Quiet Waters Act Proposed by The Back country Hunters and Anglers

fowl_minded

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I am just going start out by saying that i have posted this on many of the threads on here, because i believe this thing needs to blow up and everyone needs to be aware of this situation. If you haven't heard already the BHA has submitted a proprosal before the commissioners of the state appointed by no one else besides Gov. Bullock. One of these board members of the commission is Dan Vermillion (Dan is very involved the BHA as well, funny how that works). Im sure that some people on here know him, and he could be an ok guy. But what he is doing is totally wrong and guided by his own self interest so he can make more money. Dan is an outfitter in the Livingston area he also runs a guide school that teaches guide to run jets, and yet he wants them taken away.WHAT! SERIOUSLY? YES The BHA has proposed many shut downs on rivers and streams to motorized watercraft and it has also limited the horse power rating as well.( nothing more then a 10hp motor) There's a lot of grey area on this issue as well, how it got accepted by fwp when they were later turning it in,theres a lot of big money going towards this, including a 900k donation so a judge somehow? WHAT THE HELL IS THAT!:mad: Another issue is where did they get all the information for this, like it wont affect small business boat shops, hotels , restaurants their response to that was well we just know that it wont affect them and that is the way it is! Another weird thing is how quiet they are trying to keep it. Its not in any of the papers and its not on their social media accounts so whats the deal here? I will post the link below for all the details.


First of all can someone explain to me the definition of "quiet" in the phrase "quiet waters act" this board or commission (or what ever their chicken shit ass is) which by the way they've never been to any of the public comment meeting makes it sound like the reason for this petition its so noisy because of the bigger boats in the water. I mean how many miles of freaking train track or highways and interstates are running along the rivers and streams. And second you can't tell me that some over worked 10hp motor is any quieter then my 175hp jet. so please explain to me "quiet" waters.

http://fwp.mt.gov/news/publicNotices/rules/pn_0218.html

now heres my 2 cents on this isssue
I for one have a jet boat I've also had a raft and a drift boat i use all of them a great deal whether its hunting or fishing or just out taking the family and having a good time. i love the water i grew up on it and i intend for my kids to as well. Its my right use it appropriately and with the respect for my fellow outdoors man and land owners along the waters. this issue is huge concern because who know if the get this thing through whats next? more stretches of rivers, elimination of 2 strokes, who knows. Last night i attended a public comment meeting at the FWP office in Billings and there was about 200 people there as well. A lot of them not happy and very strongly voicing their opinions to the BHA via video conference. a big thing that jumps out to me is that this issue divides sportsman, when we should becoming together as a whole. We have a lot bigger things to worry about weather it be access issues, losing places to hunt and fish and recreate to big money moving into the state, the list goes on and on. Why would anyone want to do that, why would anyone want to devide us? The next thing you know they'll shut down huge portions of the Missouri and Yellowstone and Bighorn, on and on and on. if anything should be limited its the amount of outfitters and guides that are just piss pounding these rivers and streams. Look at good earth and count how many drift boats are in the upper three miles stretch of the Bighorn its ridiculous. I've been out on the rivers for about 15 years and never once have i ever had an issue with another jet boater, I've have more run ins with guides and clients that think just because they're making money on it or the client is paying for a guide that its their river or their secret hole. NEWSFLASH IT ISNT YOURS I for one am totally against it and anything it stands for and im with a huge group of guys that will stand up and fight for this. i dont know why we cant all just get along for once and use these precious gifts along side with one another. After the meeting i came home and watched a movie....... 13 Hours the Benghazi story.BADASS While Im watching it and watching the hell those incredibly brave individuals went through fighting for our freedom and for us to be able to use these resources we are sitting around here arguing about it. COME ON GUYS AND GALS Cant we all just get along and share. I hope this goes viral in the Montana outdoor community and people step up and say this is just plan wrong. please share with your buddies and family, if this passes we are gonna lose access around the state in numbers that i cant imagine! We're fighting already to keep what we got and now we have a group of outdoors man trying to take it away. WHERE DOES ANY OF THAT MAKE SENSE I for one have respect for anyone using the water and i would never want to have a conflict or try to tell someone how to recreate and i expect the same from them as well. i hope this opens a huge can of worms. If its a fight they want well give it to them. Thanks
 
Not sure where to start...If you want to engage folks in a constructive conversation (I don't think that was the point of your post), I'd recommend basing your argument on facts, not emotion, and get rid of bolded words in all caps.
 
For me specifically. The Yellowstone river . I know a few guys that fish tailwaters or areas off of the Missouri River. Sounds like a lot of people fish the Marias above Tiber reservoir The point is that these things never seem to stop once in place. What will be next ...... a river you recreate on? I love some of the responses I get on this site cute little one liners made by keyboard ninja. It's just great, look at the big picture of this. You can't tell me that if you use public water ways that this will not affect you in one way or another.
 
Wow is there really that many guys in Montana running around in hovercrafts? Jetboats, airboats, and Jetskis have all been around for along time. I'm not in Montana so I don't know, but is there really that big of a influx of these watercraft in recent years? All seems a bit silly to me.
 
There are certainly controversial parts when it comes to restrictions on the larger rivers, but certain groups are lying their butts off about this proposal. Now I see they are accusing people of paying off judges? Wow.

Making things far worse than they should be, the paralegal at FWP is doing a really terrible job because she doesn't like the proposal. She's making it look like BHA is turning a massive amount of rivers into non-motorized or < 10hp when in fact the rivers already have the restrictions. I wrote the FWP to complain about the presenation, even though I'm not directly representing BHA.

If you are worried about the impact, please read the petition by BHA. Background info is here. You may have issues with certain parts and that is fine, but it is not the end of the world as some people would claim.
 
Wow is there really that many guys in Montana running around in hovercrafts? Jetboats, airboats, and Jetskis have all been around for along time. I'm not in Montana so I don't know, but is there really that big of a influx of these watercraft in recent years? All seems a bit silly to me.
It is about being proactive - protecting the waters before it becomes a problem, especially as technology improves - motorized surf boards are an example. When use becomes common it becomes very difficult to fix as the motorized groups will say they are taking away their rights, etc.
 
There are certainly controversial parts when it comes to restrictions on the larger rivers, but certain groups are lying their butts off about this proposal. Now I see they are accusing people of paying off judges? Wow.

Making things far worse than they should be, the paralegal at FWP is doing a really terrible job because she doesn't like the proposal. She's making it look like BHA is turning a massive amount of rivers into non-motorized or < 10hp when in fact the rivers already have the restrictions. I wrote the FWP to complain about the presenation, even though I'm not directly representing BHA.

If you are worried about the impact, please read the petition by BHA. Background info is here. You may have issues with certain parts and that is fine, but it is not the end of the world as some people would claim.

http://www.plwa.org/viewarticle.php?id=300
 
I looked at the map,it would appear that most of the waters are tribs.no problem with that.i like quiet water and quiet trails myself.
 
For me specifically. The Yellowstone river . I know a few guys that fish tailwaters or areas off of the Missouri River. Sounds like a lot of people fish the Marias above Tiber reservoir The point is that these things never seem to stop once in place. What will be next ...... a river you recreate on? I love some of the responses I get on this site cute little one liners made by keyboard ninja. It's just great, look at the big picture of this. You can't tell me that if you use public water ways that this will not affect you in one way or another.

Thought I would give you some time to re-read your rant and look at how much crap you drug into it. Try to stay on point.

First off, the rivers aren't YOURS any more than they're MINE. When there are 2 or more conflicting views/uses of any resource there is going to be discussions about what level of use is appropriate. Also, when you state that you should have the "right" to roar up a river in a jet boat...I have to ask where, and at what point, do your rights infringe on mine? Try to put yourself in the place of the other person.

As to Montana rivers, I can tell you that things have changed a shitload since I was a kid. I remember fishing the Blackfoot, Clark Fork, rock creek, and never seeing a boat of any kind on either river. I well remember fishing the Alberton gorge, on foot, and never seeing a single raft. Then it started with Western Waters, a couple rafts a day, then private guys with kayaks, then even jet boats. Got to be such a cluster shag, I quit fishing it at the best times (when the river was dropping and clearing). Not worth it to have your lines run over by rafts, kayaks, and jet boats roaring up and down the river. Not why I fished the gorge.

IMO/E, its also much easier to get in front of potential problems before they become a bigger problem.

If I still lived in Montana, I would probably be asking all river users to start collaborating and discussing the issue of jet boats and other motor powered water craft, as well as looking at the issues of crowding, appropriate levels of use, seasonal closures, perhaps certain days of the week for certain uses, etc. etc.

Going scorched earth at the start isn't going to gain much traction...

To fly off the handle and bring Benghazi, kids, etc. trying to play victim, isn't going to be received well...here or anywhere else.
 

To be perfectly clear, Judge McKinnon's election was bolstered by people like James Cox Kennedy & Charles Schwab due to their dislike of our stream access law. Kennedy is a major donor to Ducks Unlimited, not BHA to my knowledge.

I'll let the guys who know the proposal well defend it. It didn't seem like a bad idea to me, as a wading fisherman who has been swamped by jet boats in the past.
 
Fowl - not to put too fine a point on it, but you are acting delusional by suggesting anyone involved in BHA was responsible for that, and PLWA would certainly verify that if you were to contact them. I have no idea how you could connect the dots there. Perhaps you are confusing BHA with Ducks Unlimited who has Cox-Kennedy on their board and in fact fired a writer who criticized him for it.
 
I'll let the guys who know the proposal well defend it. It didn't seem like a bad idea to me, as a wading fisherman who has been swamped by jet boats in the past.
I looked at it before the Bozeman meeting last week and have also been monitoring the comments online and at the public meetings. The biggest objections have been to regulations on rivers like the Marias, Yellowstone and Missouri and other rivers where there is currently jet boat use and limited conflicts. Unfortunately, that has overshadowed the closures on tributaries where there would be little disagreement that motorized use should be prohibited.
 
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