range practicing for that “bull elk at 650 yards”. Longest I’ve killed one is 430 I think and most have been under 150. Last years was 40 yards. But the long range practicing sure makes the short shots seem like chip shots.

This in spades. Practice long shots to make the close shots a breeze.

 

[Mako]

Elk are not bullet proof, but they are big animals that can absorb a lot of lead from poorly placed shots, or shots that did not penetrate into the vitals. A poorly hit elk can run for miles and be lost to another hunter or just lost and become coyote and magpie food. I believe that a mature bull elk is one of the most magnificent animals in the woods, and I believe that we, as hunters when we hunt, should strive to kill that animal as quickly and humanely as we can instead of trying to kill it as far away as we can or with as small a cartridge or bullet that we can.

Hear, hear.

Reminds me of an episode of Fresh Tracks where Randy was speaking of some hunting show or video he saw where a hunter was a couple hundred yards from a bull elk and was presented with a perfect shot. Instead of taking the shot though, the "hunter" wanted to back off to 650 yards because he wanted to beat his previous "record." When I hear stuff like that, it really chaps my hide.

 

[BuzzH]

In my opinion, anyone who asks on the internet which of two, what I consider minimum elk cartridges, would be better to shoot an elk at 600 yards, doesn't have any business shooting an elk at 600 yards. So my answer to the OP would be neither, cut that distance at least in half, and with proper bullet placement, either of those cartridges could quickly and humanely kill an elk.

I've killed a pile of elk, and I've killed elk with sub-.30 caliber cartridges, but I've never killed an elk at 600 yards, and I can't remember killing an elk at even 300 yards. My favorite elk rifle now is chambered in .300 Weatherby, and the last two elk that I killed with that rifle, I spotted at about 300 yards, and I then stalked to within half that distance and dropped both bulls in their tracks with a single shot each. I'm proud that my closest shot on an elk was 10 yards.

I go to our range at least once a week, all year. Part of every trip, I shoot one or two rifles from field positions at the steel gongs at 200, 300, and 430 yards. The Weatherby Vanguard chambered in .308 Win that I have now, I specifically bought for inexpensive, light recoil range shooting at these gongs. I enjoy laying down prone and shooting a string of 10 shots at the gongs at those 3 distances and ringing them with each shot. Every week for a month or so before I go on any hunt I'll also bring the rifle that I'll be using on that hunt to the range and also shoot 10 shots at those 2, 3, and 430 yard gongs with that rifle.

Elk are not bullet proof, but they are big animals that can absorb a lot of lead from poorly placed shots, or shots that did not penetrate into the vitals. A poorly hit elk can run for miles and be lost to another hunter or just lost and become coyote and magpie food. I believe that a mature bull elk is one of the most magnificent animals in the woods, and I believe that we, as hunters when we hunt, should strive to kill that animal as quickly and humanely as we can instead of trying to kill it as far away as we can or with as small a cartridge or bullet that we can.

I agree...but again, its my contention that if a person rarely, or never, shoots elk past 300 yards there isn't a nickels worth of difference if you're shooting a .243 with 100 grain partitions or a 300 weatherby with 200 grain partitions.

A vast majority of the elk I've killed were sub 200, a lot of them under 100, and at those ranges, assuming a person is a half way decent shot and shooting a good bullet, a .243, .25, .264, .270, .284, .30, .338 are all going to require a couple things, a knife and a good pack for hauling quarters.

I've went about full circle hunting elk. Started with a 6mm, shot a 30/06 for along time, went to a .338 for a lot of years, then shot a bunch with the 7 RM, then a bunch with a 7/08.

Pretty well come to the conclusion that packing a light, handy, accurate rifle that's stingy on powder and recoil is what I like...

 

[FLS]

Of the two listed, since you already have a 7 mag, I’d pick the 6.5 Creedmoor. It’s a lot more fun to shoot at a long range session.
If I were to start over, I would buy a good 223 bolt gun and shoot the barrel out learning to read wind, shoot off a tripod, off my pack, off or rocks logs etc. Then I would buy a hunting rifle in an easy recoiling rifle like a 6.5 Creedmoor, 7-08, 270, 25-06, and be one of the deadliest hunters in the woods.