Gerald Martin
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Ukraine / Russia
- Thread starter Cheesehead
- Start date
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Poorly thought out desperation move by the current administration IMO. This is the real issue.
www.reuters.com
Hispanics lose faith in Democrats over inflation as U.S. elections loom
Ricardo Aguirre sits near his two taco trucks and laments the soaring cost of tomatoes, onions, meat and cilantro, which have doubled in price in recent months, hammering his Phoenix-based catering business.
MinnesotaHunter
Well-known member
Some things I have been thinking about recently related to this topic:
1. Echo chambers. Social media and the mainstream media have allowed us to preemptively curate what information hits our ears. Does anyone believe that the political parties aren't taking advantage of this?
2. There seem to be indicators that bipartisanship died and the vitriol and chasm between the parties seemed to start amping up in the 90's. I wonder if this was fueled by media partisanship, spawning Fox News in 1996 as a response to alleged lopsided reporting, and allowing the media and political parties to jump into opposing trenches. This was followed a decade later by social media coming on the scene, seemingly making it worse.
3. Do people not wonder why there are two narratives, and that both sides are told by their chosen media/politicians that the other narrative is wrong? Why does this not make people suspect of what their side is telling them?
4. I feel like people have become so defensive because rather than forming their own opinions based on objective information and its impact on them; They are now being told the "facts" (according to the side that is trying to sway them), what to think about them, and that the other side don't just have different opinions, but are liars. All of this further reinforcing the persons need for an intellectually comfortable bubble...
Now bring in the truth patrol....
I am not trying to tell anybody what to think, but if you are conservative and your feelers get hurt by NPR or CNN, or you are liberal and you are offended by Fox News; you may want to look in the mirror. I think that is born out of defensiveness. I embrace all political leanings in my friends and family, the only ones I won't have a debate with are the ones who cannot acknowledge the other side. Personally, I like to be objectively informed and reserve the right to change my mind. I would much rather have a conversation with a well informed individual with differing views, because I get far more out of it than one with someone I already agree with.....
Anyway, probably worth what you paid for it....
1. Echo chambers. Social media and the mainstream media have allowed us to preemptively curate what information hits our ears. Does anyone believe that the political parties aren't taking advantage of this?
2. There seem to be indicators that bipartisanship died and the vitriol and chasm between the parties seemed to start amping up in the 90's. I wonder if this was fueled by media partisanship, spawning Fox News in 1996 as a response to alleged lopsided reporting, and allowing the media and political parties to jump into opposing trenches. This was followed a decade later by social media coming on the scene, seemingly making it worse.
3. Do people not wonder why there are two narratives, and that both sides are told by their chosen media/politicians that the other narrative is wrong? Why does this not make people suspect of what their side is telling them?
4. I feel like people have become so defensive because rather than forming their own opinions based on objective information and its impact on them; They are now being told the "facts" (according to the side that is trying to sway them), what to think about them, and that the other side don't just have different opinions, but are liars. All of this further reinforcing the persons need for an intellectually comfortable bubble...
Now bring in the truth patrol....
I am not trying to tell anybody what to think, but if you are conservative and your feelers get hurt by NPR or CNN, or you are liberal and you are offended by Fox News; you may want to look in the mirror. I think that is born out of defensiveness. I embrace all political leanings in my friends and family, the only ones I won't have a debate with are the ones who cannot acknowledge the other side. Personally, I like to be objectively informed and reserve the right to change my mind. I would much rather have a conversation with a well informed individual with differing views, because I get far more out of it than one with someone I already agree with.....
Anyway, probably worth what you paid for it....
Pucky Freak
Well-known member
Pretty much describes my entire family and 95% of everyone else I interact with aside from the forum. Anymore, nearly everyone selects a set of news sources that continuously reinforce their existing beliefs. There appears to be great comfort in that feedback cycle.
Purposefully seeking to understand the ways in which we are ignorant, misinformed, and short-sighted is uncomfortable and takes work.
SAJ-99
Well-known member
Interesting study. I find it fascinating the number of people that claim objectivity on this site. Either we are the most intelligent object Americans ever or we are all delusional.
amp.theguardian.com
What happens when a group of Fox News viewers watch CNN for a month? | Media | The Guardian
A study that paid viewers of the rightwing cable network to switch shed light on the media’s influence on people’s views
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
There is little doubt in the literature - humans are NOT rational beings -- they are rationalizing beings. Most beliefs/judgments are formed in the brain prior to engaging the parts of the brain involved in rational analysis.Interesting study. I find it fascinating the number of people that claim objectivity on this site. Either we are the most intelligent object Americans ever or we are all delusional.
What happens when a group of Fox News viewers watch CNN for a month? | Media | The Guardian
A study that paid viewers of the rightwing cable network to switch shed light on the media’s influence on people’s views
SAJ-99
Well-known member
Agree. But I do find it odd how a large proportion of the population will believe the most irrational things. Either they donor to explain away why something didn’t work their way or they do it because they are bored and have nothing better to do so the crazy stuff seems exciting.
Tiredofthebickering
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Gerald Martin
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Heresy. Bring out the tar, feathers, and bacon pants.
BigHornRam
Well-known member
US unable to confirm Putin planning power transfer for cancer treatment
The Biden administration says it has no information to indicate that Russian President Vladimir Putin will temporarily transfer power while receiving cancer treatment.
www.washingtonexaminer.com
Bathing in deer antler blood may qualify as irrational to me, but I'm not a Russian doctor.....
"Putin is claimed to have started bathing in the blood of deer antlers, a practice commonly used in the Altai region of Russia. The antlers had been taken off in the spring, when the horns are said to be "soft and full of blood," according to the report from the Russian outlet."
SAJ-99
Well-known member
I still hope there is a solid center that can take in information, process it, and come to a reasonable conclusion. If you are correct, we are finished as a republic.
Nick87
Well-known member
Most everyone thinks there in the center even when there not. Probably you..Probably me...Probably athe majority
Gerald Martin
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Back to the original topic.
Finland and Sweden are banning Russian players from their hockey teams
Finland appears to be headed toward NATO membership with the first vote this month and Sweden may not be far behind
The sanctions, not just on the country of Russia, but Russia's millionaire's and their assets outside of Russia
and Ukraine has not and did not just roll over and play dead as possibly Russia thought they would.
Does Putin look for a way to save face or does he ride this horse ( war with Ukraine ) till it ( or he ) is dead ?
Finland and Sweden are banning Russian players from their hockey teams
Finland appears to be headed toward NATO membership with the first vote this month and Sweden may not be far behind
The sanctions, not just on the country of Russia, but Russia's millionaire's and their assets outside of Russia
and Ukraine has not and did not just roll over and play dead as possibly Russia thought they would.
Does Putin look for a way to save face or does he ride this horse ( war with Ukraine ) till it ( or he ) is dead ?
*They're
i have a feeling he'll ride it until he can save face. my hope is he finds a non nuclear way to save face. i.e. settle with capturing southern/southeastern ukraine - donbas, mariupol, crimea etc. which honestly may take a while.
i truly believe china will slap putin silly if they learn there is any indication he is moving towards nuclear escalation, even tactical nukes.
VikingsGuy
Well-known member
The challenge is, can he have a big enough “win” to save his power position at home? In the eyes of a tyrant, no reason to retreat only to be ousted at home.
This is one reason I cringe at some of the war criminal sound bites - it narrows the window for a peaceful outcome that leaves Putin in an acceptable position in his eyes. I am not saying I disagree with the allegations or that I want him to remain comfortably in power, just that I hate to think the only outcomes are Putin defeats Ukraine and turns to Moldova or NATO literally drives in to Russia and removes him.
We have to leave space for a middle ground unless we are prepared for real war.
This is one reason I cringe at some of the war criminal sound bites - it narrows the window for a peaceful outcome that leaves Putin in an acceptable position in his eyes. I am not saying I disagree with the allegations or that I want him to remain comfortably in power, just that I hate to think the only outcomes are Putin defeats Ukraine and turns to Moldova or NATO literally drives in to Russia and removes him.
We have to leave space for a middle ground unless we are prepared for real war.
Cheesehead
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Agreed on providing an exit ramp for Vlad...possibly even give him a chance to use discount code RANDY for 10% faster end of the war.
I find it interesting that so many are talking about things like "war crimes " and "asylum" I get the feeling that the gut feeling of more and more people around the world, is he lost. Even if he gains a few acres in the south of Ukraine, --- Finland, Sweden, maybe Moldova, joins Nato, he lost and will never have the support in his country he once had, even if it is not spoken aloud. ( or even in the world )
And who would take him, (asylum ) maybe Turkey, but I doubt it. There are a couple countries in the middle east who might if he was able to transfer a considerable amount of cash to them before he arrived.
My heart always goes out to those in Ukraine who were going to work, raising their children, having family dinners and outings , only to wake up one morning in the middle of all this.
p.s. I did not know who the Smothers Brothers were . my grandparents have corrected that void in my life
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