Montana mule deer

[EYJONAS!]

When they changed it I stopped in to Glasgow and talked to the area biologist. While I can't remember exactly how the conversation went I could tell it fell on deaf ears and he told me more than once during the conversation.

There's enough deer around and the age class is fine through our studies this extention won't have any negative effect on it. Nothing that you'll be able to notice from a year to year basis....

I said thanks and walked away after that, I remember mumbling some remark walking away like. What a f$cking jackass I think it was. LMFAO I got in my truck called my buddy and his exact words was well there that deal goes... total bs.

The next year the amount of deer that got killed was unreal, trespassing was off the charts and people were going bat shit crazy over it. Thinking it was the greatest idea known to man. Now you can't buy a buck, land is locked up, locals keep it close to family and friends and you can't buy a buck 150 or better. Don't get me wrong people find good bucks the guys that regularly kill good ones basically live with them. I would say those deer hunters are not your typical everyday hunter, they have time, keen eyes and the discipline to be able to pass bucks for 2 or 3 years to let them reach the maturity level and potential. When 99.9 percent are flicking the safety.

Sounds kind of like how our early preview will be if the MTFWP does away with bull permits in LE areas.

 

[mtmuley]

Originally I just wanted to point out how various media makes the mule deer hunting in Montana out to be something it isn't. This turned into a ton of info. Thanks guys. mtmuley

 

[texwest44]

This thread is helpful in whittling down what might be a working solution. Let's break it down a bit:

1: Everyone agrees shortening the rifle season.
2: Most agree on moving the rifle season, but there's debate on earlier or later.
3: Most seem to agree on not implementing point/width restrictions
4: Variable agreement on increasing draw units
5: Most agree doe harvest could use some dialing back in places

I know I can get on board with just about all of these points; I might make a case for width restrictions but that's getting out into the weeds. Like it's been pointed out, people and good judgement don't always mix, lol.

With that in mind, I might think a solution might be some kind of hybrid of methods I've seen other states use. What about something like:

Aug. 31-Sept 31: Permit archery only for back country and alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Oct. 1-Oct. 15: OTC Archery & permit muzzle loader/shotgun for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Oct 16-Oct 31: OTC Archery & OTC muzzle loader/shotgun statewide, permit rifle for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Nov 1-Nov 30: Permit archery & permit muzzle loader/shotgun state wide, permit rifle for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Dec 1-Dec 14: OTC archery statewide, OTC muzzle loader/shotgun statewide, OTC rifle statewide, any whitetail, one muley buck, one permitted doe in specific areas, with various buck restrictions to be regionally applied.

Clearly that doesn't include the whacky shoulder seasons and agricultural management and all this other kinda stuff. Would something like this produce results we might want to see within our (hopeful) lifetimes?

 

[Deleted member 20812]

You guys who are advocating for restrictions based on number of points and measurements of said points need to go back and revisit @tjones post. If FWP fields 40k phone calls from people who can’t/won’t read enough to understand the draw process, I can guarantee you these same folks will be ground checking so many animals any benefit(s) from the restrictions will have been lost. This has already been studied and determined in 80s and 90s.

 

[EYJONAS!]

What about something like:

Aug. 15-Sept 15: Permit archery only statewide and no doe harvest
Oct. 1-Oct. 15: OTC Archery, permit muzzle loader/shotgun for back country/alpine, and LIMITED PRIVATE ONLY doe harvest
Oct 16-Oct 31: OTC Archery, OTC muzzle loader/shotgun statewide, permit rifle for back country/alpine, LE Rifle PERMIT BUCK TAG. PRIVATE ONLY DOE
Nov 1-Nov 30: Permit archery statewide, permit muzzle loader/shotgun state wide, permit rifle for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Dec 1-Dec 14: OTC archery statewide, OTC muzzle loader/shotgun statewide, OTC rifle statewide, any whitetail, one muley buck, one permitted doe in specific areas, with various buck restrictions to be regionally applied.

 

[texwest44]

This man running for least popular person in MT right now

 

[EYJONAS!]

You guys who are advocating for restrictions based on number of points and measurements of said points need to go back and revisit @tjones post. If FWP fields 40k phone calls from people who can’t/won’t read enough to understand the draw process, I can guarantee you these same folks will be ground checking so many animals any benefit(s) from the restrictions will have been lost. This has already been studied and determined in 80s and 90s.

You mean the guys that can't tell the difference between a preference and bonus point and what a limited entry area is vs general couldn't determine what a 20in buck vs a 24in buck is?

It doesn't take a wide buck to make a good buck, I've said it many times.

Just like a point restriction how does killing a small 3 yr old 4pt make sense but youd have to pass a old 3pt that's got it all besides backfires? I mean shit he's 30" tall....

Although they do use the width restriction on moose along with browtine minimum. What are if any the positive outcomes of this? I am curious because I've never really looked into it.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

I mean shit he's 30" tall....

Yeah, that’s kind of what I’m referring to.

 

[brownbear932008]

The northeast corner had a shortened buck season, is there any data regarding the effectiveness?

Also a large percentage of deer are hit by vehicles in MT, last numbers showed MT second behind Virginia. Politically, any increased collisions is a challenge for fwp.

Dang WV undoubtedly doesn't keep stats because they gotta lead that race At least we are leading in something here in VA.

 

[mtmuley]

Wonder why nobody hunts the Western side of Montana for muleys? mtmuley

 

[Dakotakid]

My bad it was WV as worst. Virginians all look the same to me, sorry.

Oh Deer! Montana motorists involved in 17,000 animal collisions

More than 17,000 Montanans filed claims after striking an animal last year, making Montana second worst in the nation for animal collisions.

www.google.com

 

[Gerald Martin]

Change the speed limit to 55 at night… saving insurance money, limiting emissions and deer lives in one fell swoop….

How about this for a season restructure…

Trim ten days from the end of archery season. Archery closes Oct. 5.

Rifle season for mule deer opens October 15 and closes Nov1. Whitetail deer from October 15 - Thanksgiving weekend.
Rifle Elk season starts last full week of October and ends Thanksgiving weekend.

 

[huntin24/7]

Change the speed limit to 55 at night… saving insurance money, limiting emissions and deer lives in one fell swoop….

How about this for a season restructure…

Trim ten days from the end of archery season. Archery closes Oct. 5.

Rifle season for mule deer opens October 15 and closes Nov1. Whitetail deer from October 15 - Thanksgiving weekend.
Rifle Elk season starts last full week of October and ends Thanksgiving weekend.

I actually really like that. It’s reasonable with plenty of opportunity and would definitely result in more mature mule deer.

 

[bigsky2]

This thread is helpful in whittling down what might be a working solution. Let's break it down a bit:

1: Everyone agrees shortening the rifle season.
2: Most agree on moving the rifle season, but there's debate on earlier or later.
3: Most seem to agree on not implementing point/width restrictions
4: Variable agreement on increasing draw units
5: Most agree doe harvest could use some dialing back in places

I know I can get on board with just about all of these points; I might make a case for width restrictions but that's getting out into the weeds. Like it's been pointed out, people and good judgement don't always mix, lol.

With that in mind, I might think a solution might be some kind of hybrid of methods I've seen other states use. What about something like:

Aug. 31-Sept 31: Permit archery only for back country and alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Oct. 1-Oct. 15: OTC Archery & permit muzzle loader/shotgun for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Oct 16-Oct 31: OTC Archery & OTC muzzle loader/shotgun statewide, permit rifle for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Nov 1-Nov 30: Permit archery & permit muzzle loader/shotgun state wide, permit rifle for back country/alpine, plus width restrictions and no doe harvest
Dec 1-Dec 14: OTC archery statewide, OTC muzzle loader/shotgun statewide, OTC rifle statewide, any whitetail, one muley buck, one permitted doe in specific areas, with various buck restrictions to be regionally applied.

Clearly that doesn't include the whacky shoulder seasons and agricultural management and all this other kinda stuff. Would something like this produce results we might want to see within our (hopeful) lifetimes?

I haven’t seen anyone advocating for moving the season later than it already is.

 

[tjones]

There are 15 3 point mule deer permits in HD270.
Last season 2 of the 15 permit holders were pissed because the drew it but thought the had drawn the regular HD270 mule deer permit. They couldn’t understand how FWP had given them the wrong permit.

The regs are crystal clear on this one.

 

[huntin24/7]

And obliterate the public land whitetail population.

That’s a fair point. The whitetail part would need to be adjusted. I actually wouldn’t mind seeing separate tags for whitetail and muleys in a draw, like what basically every unit in every other state does, but that won’t happen.

 

[antlerradar]

And obliterate the public land whitetail population.

I worry about that too. A cut back mule deer could put a lot of new pressure on whitetail. What has been the effect on western whitetail with all the relatively new draw only mule deer units west of the divide?

 

[Trap]

I worry about that too. A cut back mule deer could put a lot of new pressure on whitetail. What has been the effect on western whitetail with all the relatively new draw only mule deer units west of the divide?

Idaho has quite a few areas that are le for mule deer or mule deer closes early. The whitetail seem to be fine with some nice older bucks. I think a younger whitetail has a lot better chance of surviving due to there crackhead nature I think it needs to be simple leave whitetail open and close mule deer 10-31. That would be a simple easy change that most could understand and tolerate.

 

[HuntingJudge]

I don’t mind how the north country does it at all. General season starts October 23rd and ends November 14th (this year). There is a special draw to hunt Mule deer/ whitetails the last two weeks of the season. I drew the whitetail tag north of Chester this year. I have been living and hunting in this region for going on 6 years now. It was difficult to get use to the first year or two but, now its normal. I find half a dozen deer every year that are good bucks, wither it be whitetails or mule deer. Honestly, I would not mind seeing the entire state go through this scheduling and have a draw for rut hunting. This still allows people to have ample opportunities at harvesting deer, as well as limiting the population allowed to hunt the rut.

 

[Flatbrimmer]

I don't want to be arguing, But is that a public land alfalfa field?

Wouldn’t you like to know