Propposed Trophy Grizly Bear hunt in Wyoming

[madtom]

The WY grizz hunt is a trophy hunt from beginning to end, and folks ideologically opposed to trophy hunting would still feel that way if the tag was free.

I’m my opinion, the maximum of 5 NR grizzly tags has no bearing on the nation wide effort to recruit and retain new hunters. We’d do a lot more good if we each took one young kid out of after bunnies with a .22 than worrying about the price of 5 bear tags.

 

[TheTone]

I’m my opinion, the maximum of 5 NR grizzly tags has no bearing on the nation wide effort to recruit and retain new hunters. We’d do a lot more good if we each took one young kid out of after bunnies with a .22 than worrying about the price of 5 bear tags.

Agreed, but substitute any number of other high quality tags for the bear tags and have the same outcome. I'm always blown away when I hear someone worried we aren't going to recruit a youth unless they kill some monster critter right away.

 

[BuzzH]

Sorry you feel that way Buzz. The fact it, it's a rich man's game and that will cut into support for it. Say it anyway you want, but that will be the effect.

Most people think hunting needs to be encouraged, that new hunters need to be recruited to the sport. But with lease hunting tying up vast tracts of land in some parts of the country, and tags becoming ridiculously expensive, many will probably turn to other activities and places for their money.

If you don't think that is a big problem, well, keep your head in the sand on that one. You are a great advocate for public land hunting, but when the vast majority of the public can't afford it well,,,,,,,

Need a tissue, Sally?

Also, you can keep your "sorry you feel that way" to yourself. I own the way I feel and you shouldn't be sorry about that, I'm sure as hell not.

Lets get one thing straight, 22 grizzly permits are NOT going to decide the future of hunting. The price tag associated with the grizzly hunt is also not going to sway people one way or the other to become active in the sport, recruit hunters either way, or discourage anyone from continuing to hunt. That's just a fact. Same with sheep, moose, and goat tags...all specialty tags that should cost a premium.

A grizzly hunt in Wyoming should come with a steep price, its a special deal and the price should reflect that and the current fee structure is not out of line. In particular when considering the price to hunt them in Canada or Alaska as a NR there.

I can also say with 100% certainty, anyone that claims they are going to stop hunting because grizzly tags are expensive...well, bye. Those people were probably either not serious from the start, or are flat liars. Either way, I could care less if they quit.

The future of hunting is going to hinge on how accessible we keep RESIDENT tag fees for deer, pronghorn, and elk as well as small game and bird hunting. To a lesser degree, we should also be aware of NR fees for deer, elk, and pronghorn. But, lets also get it straight that hunting as a NR is a privilege and special privileges to pursue game in a State you don't live in, should cost more. I'm all in favor or keeping youth NR fees affordable for deer, elk and pronghorn, and also regular NR fees as well. IMO, no state is pricing anyone that's half serious about hunting and makes it a priority for those species.

It gets old listening to the public land argument too...if people don't value public lands beyond killing a critter on them, they weren't a public land advocate from the start. If I were to never hunt again, I'd still advocate just as hard for public lands as I do now, maybe even more, as I'd have additional time.

BTW, I've hunted a lot of States for a lot of species, and I'm far from a "rich man".

How did that happen if its really a "rich mans game"???

 

[BuzzH]

The WY grizz hunt is a trophy hunt from beginning to end, and folks ideologically opposed to trophy hunting would still feel that way if the tag was free.

I’m my opinion, the maximum of 5 NR grizzly tags has no bearing on the nation wide effort to recruit and retain new hunters. We’d do a lot more good if we each took one young kid out of after bunnies with a .22 than worrying about the price of 5 bear tags.

Here, Here...well stated.

 

[BrentD]

Here, Here...well stated.

But not relevant to the conversation.

 

[icebreaker12]

But not relevant to the conversation.

Oh really? You complain about recruitment of hunters. Particularly in post 18?

But the suggestion that this grizz hunt has no bearing on recruitment and we should be exposing young hunters to small game is irrelevant?

Seems like you need to make a better point.

 

[BrentD]

Need a tissue, Sally?

Also, you can keep your "sorry you feel that way" to yourself. I own the way I feel and you shouldn't be sorry about that, I'm sure as hell not.

Well you don't normally dive into name calling. Sorry to so badly upset your apple cart.

Lets get one thing straight, 22 grizzly permits are NOT going to decide the future of hunting.

Did not say they would.

The price tag associated with the grizzly hunt is also not going to sway people one way or the other to become active in the sport, recruit hunters either way, or discourage anyone from continuing to hunt.

I can guarantee you are wrong about that.

That's just a fact. Same with sheep, moose, and goat tags...all specialty tags that should cost a premium.

A grizzly hunt in Wyoming should come with a steep price, its a special deal and the price should reflect that and the current fee structure is not out of line. In particular when considering the price to hunt them in Canada or Alaska as a NR there. \

Why does the price of bear hunting in AK or Canada have any relevance whatsoever. What is the cost of a grizzly tag in AK? I bet it is a small fraction of the $6k price in Wyoming anyway, but, again, that's irrelevant.

Exactly how much would be too much in your opinion? Do you have a ceiling? $60k, $600K, $6M? If they all sell, then is it all good, regardless of the price? I'm just curious.

I can also say with 100% certainty, anyone that claims they are going to stop hunting because grizzly tags are expensive...well, bye. Those people were probably either not serious from the start, or are flat liars. Either way, I could care less if they quit.

Again, I never said that. But you can pretend I did. That is a classic internet method of argument that you usually do not stoop to however.

The future of hunting is going to hinge on how accessible we keep RESIDENT tag fees for deer, pronghorn, and elk as well as small game and bird hunting. To a lesser degree, we should also be aware of NR fees for deer, elk, and pronghorn. But, lets also get it straight that hunting as a NR is a privilege and special privileges to pursue game in a State you don't live in, should cost more. I'm all in favor or keeping youth NR fees affordable for deer, elk and pronghorn, and also regular NR fees as well. IMO, no state is pricing anyone that's half serious about hunting and makes it a priority for those species.

It gets old listening to the public land argument too...if people don't value public lands beyond killing a critter on them, they weren't a public land advocate from the start. If I were to never hunt again, I'd still advocate just as hard for public lands as I do now, maybe even more, as I'd have additional time.

BTW, I've hunted a lot of States for a lot of species, and I'm far from a "rich man".

How did that happen if its really a "rich mans game"???

BTW, I have also hunted in a lot of states (AK, WY, MT, NM, GA, IA, KS, NE, MN, WI, MI, and maybe others I have overlooked) and even in Africa. And I'm far from a "rich man" too. But you aren't getting it, and that's just the way it is. And yes, it gets old listening to others tell me I should be happy to see exorbitant prices on wild life - why is okay to charge the blazes out of hutners for grizzlies and NOT at least double or quadruple elk and deer licenses? After all, you just have to follow post #8.

 

[BrentD]

Oh really? You complain about recruitment of hunters. Particularly in post 18?

But the suggestion that this grizz hunt has no bearing on recruitment and we should be exposing young hunters to small game is irrelevant?

Seems like you need to make a better point.

The referenced post was about "people ideologically opposed to trophy hunting". No one, except the person making who wrote that post said anything even remotely connected to anti-trophy hunters.

 

[madtom]

The referenced post was about "people ideologically opposed to trophy hunting". No one, except the person making who wrote that post said anything even remotely connected to anti-trophy hunters.

My last post here.

You stated that you thought the fee would diminish public support for the hunt. I countered with the thought that more people’s view of the hunt (and their willingness to support it) is determined by a value system other than their wealth and the monetary value they assign to such an opportunity. At which point I mentioned that most of the same people would passionately oppose the hunt if it was free.

These are my opinions. Maybe we disagree, but it makes for interesting conversation.

 

[BuzzH]

Well you don't normally dive into name calling. Sorry to so badly upset your apple cart.

Yeah, well, I'm not the one crying alligator tears over the price of the first grizzly tags issued in the lower 48 since 1993 either.

Did not say they would.

Better re-read your own post, you said, in direct reference to the price of tags, "and tags becoming ridiculously expensive, many will probably turn to other activities and places for their money."

I can guarantee you are wrong about that.

Prove I'm wrong...you wont, and you cant...good luck with that.

Why does the price of bear hunting in AK or Canada have any relevance whatsoever. What is the cost of a grizzly tag in AK? I bet it is a small fraction of the $6k price in Wyoming anyway, but, again, that's irrelevant.

Price of the tag in AK or Canada is irrelevant when the only way for most NR's to hunt them in either Canada or Alaska is to pay an outfitter, most well over 15K. The 6k associated with the tag fee is a bargain by what the guided hunts go for in either AK or Canada. That is completely relevant.

Exactly how much would be too much in your opinion? Do you have a ceiling? $60k, $600K, $6M? If they all sell, then is it all good, regardless of the price? I'm just curious.

I can tell you that $600 for residents and $6,000 for NR's is not too much.

Again, I never said that. But you can pretend I did. That is a classic internet method of argument that you usually do not stoop to however.

I'll remind you again of what you said, "and tags becoming ridiculously expensive, many will probably turn to other activities and places for their money."

BTW, I have also hunted in a lot of states (AK, WY, MT, NM, GA, IA, KS, NE, MN, WI, MI, and maybe others I have overlooked) and even in Africa. And I'm far from a "rich man" too. But you aren't getting it, and that's just the way it is. And yes, it gets old listening to others tell me I should be happy to see exorbitant prices on wild life - why is okay to charge the blazes out of hutners for grizzlies and NOT at least double or quadruple elk and deer licenses? After all, you just have to follow post #8.

When you hunted all those states and Africa, were your NR fees you paid for tags "exorbitant"? Did you pay more as a NR than the R's pay? I'd have to guess you paid more than $6k to get over to Africa and back, yes? You have no problem paying to hunt animals in Africa, but you're squawking about $6k to hunt a lower 48 grizzly?

I would suggest that if this grizzly hunt was a priority you wouldn't be complaining about the 6k price tag. Its not out of line at all.

Just to clarify, Wyoming and its citizens have the absolute right to not even allow a NR to apply, or to even issue a single grizzly tag to a NR. We also have the right to charge what we want for tags to hunt them, and any other wildlife we manage.

You don't have to like it, and I don't expect you to...just the way it is.

The price of NR grizzly tags is such a non-issue, I don't even know why you have wasted any time crying about it, and even more ridiculous is the time I've wasted bothering to respond.

Grizzly hunting is meaningless to the recruitment or retention of hunters...and if you don't like the price tag, take your own advice and "turn to other activities and other places for your money".

I cant think of a better activity or place for my money...so I'll apply, and greedily.

 

[Deleted member 22670]

BTW, I have also hunted in a lot of states (AK, WY, MT, NM, GA, IA, KS, NE, MN, WI, MI, and maybe others I have overlooked) and even in Africa. And I'm far from a "rich man" too. But you aren't getting it, and that's just the way it is. And yes, it gets old listening to others tell me I should be happy to see exorbitant prices on wild life - why is okay to charge the blazes out of hutners for grizzlies and NOT at least double or quadruple elk and deer licenses? After all, you just have to follow post #8.

LMAO! You've hunted Africa, stating you're not a rich man, and you're labeling a $6K lower 48 Grizzly hunt as a "Rich Man's Hunt" multiple times in this thread. Now that's funny.

Like I said it's all about priorities....

 

[ccc23454]

Can we just talk about the 6.5 vs 260 rem or what caliber pistol is best in bear country? How about bear spray vs lead? Anyone shot 7mm-08 before? Lol...sorry this grizzly tag bitching is just getting old! One last one: why do barnes bullets suck?

 

[TheDudeAbides]

LOL, , I bet NR draw odds are still under 10% even at $6K. Maybe they'll switch to a system like CO's where everybody can apply without fronting the tag fee so it's more fair....

In this case you do not have to front the tag fee.

Applicants contacted by the Department who have accepted the possible
opportunity to hunt a grizzly bear shall be required to submit a cashier’s check or money order for their license fee and to show proof of having earned a certificate of competency and safety in the use and handling of firearms, unless exempt by statute or otherwise authorized, to the License Section at Headquarters within ten (10) consecutive days from the date they are contacted by the Department.

 

[bobbydean]

Not participating in the disagreements, I think the grizzly hunt is a good thing. I also think in the first few years should be for residents only. The residents have won that right hunting in grizzly areas their entire lives.

Just my opinion.

 

[genesis273]

In all, this is a good thing. Even though I'm a NR, I can see the reason for the tag costs.
My biggest fear isn't hunting grizzlies in the mountains of WY. It's running the question by resident mama bear of dropping $6k on a tag! Now that's some scary stuff!! For that reason, I'm out!
No doubt this was a long battle for WY, but maybe this will gain momentum and other states will follow suit! I can see, and hope, MT being next!

 

[icebreaker12]

In this case you do not have to front the tag fee.

Applicants contacted by the Department who have accepted the possible
opportunity to hunt a grizzly bear shall be required to submit a cashier’s check or money order for their license fee and to show proof of having earned a certificate of competency and safety in the use and handling of firearms, unless exempt by statute or otherwise authorized, to the License Section at Headquarters within ten (10) consecutive days from the date they are contacted by the Department.

That is only for the DMA tags (area 1-6)

You do need to front the tag costs outside the DMA in area 7, and that is where NR will have the best chance of drawing.

 

[MTGomer]

“The life of the magnificent grizzly bear, The symbol of freedom, beauty and the rugged wilderness of the American west, is worth more than $100 But that is the price for the anti-wildlife, haters of animals in the Wyoming fishing game plan to allow welfare ranchers to wipe them out for”

“ in a desperate attempt to pad their budgets, The state of Wyoming intends to allow wealthy nonresident trophy hunters like Donald Trump Junior to hunt grizzly bears on the edge of our nation’s national parks for the grotesque fee of $6000 so they can hang their heads on the walls of their dens and admire them while smoking $700 cigars and staring at the $4000 tits on their trophy wives “

The price will be ridiculed by antis no matter what it is. Their wants and whines should be no part of the debate.

 

[BigHornRam]

“The life of the magnificent grizzly bear, The symbol of freedom, beauty and the rugged wilderness of the American west, is worth more than $100 But that is the price for the anti-wildlife, haters of animals in the Wyoming fishing game plan to allow welfare ranchers to wipe them out for”

“ in a desperate attempt to pad their budgets, The state of Wyoming intends to allow wealthy nonresident trophy hunters like Donald Trump Junior to hunt grizzly bears on the edge of our nation’s national parks for the grotesque fee of $6000 so they can hang their heads on the walls of their dens and admire them while smoking $700 cigars and staring at the $4000 tits on their trophy wives “

The price will be ridiculed by antis no matter what it is. Their wants and whines should be no part of the debate.

Where did you pull these quotes from Gomer?

High Country News?

 

[MTGomer]

Where did you pull these quotes from Gomer?

High Country News?

They’re just hyperbolic examples of similar things I’ve seen in various places when there’s a topic like this. I probably should not have actually put quotes around them. And I added the trophy wife part myself ��

 

[BigHornRam]

They’re just hyperbolic examples of similar things I’ve seen in various places when there’s a topic like this. I probably should not have actually put quotes around them. And I added the trophy wife part myself ��

$4000 dollar boob job.......are speaking from experience here? .