Powder scale frustrations... any recs on better or tips

[Badger_55]

I seem to be having some inconsistency in my scales... I currently have a rcbs digital and a Frankford digital... I start them up and let them warm up for a bit... I calibrate with thr provided weights and it passes.. tare the pan and I will get a consistent reading however it starts to increase and decrease differences on its own... I will zero the pan at 140.0 or 140.1 and if I'm not paying attention its setting itself at 140.4 or 139.6.... zero it again and it zeros back at 140.1 then tracks off again... I see it when I'm shooting as I will work a load up and get consistent groups one day with consistent velocities then the next I'm getting very different velocities of 50fps and where they hit it perfectly matches the chrono readings... I change out the batteries constantly and make sure they have nothing stored on top.
Is there a better scale out there that I can get consistency with? Or am I doing something wrong?
Thank you

 

[VikingsGuy]

A few of my thoughts.

• These $35 flip-top digital scales are not particularly reliable. If you want to go digital move up to $150-$350 range for anything that isn't junk.
• Use the velocity node approach to load development as it will reduce the impact of a tenth of a grain or two. Of course, this is a bit of a chicken and egg issue if the crappy scale prevents you from finding the node in the first place
• All digital scales, especially the cheap ones (and even more so the lesser expensive plug-in ones) are susceptible to electrical interference. Power cables, fluorescent lighting, magnets, speakers, tube tvs, etc. Try moving to an electrically "quiet" area.
• Digital scales typically need to be left on for 15-20 minutes to stabilize to be at their best accuracy - this can be hard with the cheapo battery ones as they often have an auto-off function that cycles before then.

 

[mtmuley]

Get a RCBS beam scale. mtmuley

 

[Deleted member 16014]

A few of my thoughts.

• These $35 flip-top digital scales are not particularly reliable. If you want to go digital move up to $150-$350 range for anything that isn't junk.
• Use the velocity node approach to load development as it will reduce the impact of a tenth of a grain or two. Of course, this is a bit of a chicken and egg issue if the crappy scale prevents you from finding the node in the first place
• All digital scales, especially the cheap ones (and even more so the lesser expensive plug-in ones) are susceptible to electrical interference. Power cables, fluorescent lighting, magnets, speakers, tube tvs, etc. Try moving to an electrically "quiet" area.
• Digital scales typically need to be left on for 15-20 minutes to stabilize to be at their best accuracy - this can be hard with the cheapo battery ones as they often have an auto-off function that cycles before then.

+1

 

[VikingsGuy]

Get a RCBS beam scale. mtmuley

If you aren't willing to spend $150+ then mechanical beam scales are your best option. The $25-$150 digital scales are just not accurate or precise enough if you want to be loading with 0.1 grain accuracy.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Get a RCBS beam scale. mtmuley

Analog all the way.

 

[mtmuley]

Analog all the way.

I don't trust the electronic scales. mtmuley

 

[Ben Lamb]

I don't trust the electronic scales. mtmuley

Me either. I've got dad's scale from the 50's. It's accurate. My RCBS scales have been awesome.

 

[MThuntr]

Get rid of the battery operated scales and go to an analog/balance beam scale

If your scale can be plugged in get a Ferrite Choke on the power cord. I have to use one on my RCBS chargemaster because the lights in my reloading area is poorly wired and the fluorescent light/ballast messes things up. Mine will drift as much as 0.1 grains regularly before adding a choke and letting it "warm" up for an hour

Ferrite bead - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[rwc101]

So, how bad is my RangeMaster 750?

 

[VikingsGuy]

So, how bad is my RangeMaster 750?

Probably just at the beginning range of usefulness with a ferrite choke as @Mthuntr noted (or a power conditioner).

 

[VikingsGuy]

Analog all the way.

A great option for many. I get why many like them, but I would put a good digital up against any beam scale. Especially if we are talking hundreds of rounds - I trust a good digital scale not to make a mistake more than I trust an average user not to make one with a mechanical scale. I used to measure amounts a hundred to a thousand times more precise than 0.1grain in applications that could see it and digital was definitely 100% accurate 100% reliable. But there we are talking $3,000 scales. The issue is not digital vs analog, it is about buying a scale good enough for the purpose - $35 flip tops don't meet that standard for 0.1gn precision - $200 digital and $75 mechanical ones do.

 

[Ben Lamb]

A great option for many. I get why many like them, but I would put a good digital up against any beam scale. Especially if we are talking hundreds of rounds - I trust a good digital scale not to make a mistake more than I trust an average user not to make one with a mechanical scale. I used to measure amounts a hundred to a thousand times more precise than 0.1grain in applications that could see it and digital was definitely 100% accurate 100% reliable. But there we are talking $3,000 scales. The issue is not digital vs analog, it is about buying a scale good enough for the purpose - $35 flip tops don't meet that standard for 0.1gn precision - $200 digital and $75 mechanical ones do.

I just loaded 300 rounds of 9mm. I weighed a case every 50 rounds, like always when producing significant batches. I can't imagine a digital being more useful than my analog in that aspect. A good powder thrower is more important than the scale in production. My RCBS, Lyman & Hornady throwers are all very well made pieces of kit that throw a consistent charge whether it's 5 grains of unique, or 75 grains of RL19.

 

[brocksw]

Beam scales. Unless you're willing to fork over several hundred dollars for A&Ds or other lab level scales. For a reasonable price there is no beating a beam.

My process is to weigh initial charge on a small RCBS digital just to get close and then dump into an old Lyman M5 beam scale. When I started doing this I noticed that the RCBS digital always had a tenth or two tenths of a grain variance. Sometimes it would be consistent with my beam scale but usually not and never for very long.

Do some research on beam scales and you can find very sought after models on ebay for cheap. The old ones always seem to have better reputations, go figure. I concluded that there were 3 or 4 different models that I would purchase used and I ended up finding an old lyman M5 that looked brand new on ebay for 150 bucks with single grain senstivity. I have a much easier time getting my ES down nowadays.

 

[brocksw]

This guy calibrates beam scales and reviews scotch in his free time... I have not paid for either of his services but if you read through his page you get a good sense for the particular models that he feels are the best....bottled and beam.

FYI I think he likes his scotch on the peaty side...I'm not a fan of the peat monsters.

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[VikingsGuy]

I just loaded 300 rounds of 9mm. I weighed a case every 50 rounds, like always when producing significant batches. I can't imagine a digital being more useful than my analog in that aspect. A good powder thrower is more important than the scale in production. My RCBS, Lyman & Hornady throwers are all very well made pieces of kit that throw a consistent charge whether it's 5 grains of unique, or 75 grains of RL19.

Ahhh, but I would never call you an "average user"

Kidding aside, lots of ways to skin a cat. Some of those ways are analog, some digital, some a combination. All are good if they work for the use. I was just was addressing a possible inference by other readers that analog was inherently better than digital - it simply is not the case if you are using the right equipment for the right reasons. Heck, my grandpa's old Marlin 30-30 loaded with Core-Lokt or worse has killed more animals than my wizz-bang Bergara Premier 280AI ever will - but I still like my new toy a lot and it has some advantages.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Sure, but a beam scale is better.

#science

 

[mtmuley]

I like the control I have with a beam scale. Crimeny, I measure primer seating depth. mtmuley

 

[ImBillT]

I use a Frankford Arsenal. It will float around a bit if you just rock and roll. My pan weighs 147.4gr. I zero it, and when I throw my powder charge the scale needs to say -147.3 to -147.5gr. As long as it does, I don’t worry about it. If it gets outside of that, I just re-zero it. Plus or minus .1gr is meaningless. I get single digit ES quite often.

 

[Deleted member 16014]

This guy calibrates beam scales and reviews scotch in his free time... I have not paid for either of his services but if you read through his page you get a good sense for the particular models that he feels are the best....bottled and beam.

FYI I think he likes his scotch on the peaty side...I'm not a fan of the peat monsters.

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That is cool. I've been using a probably 40+ year old Ohaus-made RCBS that was my grandpa's, it's great and has the nostalgia factor to boot. If it ever needs looked at, I know where I'll send it.