Montana Deer Management- If I were King for a day.

[mtmiller]

Ya he for sure said 6-8. Myself I’d push that another week or so. But that’s when I’m seeing the most cruising. Maybe he figures the peak rut when a buck is covering the does in his little home range vs when he’s covering country looking for hot does?

Forest for the trees.

I just caught bits and pieces, but sounded like everything was managed as good as it could be. Shooting lots of 3.6 yo bucks that are >80% of their potential.

Actually I thought Brett gave a good presentation, but I don't have the same rose colored glasses.

Missed most of the public comment/question part, so bummed about that. I thought I heard someone from FWP say that Social Media was one of the problems which surprised me since I was under the impression there were no real issues. If it is indeed an internet "too much info" issue, that can be managed.

I will have sit down and listen to it closer I guess. Apologize if I misunderstood some of the topics.

 

[brockel]

i listened some,,,, the landowners that mentioned large downturn in populations,
were met with,,, the deer most likely moved to a new area due to any number of reasons,,,

can some one chime in and let us know were the deer went, im thinking wyoming

at what point is current hunting strategy addiditive mortality and actually hurting populations

i wish, 1 time in the history of mule deer management, some force would over react to the situation, and save to many deer, its easy to fix that problem,,,

That guy is pretty far from Wyoming. Massive amounts of doe tags have done his deer population in. Then drought and nasty winters added in

 

[brockel]

Forest for the trees.

I just caught bits and pieces, but sounded like everything was managed as good as it could be. Shooting lots of 3.6 yo bucks that are >80% of their potential.

Actually I thought Brett gave a good presentation, but I don't have the same rose colored glasses.

Missed most of the public comment/question part, so bummed about that. I thought I heard someone from FWP say that Social Media was one of the problems which surprised me since I was under the impression there were no real issues. If it is indeed an internet "too much info" issue, that can be managed.

I will have sit down and listen to it closer I guess. Apologize if I misunderstood some of the topics.

Pretty much nailed it. Loose lips sink ships basically on the social media part.

 

[rogerthat]

Forest for the trees.

I just caught bits and pieces, but sounded like everything was managed as good as it could be. Shooting lots of 3.6 yo bucks that are >80% of their potential.

Actually I thought Brett gave a good presentation, but I don't have the same rose colored glasses.

Missed most of the public comment/question part, so bummed about that. I thought I heard someone from FWP say that Social Media was one of the problems which surprised me since I was under the impression there were no real issues. If it is indeed an internet "too much info" issue, that can be managed.

I will have sit down and listen to it closer I guess. Apologize if I misunderstood some of the topics.

It was a good presentation, clearly organized to support the status quo and justify the current season structure. Lots of studies that support their management. I suspect there are lots of studies that could be found that don’t support current management since no other state in the west has similar management.

 

[Nick87]

I'm not sure how much that affects it. Seems logical but I don't know. I know for a fact that I've seen bucks rutting does, lip curling, following, trying to mount, the whole shebang, as late as Dec 12. Ive killed a buck doing the same thing with a doe on Dec 9th. But in both instances, overall rut activity had gone down noticeably.

1k miles away but I've seen the same 30 days after peak rut here. You can just about set your watch to it.

 

[brockel]

It was a good presentation, clearly organized to support the status quo and justify the current season structure. Lots of studies that support their management. I suspect there are lots of studies that could be found that don’t support current management since no other state in the west has similar management.

More hunter days in the field for same harvest numbers.

#selective

 

[rogerthat]

Lots of comments talking about changing season structure but I didn’t really see any acknowledgment from fwp that anything needs changed. That I suspect is the conundrum we are in.

 

[brockel]

One positive is fwp has made the drive from Miles City back to Baker a rather boring drive as you don’t really have to worry hitting a deer anymore

 

[brocksw]

In the best interest of MT mule deer, I think someone should take their mule deer biologists to every state with mule deer and hunt the rut to see first hand comparisons. I think I should be that person. So if you guys could start pitching that to the fwp as soon as possible, we could get this train moving in the right direction.

You guys can thank me later for my great service to the state of MT. Until then, I think that idea gains faster support if it's all expenses paid. So if you could so kindly set up a go fund me page for that, that would be swell. You're welcome MT.

The things I'll do for my neighbors...

 

[8andcounting]

I hate to be the grinch but any change to the general deer season as far as length and season dates is Not going to happen . It should but it won’t .

 

[brockel]

In the best interest of MT mule deer, I think someone should take their mule deer biologists to every state with mule deer and hunt the rut to see first hand comparisons. I think I should be that person. So if you guys could start pitching that to the fwp as soon as possible, we could get this train moving in the right direction.

You guys can thank me later for my great service to the state of MT. Until then, I think that idea gains faster support if it's all expenses paid. So if you could so kindly set up a go fund me page for that, that would be swell. You're welcome MT.

The things I'll do for my neighbors...

I have a friend that was completely against fwp making any changes and everything was just fine attitude. Well this year he moved just over the boarder to the east. He just texted me this morning and said fwp needs to take a page out of NDs book because the deer numbers are night and day difference at the boarder.

 

[Gerald Martin]

I hate to be the grinch but any change to the general deer season as far as length and season dates is Not going to happen . It should but it won’t .

It can and it will. When is the question.

 

[SAJ-99]

I have a friend that was completely against fwp making any changes and everything was just fine attitude. Well this year he moved just over the boarder to the east. He just texted me this morning and said fwp needs to take a page out of NDs book because the deer numbers are night and day difference at the boarder.

The page they would take is to eliminate NR licenses.

 

[brockel]

It can and it will. When is the question.

Im afraid when they get the rest of their survey results back they will say people would rather have the opportunity to take their rifle for a walk in the rut every year and there will be zero changes made

 

[300stw]

Im afraid when they get the rest of their survey results back they will say people would rather have the opportunity to take their rifle for a walk in the rut every year and there will be zero changes made

ill second that,,,,

 

[rogerthat]

ill second that,,,,

Yup.

 

[Big Fin]

I want to thank the Region 6 & 7 Hunt Talkers who attended the Mile City FWP meeting tonight. Many of you were there. All of you who were there will have more impact on mule deer management than comments from other areas of the state. To have landowners, outfitters, and hunters, all saying the same thing makes it hard for FWP to think it is just a bunch of hunters complaining that they didn't get a big deer this year.

It was hard to understand many of the comments while following on a computer. But, from what I could follow and understand, the comments were consistent from most every group - deer numbers are in the tank and do not correspond to numbers stated by FWP's population models. Hopefully FWP heard the same thing in those comments.

Hopefully they hear some of the same comments from folks at other meetings. And hopefully this can be the start of changes to benefit the deer.

 

[Ought Six]

I want to thank the Region 6 & 7 Hunt Talkers who attended the Mile City FWP meeting tonight. Many of you were there. All of you who were there will have more impact on mule deer management than comments from other areas of the state. To have landowners, outfitters, and hunters, all saying the same thing makes it hard for FWP to think it is just a bunch of hunters complaining that they didn't get a big deer this year.

It was hard to understand many of the comments while following on a computer. But, from what I could follow and understand, the comments were consistent from most every group - deer numbers are in the tank and do not correspond to numbers stated by FWP's population models. Hopefully FWP heard the same thing in those comments.

Hopefully they hear some of the same comments from folks at other meetings. And hopefully this can be the start of changes to benefit the deer.

I agree @Big Fin

 

[Schaaf]

I've spent all day thinking about what I don't like in the proposal and I can't come up with a single thing. The proposal would undoubtedly boost the quality of hunting and lower the the total amount of people on the landscape on any given weekend, which is the most important change needed.

I do think you could up the 2.5% of the Regional Permit. 1000 for Region 7 does feel a bit high, but 5-700 seems about right and would provide a reasonable chance for people to still feel like they have a chance to get it, if not a fairly good chance depending on how people would distribute themselves in the season structure.

A few thoughts about fitting it in with elk, I think a big help would be to decouple general elk and deer seasons. In the proposal I see an opportunity to allow for an over objective cow hunt during the first two weeks of October and the general either sex season in November or vice-versa. This was something that was talked about a little bit during the Elk Council's recommendations and it seemed to have some tentative support from that group.

I do feel like addressing this issue with FWP is almost the opposite of elk issue, I have a feeling the biggest opponents of change will be regional rather than in Helena. My discussions with local biologists have never indicated an appetite for changing a single thing. At some point the regional offices will have to address the most common complaint about deer in the state and that is that there are too many hunters. The only way to address the most common complaint is by modifying our season structure. yeah, It's going to piss a lot of people off but it addresses the biggest complaint.

Finally, the ball has begun to roll. They wouldn't have called a meeting in Miles City and labeled it a discussion about Mule Deer Management if they weren't hearing it.

 

[DFS]

The first step to changing anything would be the fwp admitting we have a problem and need to. I don’t think they are there I don’t think they are even close. I saw a room full of concerned landowners outfitters and hunters and the fwp who defended their policies, management, counts and data collection. I think they are doubling down.

To get things back on track I like the plan pitched in this thread.