The 2nd Amendment, Gun Control, and Mass Murder

[huntme]

What really gets me about all of this is that the NRA has everyone all riled up about losing the right to own a 100 round drum that you guys don't even realize what is happening to the 4th. Did you know that if you are within 100 miles of the border the feds can search your vehicle without a warrant or probable cause? That is 2/3 of U.S. citizens that have been stripped of due process. They do that in Montana's wilderness airstrips by the way... bring your papers.

Now the feds have proven that they can assassinate U.S. citizens without due process. They can even monitor what books you check out of the library. NDAA that got through the House allowed the indefinite detention of U.S. citizens without due process. FISA allows wiretaps without warrants. Patriot Act, Real ID, etc. Hello, where is the NRA on these things? They are saying banning high capacity magazines is a slippery slope to fascism. Wake up, the NRA is just fear mongering to bring in money.

The loss of the 4th amendment will get us far before the 2nd. If the government can monitor everything you are doing it won't matter what you are armed with because they will just take it. The ironic thing is that it is the ACLU that is standing up for those rights, and most from the political right characterize them as communists. Wow. That is what bothers me...

with out the us people owning guns they could take your property with out having to fire a shot,with the us people owning fire arms,they would have to fire a shot,in fact in most cases,they would have to fire a lot of shot because we the people would shoot back,i guarranty it.

 

[huntme]

1. No
2. The Government
3. Yes

Background checks are a form of legislated control, and I think they should go further. When people say "nobody" to #2, should it be legal to own grenades, missiles, nuclear weapons? I think we do need better control over the types of weapons that are in the hands of civilians. I understand that any kind of registry opens the door to confiscation, but I also think we need to get a better handle on straw purchases and the secondary gun market (I don't know how you do it though).

again,if we cant own it ?then why should our government own it?if we cant use it?then why should our government use it?
so yes,if our government uses it then we should be able to use it,if you want to take gun violence out of the equation,then outlaw the possesion of firearms,missles,knives,chucks,battleaxes,cars, trucks, ships,and the like,from all people,and governments,then we would not have be having this dissusion.
now,what are the odds of that happening?
here are the odds, 0 to none.:hump:

 

[RobG]

with out the us people owning guns they could take your property with out having to fire a shot,with the us people owning fire arms,they would have to fire a shot,in fact in most cases,they would have to fire a lot of shot because we the people would shoot back,i guarranty it.

I gave up on responding a while back... but not much else going on so I'll just say that if they come after your property it will be done by a kid 1000 miles away piloting a drone. No more gunfights at the OK. People are so focused on the 2nd that they've elected people who have gutted the 4th in the name of National Security. Now it has become so weak that the government can come up with a reason to covertly monitor your every move. If they know where you are, it doesn't matter how well armed you are.

 

[RobG]

And since it is really late I'm going to solve this problem without taking assault rifles from anyone. You can have them, they just need to be colored bright fuchsia with silver glitter flowers.

(ps, I know the term "assault rifle" is a meaningless designation).

 

[huntme]

If you have not read the link provided, it is the best use of ten minute of this day. Glad some guys posted it here.

fin-on this i can agree,good article,well written.

 

[huntme]

I can't believe the stupid friggin media would put that as a headline when she's protecting herself and her kids from a thug like that!!! Too bad she didn't blow his fuggin head off!!!

again topgun,we agree,if we are not carefull,we might just find out that both of us might have something in common.:hump:

 

[huntme]

Too bad she didn't have a .44

to bad she didi not use a 12 guage,right about chest level.

 

[Lawnboy]

And here's another. Click on the video feed.
http://www.fishgame.com/webnews.php?p=16038

 

[npaden]

I actually looked the numbers up to post in another discussion. It's actually almost ten times as many people killed with knives, clubs, fists, etc. as with rifles.

Here's my quote from my other post.

According the the FBI crime statistics, 323 people were killed with rifles in 2011. This includes but is not limited to semi-automatic AR-15 style rifles. (The dreaded "assualt" rifles). This is compared to 1,694 people killed with knives and cutting instruments, 496 killed with blunt objects (clubs, hammers, etc.), and 728 killed with personal weapons (hands, feet, fists, etc.). That's a total of 2,918 people killed with knives, clubs, fists, etc. compared to 323 people killed with ALL rifles which includes the dreaded "assault" rifles. In addition the murder rate with rifles has been steadily declining over the last 5 years (and the last 30 for that matter).

Here's the direct link to the FBI statistics if you are interested - http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8

 

[dustinf]

I gave up on responding a while back... but not much else going on so I'll just say that if they come after your property it will be done by a kid 1000 miles away piloting a drone. No more gunfights at the OK. People are so focused on the 2nd that they've elected people who have gutted the 4th in the name of National Security. Now it has become so weak that the government can come up with a reason to covertly monitor your every move. If they know where you are, it doesn't matter how well armed you are.

Well said.

Something like 2 million people everyday have their 4th amendment right violated just to board an aircraft. Guilty until proven innocent by some x-ray machine...

Not to mention, processing nearly every email and cell phone call with super computers, searching for "terrorists." I guess dialing a phone is probable cause...

Where was the outrage when GW used an executive order to bypass the Bill of Rights?

Google the Patriot Act to learn all the gory details.

 

[noharleyyet]

TASS is exempt?


http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/no-gun-magazine-charges-for-david-gregory-86079.html

 

[BB33]

Semi-automatic weapons have been around for more than 100 years and revolvers even longer. Why is it just now an issue? What has changed? My answer is Culture. In the past 10 years look at the difference in: movies, TV shows, video games, God, and the way we can raise our children. It’s a psychological concern, not a physical one.

 

[schmalts]

Well said.

Something like 2 million people everyday have their 4th amendment right violated just to board an aircraft. Guilty until proven innocent by some x-ray machine...

Not to mention, processing nearly every email and cell phone call with super computers, searching for "terrorists." I guess dialing a phone is probable cause...

Where was the outrage when GW used an executive order to bypass the Bill of Rights?

Google the Patriot Act to learn all the gory details.

That is a bit off considering there is no "right to fly on an airline" This was discussed before, you welcome to take a train or bus or even drive so there are many options to travel if you do not like the airline policy.

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

No, Nobody, No

I think until we change our cultural values to place personal responsibility as a priority, and then hold people accountable for their actions. This needs to start at an early age. Any ban on weapons will be useless. People have been killing other people for thousands of years, the invention of the AR-15 isn't where it started. Cain killed Abel with a rock.

Where do children learn morals these days? Where do they build a moral and ethical foundation that guides them away from this type of behavior? Not in school. Less people go to church. More kids are being born into single parent homes (not that being a single parent is bad, but you have exactly 50% as many parents to show the kid the right path and in the vacuum they are raised by their peers). Show me one mainstream positive male role model (because boys are born with testicles and testosterone, so if we cannot find them a positive way to use those resources we are going to have issues, and telling a boy to essentially act like a woman is going to lead to some real messed up behavior).

I just wish people would quit trying to blame our societies problems on things that they aren't responsible for, would take a look in the mirror, and would start taking responsibility for their actions. Assault weapons are just a scapegoat for a larger problem in society.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

Exactly correct MH, but try telling that to all the looney Legislators in DC!

 

[Sytes]

2nd Amendment is for the right to hunt, correct?

Never thought the 1st Amendment would be the lead assault upon the 2nd... Always thought the 1st was secured by our 2nd - I could be wrong though...

 

[rhomas]

Since "assault weapons" aren't actually the point of focus, the entire controversy shouldn't exist. Those guns are and have been regulated for years!!!!!

As for Bush and the Bill of Rights, the original intent was a good one ( I believe that many of us also thought it was a good measure at the time), since it was designed to find and exterminate Muslim terrorists as a preventive measure. Remember, all of both houses and both parties pretty much went along without complaint. The problem lies in the fact that it didn't have a sundown clause attached and since then the Patriot Act has provided more Government interference and has allowed the Feds to commit more illegal acts than it's prevented.

 

[Maineguide]

The 2nd amendment was wrote for the peoples protection from the government, not for hunting period. Also 3.5% of violent crimes where commited by so called "assualt wepons" so that dosent really address the problem.

 

[Sytes]

The 2nd amendment was wrote for the peoples protection from the government, not for hunting period. Also 3.5% of violent crimes where commited by so called "assualt wepons" so that dosent really address the problem.

Guess my humor flew right over ya, eh? No worries, I once fell for a bus parked on the front yard post... haha!

 

[dustinf]

That is a bit off considering there is no "right to fly on an airline" This was discussed before, you welcome to take a train or bus or even drive so there are many options to travel if you do not like the airline policy.

It's not an airline policy. They are federal government regulations, enforced by a federal government agency.

There is no right to own an AR-15, you are welcome to own a bolt-action, single action, or musket.

I'm not saying either thought is right. What I'm trying to say is, our rights have been eroding for decades. After 9/11, the government used emotion to violate many of our rights. Now, the government is using emotion after Newtown.