Ollin Magnetic Digiscoping System

Opinions please.......



I was wanting your opinion on the legal use of crossbows......

I have taken a few rips in e-mail for considering buying one to hunt elk in Wyo next year......seems some think its not very ethical.........so what ya think?

....here's my take on it. I'm not as hung up on what I hunt with, as much as I am improving my chances at harvesting quality animals.
Let's say they had a bare-handed only season on gators, but it was in a pool that was a natural breedding ground and was swarming with gators, or you could hunt them with the normal methods in an area that had been practically wiped out of them.......hmmm.........I would go bare-handed! :eek:

......or lets say, you could go hunt for bin ladin with your favorite rifle, over in the Afganny hills :rolleyes: , .......or you could be handed a hunting permit to cut his nuts off after he was captured, but you had to use only a butter knife.........well, it would be the butter knife for me :cool: ...

Point being, as long as it is legal, I would opt for what gives me the best opportunity to havest the animal I'm after.

For the die hard bowhunters who will codemn the use of crossbows.......I would say to you, put down your compounds and pick up a longbow. I do not believe a crossbow should be considered a legal weapon for the archery season, no more than I believe muzzeloader hunters should be lumped in with the regular rifle season.........but the state of Wyoming sees it differently. So...they're rules........I'll play......

I would use a sling shot if it was the weapon a state appropriates as the leagal means to harvest a certain animal, and it was the season I intended to hunt.

I'll end this with saying that I in no way would claim that taking an animal with a crossbow was equal to taking it with a longbow, but it is surely not any worse than using a rifle as most of us do........what ya think?
Well, I will probably take a few hits for this, but it is how I feel. You can use the same reasoning with people who use muzzle loaders. Should in-lines be allowed for the same season as a true muzzle loader? I do not agree with that. Heck, it is amost like hunting with any single shot rifle.
As to your question, I personally would not buy a crossbow to hunt with. If I move to a state that does not allow them to be used during archery season, it would be a waste. I would instead take that money and apply it to a very good compound bow and all the gear to go along with it. BUT, it is legal here. Just like someone could use a 416 rigby on antelope rather than a 243 or something. I say it is up to you. People will always criticize others for doing something they wouldn't. If it meant anything, everyone would be voting Republican by now. :D
If its legal I say go for it!!! Now I will go on to say that even if its legal I may not CHOOSE to do it that way. The biggest advantage that a crossbow gives is that you don't have to practice as much to be proficient enough to hunt with it. However, todays new bows and arrows will allow you to shoot game just as far as a crossbow if you are willing to put in the time. Crossbow use very short arrows therefore they are relatively light. Howard Hill killed a cow elk at a witnessed 186 yards with a longbow!! :eek: Also, for spot and stalk hunting I would reconsider. I have hunting deer in IN with a crossbow and I would not want to be toting one around through rough terrain with one that is cocked and they are too hard to @#)(# once you get close enough to an animal. For stand hunting I would use one, but not for lugging around, they're too heavy. Just some food for thought, but if it tickles you fancy go with it.
I say go for it. As long as it is legal for that state that is all that matters. I live in a state that hunting with a crossbow is legal for anyone with a hunting license. I think they are great since it allows more people to hunt. But we are not allowed to use centerfire rifles here. So maybe I should start flaming everybody that uses a centerfire? ;)
If its legal in Wyoming, then that means you can do it. I have heard rumors that there is a strong movement to ban them during bow season in Wyoming. But until that happens the sky is the limit.

I believe 1_pointer gave a fair assessment of crossbows. I have heard the same thing from people who have tried them. They are awkward and hardly any better than the quality compounds...maybe not even as good in a lot of cases. But, thats only hearsay.

No matter what you do people will give you $hit, but you deserve it DS. HAHA.
That's a tough call. They are a form of archery. Much like relationship that muzzle loaders have to centerfire weapons, they have little ressemblance in effectiveness or range to the cousin. I would say that perhaps they should be classified in the same group with modern muzzleloaders. Kind of a modern primitive weapon.

As for hunting with them, I certainly woulndn't file a Pope and Young claim for an animal taken with a cross bow, but if the law says they are permitted, then they are permitted. I can't see any arguement for that. Sounds like the pissing contest that is going on about muzzle loaders with scopes. It's all academic. :cool:
Deerslayer go with the crossbow.I practice with my bow,[Not Enough]and can't hit the same spot twice out of six shots.So I will never try to hunt with it because I'm not going to have a deer run of and not be found.Every year I talk to guys that tell me they have stuck a deer and couldn't find it.Personaly I'm not going to let that happen I'll pass on bow season till I improve.I'm also considering a crossbow to see if I could improve my shooting skills.Then maybe I'll give bow season a try. Bill
Its the same old thing,there are always people that will give you crap.But if the state says its legal go for it if its what you what to do.
We have people here that turn up there noses at compounds and all the gadgets you can now use.
I wouldnt be using a bow today if it werent for the new compounds and being able to use a release.
I noticed many of you giving opinions more on whether crossbows "should" be allowed............that one is already settled in Wyoming. My thought on it is no, not for Archery season........but I'm the same guy who says "no" on the wilderness law and also think Wyo should have a seperate Muzzleloader season.

Another note.....I do hunt with a compound, and have taken many mature whitetails with it, so its not a question of "practicing or not"........fact is, the crossbow I am looking at outfitted with a scope would be more accurate than my compound. I have used both weapons a great deal, and there are a lot less variables in a crossbow than a compound. Also, while most compounds will easily shoot out to 60 yards or beyond, the realistic effective range for most of us in a hunting situation is 40 yards or less...........due to the possibility of the animal "jumping the string". I fell the compound gives and added 15 to 20 yards easily to that mark, and that is just beyond the magical 50 yard mark......at whick point most of the bulls I have worked will hang up, expecting to see "her".

I am only basing these things on my personal experiences, and do realize that a few of you have the latest, high tech compounds, like say the Mathews M-Q-1 I am considering buying, that with the right carbon arrows could probably out perform the crossbow.
But in reality, there are probably only a few here that have $1000+ invested in your bows.

I will continue to bow hunt with my Compound every chance I get, ......but my experience has been, using the compound legally would have offered me several shot opportunities at bulls that narrowly eluded me with my compound.

A sidenote.....at the same time hunters are legally using their crossbows in Sept in Wyo...........farther north in the state there are hunters legally using rifles.
;) DS
D/S.. Forget about the crossbow. You will be at a big disadvatage in every respect with that compared to a good compound bow... with the exception of the ease of squeezing the trigger and not having to draw when in close range of an animal. You loose out big-time in range, velocity (string jumping), trajectory, follow-up shots... Look into it man. Most people think that a cross-bow is going to get them an easy advantage, but it's really no advantage other than the feeling you might get being able to point something with crosshairs.

What really gets my goat... you think a separate SEASON is good idea for MUZZLELOADERS in Wyoming??? What are you smoking? You think Wyoming should model it's seasons like Colorado?? NOT! What's to keep a smokepoler (or is it polesmoker) from hunting during rifle season? Can you explain your thoughts because I want to be able to tell you how f*****d in the head you are on this.
Come on Greenhorn tell us how you really feel about a seperate muzzleloader season? Don't be so shy and hold so much back:D
Well.......you people made me feel so bad I went out aand test drove a Mathews Q-2 today, and every other bow they have. The Q-2 is 3 times the expense of the crossbow, but at 265fps, its quite a bit faster, not to mention the energy. They're rigging it up for me now, and fully rigged it is right at $1100 :( but it will make me feel better equiped than the Browning bow I currently shoot.

Greeny, my point was this......
Why would a state see a crossbow as qualified for the Archery season, when no other western state does, yet they take the exact opposite approach to that liberal stance when it comes to the muzzleloader, saying it qualifies with thr regular rifle season. It would seem to me they are talking out of both ends of their @ss to me.

I would like to see a week of muzzleloader before the regular gun season.....I love to hunt black powder, always have. You don't have the same range as a rifle, and much more can go wrong, so it shouldn't be considered on the same level........no more than a crossbow should be considered on the same level as a longbow.........or at least that is my opinion.

So your upset about what?........the timing of a muzzleloader hunt.........put it late in the year, I don't care........just don't exclude all the sportsman who have come to love this way of hunting. You may as wellmake the archery, including the crossbows

;) all hunt with the regular rifle season if your not going to differentiate between the difficulty levels of each weapon.

So there ya go.....pour it on......
A few years back some dufuses in MT wanted a special atlatyl season here for big game. No kidding.

So how can we fit it in? Longbow season, recurve season, compound season, crossbow season, blackpowder traditional season, pistol season, in-line muzzleloader season, centerfire season... then of course, the late atlatyl season. Oh how fun to try and fix things that ain't broke.
So using your logic.........there should also be no archery only season???????

"I like one 10-week season myself... and can choose to hunt with whatever I want outside of the archery only season." Greeny.

So why excepting the archery only? Let's just have one season, any weapon........sounds like a plan.

And these purist archers your speaking of,.....if thet're very pure, they undoubtedly are not using compounds...nothing real pure about that.
I know archers that bow hunt year round, and good on 'em. To each his own. Me,.......I just wanna kill sh!T........and would prefer killin some big sh!t. Any legal weapon they so ordain I'll not argue too much. Nothing pure about it I guess......just a passion I have developed.

.......if your not much on giving the different methods of take their own season to do it in......then I'll help you boycott the bowhunting seasons......let's make it real simple........one season, any weapon.......I like it........
I say if a crossbow is legal go for it. Here in Arizona a crossbow in legal during the general rifle hunts. I have no experience with them so I'm not sure why they did not put them with the archery season. I believe it is due to the effective range where the ethical archery Hunter would probably prefer ranges of less and 50 yds and most below 30 I would not consider shooting my bow more than 30 yds but that's just me and my opinions that shot placement and arrow penetration is of utmost importance. The fact that most states have separate hunts for archery, muzzleloader, and rifle is a good idea. Although I do disagree that the modern muzzleloader is the same as the original cap and ball or flintlock modern muzzleloaders have a much further effective range especially with the new magnums that are out now how can this be considered a muzzleloader I don't care if the loads from the muzzle or not the idea of the muzzleloader hunts were to take you back in time. Now I know archery hunters are gonna say you have recurved verses compound, and longbow but all of these still have the same basic effective range, and I believe anyone that attempts to take game at over 50 yds with any bow is a very unethical Hunter and have probably lost more animals then he has taken
Good points Jig.............although I did read an article in a national magazine about two brothers that hunted the northwest corner of Co for Muleys for many years and it showed pix of many pope and young caliber animals that they supposedly had taken at ranges that typically were 60 and 70 yards, in open country. My jaw dropped, but they said "the proof was in the pudding". I guess they could have been fudging on the distances, but not likely, since they were "purist". It started me thinking,......was I way behind the game with my 20-30 yard barrier? So that brings me to my new purchase of the Mathews bow......disputably one of the finest bows available.....the hardest part being deciding between the MQ-1.......Q-2.......Q-32......????????? :confused: anyway you swing it, get your $1000+ out and hope it buys you a few extra feet and the energy to do the job when it gets there.

As far as ethics go......to say that ANY shot over 50 yards may not be a fair assessment. If a guy has the right equipment, and he can demonstrate the propencity to consistently make accurate shots at say 55 or 60 yards, and his equipment will deliver the energy to do the job at that range......why not?

I personally have never shot beyond 35-40 yards......and that seemed too far. But I hope to expand my effective range out to 50.......it may not happen, but I will know in a few months what I can do with my new equipment......we'll see...
Greeny......not all excited about it.....in fact......until they enact a special Blow Gun season here in Co, I doubt I will get excited at all. I picked up a very nice Blow Gun while in the ghettos of La and can't for the life of me understand why they pick on me and my blowgun by not allowing a special season for such.....
Jigmaker, I dont think you can put a yard mark on unethical shots. The buck that I killed last year was at 58 yards, and the animal only went about 20 yards before expiring. I would feel comfortable with any shot out to about 70 yards with my bow. I would not suggest this shot to most everyday bow hunters, but with consistent practice and the right equiptment 40-60 yard shots become makeable. I just wonder if you would put a yardage on ethical rifle shots, I doubt it. I guided a cow elk hunter this year who connected on a 671 yard shot, in the head. Would I take this shot, not in a million years, but if he is comfortable with it who am I to say he is unethical? Just my humble opinion. :D

For those that believe the In-line muzzle loader is an invention of this generation, think again. The French had In-line muzzle loaders in 1813. That's even before the percussion cap rifles.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 12-19-2001 01:40: Message edited by: AlleninAlaska ]</font>

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