Unable to retrieve animal due to private land and punching tag

[bushman13]

Probable cause of a crime vs game retrieval

I'm not sure about out west, but in the south a locked gate does wonders for a wandering GW.

A warden may not want to enter and retrieve it, but I believe they have the authority to do so, otherwise what's stopping a landowner from just opening up on a herd of elk in his field and letting them lay.

 

[Dave N]

Illinois says NO. If a deer crosses the line you need permission to retrieve and if none given, or the landowner can't be reached, you have to leave it. Not even a CPO (warden) can drag it out for you. It sucks, and it cost me $75 I believe to find out the hard way when I fetched one on the very last day of season and the owner went in the next day and saw the drag trail and called the law. To make it worse, he was the biggest trespasser in the area! Lived in Chicago and bought this place from a buddy of mine. Most of the neighbors had spotted him on their properties during the season. He didn't last long. Seems like a racoon SOMEHOW found it's way into the trailer he parked there for hunting camp. Couldn't seem to find a way back out. Would have loved to see the mess, as well as the dude's face when he opened the door!

 

[rjthehunter]

A warden may not want to enter and retrieve it, but I believe they have the authority to do so, otherwise what's stopping a landowner from just opening up on a herd of elk in his field and letting them lay.

The law can most certainly enter your land even if you say no. I believe whats being missed here is a search warrant. It doesn't matter if you tell a warden they can't enter. If there is probable cause, they can enter. Now for game retrieval I can't say for montana. But you can't just cook meth and tell the law nah you can't come in and they aren't allowed to come in. I think 7 mag is just talking for retrieval but I'm not sure.

 

[Losing_Sanity]

That being said if MN didn't allow it... I would probably do the ethical thing. If I had a dead deer across the property line and I knew the owner of the property was going to tell me I couldn't retrieve it, I would go get it anyway. Following the law isn't always the ethical thing to do. In this case it would be unethical to leave the deer there knowing it's dead. Would a $200 trespassing ticket be worth it? Well that's for you to decide!

In Idaho, if caught trespassing three times is now a felony. Don't have to be the same property. And land owners don't have to post the property.

 

[Fsmith]

87-6-415. Failure to obtain landowner's permission for hunting.

Here is the Statute for Montana.
Private Property (MCA 87-6-415)
A resident or nonresident shall obtain permission of the landowner, the lessee, or their agents before taking or attempting to take game animals, migratory game birds, nongame wildlife, predatory animals, upland game birds, or wolves while hunting on private property.
• Even if the land is not posted, hunters must have permission from the land owner, lessee, or their agent before hunting on private property, regardless of whether the land is posted or not.
• Access to public land through private land requires permission of the private land owner, lessee, or their agent.
• Retrieval of all wildlife through private land requires permission of the private landowner, lessee, or their agent

 

[Deleted member 28227]

@bushman13 and @rjthehunter

But isn't Wanton waste a crime?

My point is not that the should do it... Warden's have bigger fish to fry and it's kind of a deterrent for people taking risky shots, but I'm not sure that if a Warden really wanted to retrieve an animal they couldn't. For instance let's say it was a bighorn sheep, whose head you aren't even allowed to posses in MT if you didn't shoot it. I would bet that if a Warden knew a ram had been shot and run onto private they would have the authority to retrieve it... the hunter wouldn't' get the animal, the state would.

 

[Fsmith]

@bushman13 and @rjthehunter

But isn't Wanton waste a crime?

My point is not that the should do it... Warden's have bigger fish to fry and it's kind of a deterrent for people taking risky shots, but I'm not sure that if a Warden really wanted to retrieve an animal they couldn't. For instance let's say it was a bighorn sheep, whose head you aren't even allowed to posses in MT if you didn't shoot it. I would bet that if a Warden knew a ram had been shot and run onto private they would have the authority to retrieve it... the hunter wouldn't' get the animal, the state would.

Big horn dead head laws have changed. Still can’t possess if it didn’t die of natural causes.

 

[Losing_Sanity]

And theyvwould yell you if the land owner denies you permission then There is NOTHING you or they can do about it been through this on our ranch a few times

I don't understand... Why wouldn't you just accompany the hunter or allow the hunter to get the animal, knowing that it was not an intentional act? Seems to me helping the other guy out is not a bad thing. Most of the land owners I know help out if they can. I had one land owner send his son out with me to retrieve an antelope. Those dang antelope don't know when to stop running. In turn I sent them a thank you card and a buck knife for their son to show my appreciation. But most land owners are active in the community anyway through church or other organizations.

 

[NR_Hunter]

MN allows us to enter private land to retrieve an animal. I appreciate this from several aspects. We have quite a bit of land but sometimes I'm hunting fairly close to the property line. Well all it takes is a deer shot to run across the line and pile up over there. It's nice to be able to go retrieve the animal without the potential to get in trouble. If I do have to cross property lines I always let the landowner know and they are always okay with it since they'd rather be find my deer than shoot another. We've been fortunate with good neighbors who understand and it goes both ways. I've gotten phone calls about them coming across to track a deer. It's nice to know they're going to be there so the phone call is great.

That being said if MN didn't allow it... I would probably do the ethical thing. If I had a dead deer across the property line and I knew the owner of the property was going to tell me I couldn't retrieve it, I would go get it anyway. Following the law isn't always the ethical thing to do. In this case it would be unethical to leave the deer there knowing it's dead. Would a $200 trespassing ticket be worth it? Well that's for you to decide!

MN only allows trespassing to retrieve game if the land isn’t posted. If it’s legally posted land you’ll need permission.

And if you only get slapped with civil trespass its only $50 for the first offense if that makes it more worth it Criminal trespass could end up being ouchie tho. Im not sure how a person would be prosecuted or fined for trespassing to get game without a weapon or if it’s something left to discretion of an LEO.

 

[Carnage2011]

Last year a friend of mine shot a giant bull about 800 yards from a chunk of private during bow season. His shot wasn’t great and the bull worked into the private overnight and died. In the morning he asked the landowner if he could retrieve it and was told no. This spot is a pretty solid little secret that has produced a big bull for him 4 years in a row, and the locals do not want people to find out. My friend explained to him that he has a really solid following on social media and he’d hate to put the area on blast, but he would do it if necessary. The landowner changed his tune....and helped load the bull with his hydrabed.

 

[rjthehunter]

MN only allows trespassing to retrieve game if the land isn’t posted. If it’s legally posted land you’ll need permission.

And if you only get slapped with civil trespass its only $50 for the first offense if that makes it more worth it Criminal trespass could end up being ouchie tho. Im not sure how a person would be prosecuted or fined for trespassing to get game without a weapon or if it’s something left to discretion of an LEO.

Gotcha, well I would still consider it worth it for that price. By leaving the weapon and just retrieving an animal then I don't see how it could be criminal. As far as I understand you have to be doing something wrong to be charged with criminal trespassing. Like shoplifting from a store you've been trespassed from. That's my understanding of it.

I'd like to think 9/10 times the LEO would be on the person retrieving games side but every officer is different.

 

[Schaaf]

Last year a friend of mine shot a giant bull about 800 yards from a chunk of private during bow season. His shot wasn’t great and the bull worked into the private overnight and died. In the morning he asked the landowner if he could retrieve it and was told no. This spot is a pretty solid little secret that has produced a big bull for him 4 years in a row, and the locals do not want people to find out. My friend explained to him that he has a really solid following on social media and he’d hate to put the area on blast, but he would do it if necessary. The landowner changed his tune....and helped load the bull with his hydrabed.

 

[rjthehunter]

Last year a friend of mine shot a giant bull about 800 yards from a chunk of private during bow season. His shot wasn’t great and the bull worked into the private overnight and died. In the morning he asked the landowner if he could retrieve it and was told no. This spot is a pretty solid little secret that has produced a big bull for him 4 years in a row, and the locals do not want people to find out. My friend explained to him that he has a really solid following on social media and he’d hate to put the area on blast, but he would do it if necessary. The landowner changed his tune....and helped load the bull with his hydrabed.

Sometimes it just takes some simple negotiating... I'm glad everything worked out for you guys. I don't understand why a landowner would say no. It just doesn't make sense. This is where @wllm1313 brings up the wanton waste. That's a crime too! Unfortunately it all depends on the warden and what kind of mood they're in. I have the utmost respect for them out there protecting what we all love. I'd still do the ethical thing.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Last year a friend of mine shot a giant bull about 800 yards from a chunk of private during bow season. His shot wasn’t great and the bull worked into the private overnight and died. In the morning he asked the landowner if he could retrieve it and was told no. This spot is a pretty solid little secret that has produced a big bull for him 4 years in a row, and the locals do not want people to find out. My friend explained to him that he has a really solid following on social media and he’d hate to put the area on blast, but he would do it if necessary. The landowner changed his tune....and helped load the bull with his hydrabed.

mmmm extortion.... sounds like a great guy

 

[Deleted member 20812]

This is where @wllm1313 brings up the wanton waste. That's a crime too!

I can't speak definitively to every state, but I'm not aware of any states where a landowner incurs any culpability or responsibility for an animal that dies on his land as a result of a hunter shooting it. They are not responsible for the death, and are responsible for the salvage of the animal. As such, they are not liable for waste of game.

 

[Carnage2011]

mmmm extortion.... sounds like a great guy

That's a stretch. He didn't say "Let me go get my elk or I'm going to throw your name on Instagram for the world to berate you." I don't think you can be charged with extortion for telling people about a quality elk hunting area.....

 

[bushman13]

I think the sticking point is, it's not the Landowner committing wanton waste, he didn't shoot it.

Sometimes it just takes some simple negotiating... I'm glad everything worked out for you guys. I don't understand why a landowner would say no. It just doesn't make sense. This is where @wllm1313 brings up the wanton waste. That's a crime too! Unfortunately it all depends on the warden and what kind of mood they're in. I have the utmost respect for them out there protecting what we all love. I'd still do the ethical thing.

 

[antlerradar]

I have never had a problem with some one asking to retrieve a wounded animal on my property. When they don't want me to accompany them is when I get suspicious. Had that happen a few time and it never ends well for the hunter.

 

[rjthehunter]

I can't speak definitively to every state, but I'm not aware of any states where a landowner incurs any culpability or responsibility for an animal that dies on his land as a result of a hunter shooting it. They are not responsible for the death, and are responsible for the salvage of the animal. As such, they are not liable for waste of game.

I understand that. I'm calling it wanton waste on the hunters part to leave an animal. I'm looking at as you're committing a crime either way...

 

[dcopas78]

In Ohio, you can call the game warden and he will retrieve the animal for you off of the private property.