What are you guys paying for gas?

[Deleted member 28227]

Actually Biden has caused some of the hardships at the pump. During his first week in office he stopped construction of the Keystone Pipeline (oil futures), and directed the Secretary of the Interior to halt new oil and natural gas leases on public land and waters. He also reentered the Paris Accord - wonder how much that will cost the American tax payer ????

Red Herring, not applicable. I’ve posted about this several times on this thread already.

How much has that cost the tax payer at the pump, $0.

 

[BigHornRam]

Present market forces at work. You can argue if opening up the strategic petroleum preserve is a smart move or not. One vote for not from me.

Oil Prices Stabilize As Bullish And Bearish Catalysts Clash | OilPrice.com

Oil saw the largest one-week loss in almost two years last week, and while institutional buying appetite has calmed down somewhat, bullish factors are now clashing with bearish catalysts

oilprice.com

"Meanwhile, the oil price bull run has hit the skids after President Biden said on Thursday that the U.S. would release 180M barrels from the Strategic Petroleum Reserve over the next six months in the largest release in SPR history, while threatening to impose penalties on domestic drillers for failing to use federal oil permits."

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Present market forces at work. You can argue if opening up the strategic petroleum preserve is a smart move or not. One vote for not from me.

Agreed I don't think, at this juncture we should be releasing oil from SPR. That's a midterm stunt.

while threatening to impose penalties on domestic drillers for failing to use federal oil permits."

 

[Gr8bawana]

Actually Biden has caused some of the hardships at the pump. During his first week in office he stopped construction of the Keystone Pipeline (oil futures), and directed the Secretary of the Interior to halt new oil and natural gas leases on public land and waters. He also reentered the Paris Accord - wonder how much that will cost the American tax payer ????

The Keystone pipeline would not have been completed until at least the first quarter of 2023 so there is no impact right now by stopping pipeline construction.
Perhaps we should focus on the 1,000's of oil and gas leases petroleum companies are just sitting on.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Perhaps we should focus on the 1,000's of oil and gas leases petroleum companies are just sitting on.

I'm not sure how folks think this works?

1. It's a legal contract, if I lease a house the owner can't just say 2 months into a year lease... whelp now you owe me an extra $400. Leases are typically 10 years.

2. Drilling is based on lots of factors

• Budget, wells can cost any where between 5-10 million a well, so the fed is going to say you have to spend billions of dollars?
• How good the rock is, typically fed leases are massive, so companies might just have focused on the good parts
• Fed stipulations, there are lots of habitat stipulations. Right now we (my company) have a fed lease, permit, and approved APD but can't occupy the site until the breeding pair of Redtail Hawks leave (Hopefully end of May). Are you saying you want the BLM to drop all habitat stipulations?
• Take away capacity, oil can be easily trucked, Gas cannot. Methane is 25 times worse than CO2 as far as green house gases. We (Americans) absolutely want companies to build out gas pipelines to all of our sites to capture all of the methane gas that comes out of a well as opposed to flaring. Building these systems is expensive and time intensive.

3. Feasibility

• Supply chain issues, a ton of materials go into a well: steel pipe, concrete, sand, water, frack chemicals, etc. There are massive shortages going on, further prices are insane, 2020- Dec 2021 costs are up 25% Jan 2022- April 2022 up another 25%. Meaning even if you wanted to drill you might not be able to.
• Time, for Shale (WY and New Mexico) you can drill and produce wells in a matter of months, assuming you had a well planned, and all permits (roads, pads, pipes,) etc in hand. For areas like AK, it might take years to drill a well... ANWR was projected by the trump administration to be 10 years before the first producing well was drilled.

This rhetoric is just horrifically stupid. Likely if you did pass something, companies would sue and/or just forfeit leases as they wouldn't actually be able to comply or you would trash the decades of conservation work that has been done to protect things like sage grouse and migration corridors. It's 100% not going to increase production.

Further if you managed to make it work, you're just going asking for an over correction and a crash.

High gas prices suck, but we absolutely want production increases to happen in a measured thoughtful manner, for a pile of reasons.

 

[Stocker]

I'm not sure how folks think this works?

1. It's a legal contract, if I lease a house the owner can't just say 2 months into a year lease... whelp now you owe me an extra $400. Leases are typically 10 years.

2. Drilling is based on lots of factors

• Budget, wells can cost any where between 5-10 million a well, so the fed is going to say you have to spend billions of dollars?
• How good the rock is, typically fed leases are massive, so companies might just have focused on the good parts
• Fed stipulations, there are lots of habitat stipulations. Right now we (my company) have a fed lease, permit, and approved APD but can't occupy the site until the breeding pair of Redtail Hawks leave (Hopefully end of May). Are you saying you want the BLM to drop all habitat stipulations?
• Take away capacity, oil can be easily trucked, Gas cannot. Methane is 25 times worse than CO2 as far as green house gases. We (Americans) absolutely want companies to build out gas pipelines to all of our sites to capture all of the methane gas that comes out of a well. Building these systems is expensive and time intensive.

3. Feasibility

• Supply chain issues, a ton of materials go into a well: steel pipe, concrete, sand, water, frack chemicals, etc. There are massive shortages going on, further prices are insane, 2020- Dec 2021 costs are up 25% Jan 2022- April 2022 up another 25%. Meaning even if you wanted to drill you might not be able to.
• Time, for Shale (WY and New Mexico) you can drill and produce wells in a matter of months, assuming you had a well planned, and all permits (roads, pads, pipes,) etc in hand. For areas like AK, it might take years to drill a well... ANWR was projected by the trump administration to be 10 years before the first producing well was drilled.

This rhetoric is just horrifically stupid. Likely if you did pass something, companies would sue and/or just forfeit leases as they wouldn't actually be able to comply or you would trash the decades of conservation work that has been done to protect things like sage grouse and migration corridors. It's 100% not going to increase production.

Further if you managed to make it work, you're just going asking for an over correction and a crash.

High gas prices suck, but we absolutely want production increases to happen in a measured thoughtful manner, for a pile of reasons.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

View attachment 218231

 

[F250]

I understand the Keystone Pipeline was still in the construction stages. However, it would be 15 months closer to completion if Biden hadn’t stopped it and put all those construction workers out of work. The Canadians are our friends. They have oil. They want to sell it to us

 

[Nick87]

I understand the Keystone Pipeline was still in the construction stages. However, it would be 15 months closer to completion if Biden hadn’t stopped it and put all those construction workers out of work. The Canadians are our friends. They have oil. They want to sell it to us

@wllm1313 can correct me here cuz I'm sure I have some of this or maybe all of it wrong. I think we're still buying oil from our neighbors to the north. We're just not gonna move it the most efficient and safest way. You know going green and all that.

 

[mtmiller]

Wllm will probably correct me as well, but what we are currently importing isn’t the same product.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

@wllm1313 can correct me here cuz I'm sure I have some of this or maybe all of it wrong. I think we're still buying oil from our neighbors to the north. We're just not gonna move it the most efficient and safest way. You know going green and all that.

Exactly. Caveat if the cost of transportation is too high they might not produce as much/or at all.
But pandemic crushed tar sands just like everything else.


To make everything super simple these are the reasons, in order of importance, of why gas is so high.
1. Pandemic
2. Russia-Saudi price war
3. War in Ukraine
4. Banks investing green.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Wllm will probably correct me as well, but what we are currently importing isn’t the same product.

This outside my expertise, but I believe we domestically produce the oil that is used to make gasoline. The oil from keystone or that which we important is necessary to run the refinery but not create gasoline.

 

[PrairieHunter]

I wonder where this puts ethanol. Corn is over $7 a bushel.

 

[Nick87]

I wonder where this puts ethanol. Corn is over $7 a bushel.

Still less than regular here. About 50 cents iirc.

 

[BigHornRam]

Nat gas is going up as well. I've seen a few places in the past where fleet vehicles ran on natural gas, like around SLC. Is this still a thing? Electricity rates will certainly go up as well as home heating costs.

U.S. Natural Gas Price Jumps Above $6 | OilPrice.com

The U.S. benchmark natural gas price jumped above $6 per million British thermal units on Wednesday, on the back of estimates that domestic production has dipped in recent days

oilprice.com

 

[Nick87]

Nat gas is going up as well. I've seen a few places in the past where fleet vehicles ran on natural gas, like around SLC. Is this still a thing? Electricity rates will certainly go up as well as home heating costs.

U.S. Natural Gas Price Jumps Above $6 | OilPrice.com

The U.S. benchmark natural gas price jumped above $6 per million British thermal units on Wednesday, on the back of estimates that domestic production has dipped in recent days

oilprice.com

A few guys locally told me there natural gas bill was up like 40 to 60% this winter. No idea I'm on propane

 

[BigHornRam]

A few guys locally told me there natural gas bill was up like 40 to 60% this winter. No idea I'm on propane

One more reason to love Illinois!

 

[PrairieHunter]

Nat gas is going up as well. I've seen a few places in the past where fleet vehicles ran on natural gas, like around SLC. Is this still a thing? Electricity rates will certainly go up as well as home heating costs.

U.S. Natural Gas Price Jumps Above $6 | OilPrice.com

The U.S. benchmark natural gas price jumped above $6 per million British thermal units on Wednesday, on the back of estimates that domestic production has dipped in recent days

oilprice.com

It was a big deal at Oklahoma State when I was in school. The campus fleet ran on it.

I never understood why people never caught on. It was under a dollar a gallon and the motors ran forever. Honda even made a factory natural gas model.

Just checked.

$1.50 in Greeley.

Around a dollar or so in Oklahoma. $2 in most of the country.

 

[Derek44]

Exactly. Caveat if the cost of transportation is too high they might not produce as much/or at all.
But pandemic crushed tar sands just like everything else.


To make everything super simple these are the reasons, in order of importance, of why gas is so high.
1. Pandemic
2. Russia-Saudi price war
3. War in Ukraine
4. Banks investing green.

Thank you. While I definitely don’t understand it all, I try to pay attention. Fuel costs are my biggest expense in my business, just above tires and parts in general. While me rant may have not been 110% correct, I just get tired of the blame game and completely think we as a society are truly the ones to blame and we, as a society are truly the only ones that can help this roller coaster turn it’s head. I truly appreciate your knowledge and your willingness to explain it though. Thanks @wllm1313

 

[Nick87]

It was a big deal at Oklahoma State when I was in school. The campus fleet ran on it.

I never understood why people never caught on. It was under a dollar a gallon and the motors ran forever. Honda even made a factory natural gas model.

Just checked.

$1.50 in Greeley.

Around a dollar or so in Oklahoma. $2 in most of the country.

A ready mix company and a local garbage company have quite a few trucks that run on it around here. I've always wondered why it doesn't catch on more too. Here's something else I've always wondered Derek maybe someone can explain to me. Propane is always more than natural gas why can't they deliver natural gas in a tank like they do propane. I'm sure there's an obvious reason, I've just always wondered what that is.