Valid concern or paranoia?

[Bigjay73]

Meh, just another in the long laundry list of freedoms we have given to the wannabe dictator. Guess it's just different when your ox is gored.

Voting has consequences and we deserve the government we elect.

#evenmorewinning.

They were being installed between 2020 and 24. Not everything is about one side or the other, neither one really cares about the issues, just taking care of whichever corporation is funding their campaigns. Issues are just red herrings to keep the masses engaged in keeping what they think is their side in power.

 

[BuzzH]

Issues are just red herrings to keep the masses engaged in keeping what they think is their side in power.

Agree.

Bigger attacks on our rights than flock cameras and not a whisper.

So strange?

 

[jimh406]

Bigger attacks on our rights than flock cameras and not a whisper.

So strange?

Not really, this is the Flock thread. Feel free to start a thread about what the other attacks are if it isn't against the rules.

 

[BuzzH]

test

Not really, this is the Flock thread. Feel free to start a thread about what the other attacks are if it isn't against the rules.

Yes, really.

 

[jimh406]

Yes, really.

Sorry, my mind reading isn't working this AM.

 

[Little Big Man MT Chris]

Chinas already there , it’s crazy …… glad I’m old and getting older , the future doesn’t look appealing to me….

 

[Gr8bawana]

I’m for more cameras. Legal rules around their use are necessary but too much crazy out there and LEOs need all the help they can get.

It's true these cameras can help solve crimes but it sure seems like an awful lot of the illegal use of the cameras is being done by LEO.

 

[MTLabrador]

I personally think ALPRs are already an invasion of privacy, and they are heavily regulated in Montana because of our constitutional enhanced right to privacy. They typically aren’t used much in Montana other than in very specific circumstances.

As bad as regular LPRs are, the Flock cameras with AI are really scary. And as far as I’m aware there isn’t a single law enforcement agency in Montana that has a contract with them, so why are they still everywhere in Montana?

 

[Beignet]

Montana fortunately has some strong laws regarding these tho ga and their use. We also have a very privacy oriented state legislator (Daniel Zolnikov) that will likely continue to introduce even stronger privacy legislation.

Unfortunately those do not apply to private property owners and corporations. Lowe’s & Scheels are our two big surveillance offenders here in Missoula. Shop with locally owned businesses and avoid that BS.

BTW, everyone should be pissed about this kind of thing. We’re slowly slouching our way toward some Chinese level Minority Report kinda chit and many don’t seem all that concerned.

 

[Gerald Martin]

I used to be more of a “if you’re not doing anything wrong then you have nothing to fear” type of guy. I guess life and experience has changed that for me somewhat.

I used to think that since I am a law abiding citizen that law enforcement would approach me with that perspective and I could trust them to be reasonable and fair. Now, I think that I am more guarded in my trust of individuals within law enforcement to stay within the boundaries of protecting my civil rights in their interactions
with me. As such I value the laws that limit law enforcement just as much as I value the laws that limit the actions of citizens.

Those tools that further enable illegal interference in my civil liberties are something that I am generally opposed to law enforcement deploying in a widespread manner.

I have friends who live as expatriates in China and they tell me that there are scanners in public places in China that scan and mine the data and social media on a passerby’s phone to allow the government to determine whether or not that passerby has illegal or undesirable information on their phone.

I’m not interested in allowing our government or local law enforcement anything near that level of surveillance

 

[Bighorner]

Montana fortunately has some strong laws regarding these tho ga and their use. We also have a very privacy oriented state legislator (Daniel Zolnikov) that will likely continue to introduce even stronger privacy legislation.

Unfortunately those do not apply to private property owners and corporations. Lowe’s & Scheels are our two big surveillance offenders here in Missoula. Shop with locally owned businesses and avoid that BS.

BTW, everyone should be pissed about this kind of thing. We’re slowly slouching our way toward some Chinese level Minority Report kinda chit and many don’t seem all that concerned.

Your point to voting with your wallet is a good one. My have to drive past scheels the next time I'm in Billings. Same foe Lowes.

 

[Southern Elk]

I needed a couple tools and miscellaneous stuff today. I wanted to go to Lowe’s, but went to Home Depot instead. I will no longer be shopping at Lowe’s. Enough is enough. I really like Scheels, but I’m going to try to stay out of there too.

 

[Little Big Man MT Chris]

Your point to voting with your wallet is a good one. My have to drive past scheels the next time I'm in Billings. Same foe Lowes.

I’ll be going to Billings Scheels probably tomorrow need some new shoes for CrossFit, I’m gonna look for around for the flock

 

[SAJ-99]

It's true these cameras can help solve crimes but it sure seems like an awful lot of the illegal use of the cameras is being done by LEO.

Sure. I get it. But I struggle rationaling the argument that we shouldn’t use things that might help reduce/solve crime because we can’t trust the LEOs. Sad that we have to monitor those hired to serve and protect. And we can’t ignore that the guy working at Verizon or Google can probably do something similarly nefarious.

The original video was from a woman who implied that it was the government watching the shooting range. It appears that the range put them up because of burglaries at local gun ranges (in 2023). Last News I saw said they have been taken down.

The same people that complain about thieves walking into a store and just picking up stuff and walking out without paying are concerned that a camera would take a photo of them? I bet they never thought that they would appreciate the ACLU. lol.

 

[BuzzH]

On the list of things that this administration has done to erode civil rights and individual freedom, this issue is not in the top 20, probably not in the top 50.

 

[Gerald Martin]

I needed a couple tools and miscellaneous stuff today. I wanted to go to Lowe’s, but went to Home Depot instead. I will no longer be shopping at Lowe’s. Enough is enough. I really like Scheels, but I’m going to try to stay out of there too.

I totally respect your choices of where you will or won’t shop, so this isn’t a critique of your choices but more so me piggybacking off of this to voice my opinion about what I am or not willing to do. Personally, I am less threatened by going to private property or places of business that have video surveillance because I am choosing whether or not to go there to do business and I factor the surveillance into the equation of whether or not I choose to shop.

I have placed surveillance cameras on my jobsite and signage that is visible at the entrance alerting workers and visitors there are cameras onsite. I do that partly as a deterrent to theft and vandalism and partly so I have potential recourse for prosecution for theft or vandalism. I’ve had both happen on my jobsite.

Persons who are not comfortable having their entrance and exit onto the property and into the house are not required to enter nor work on my jobsite.

However, I do not monitor the public road in front of the driveway or the neighboring properties with the intention of catching whatever potential criminal activity may be taking place in a public space or neighboring property.

To me one scenario involves informed consent because a person chooses to come onto private property for the sake of a business transaction. The other scenario (and flock cameras in public) involves an non consensual surveillance of someone going about their personal business in a public space.

 

[Bigjay73]

Agree.

Bigger attacks on our rights than flock cameras and not a whisper.

So strange?

Many, that's a different thread

 

[RealMuddyboots]

 

[RealMuddyboots]

So its illegal to dox LEO, government reps but perfectly ok for citizens? There are no Flock cameras on government buildings. Why not? We should know when all government employees are coming, going and their plates. All for Public Safety. We all know the reason.

 

[Beignet]

I’ll be going to Billings Scheels probably tomorrow need some new shoes for CrossFit, I’m gonna look for around for the flock

DeFlock

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