Major opps from the Forest Service.

I've got a buddy that works for the forest service. He was cussing them earlier in the week for planning these burns during FIRE SEASON. I guess they didn't get the hint from the Lewiston and Columbus fires that it wasn't the best time to be burning.
 
Started a prescribed burn during a fire weather watch? Interesting decision-making....
 
While I dont know the particulars of this prescribed fire...I've done a fair bit of prescribed fire work in the past.

Its pretty easy to have things get out of hand. You have pretty narrow windows to work with, depending on what you're trying to achieve with prescribed fire. It doesnt take much for "prescribed" to turn to shit real fast....been there done that.

While its easy to criticize, and I'm guilty of same, I dont believe any prescribed fire is without the chance to get ugly. I rarely, very rarely remember many prescribed fires I was on that didnt slop over and burn more than intended.

Working with prescribed fire is more of an art than a science...

I hope no structures are lost...but burning some "extry" acreage isnt a bad thing, IMO.

Oak, ever try to remove 1000 hour fuels with prescribed fire? They dont burn real well unless you're walking that fine line of lighting them on the edge of fire season. Knowing that country near stemple pass...and the fuel loads...I'd bet money that fire wasnt meant to just remove some dead grass and twigs from the forest floor.

You just dont have the luxury of a very large burning window...and its surely not without risk.
 
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Doesn't matter what their goals for the fire were. I'm sure they were targeting 100hr or 1000hr fuels with the extent of beetle-kill in the area. The fact is, the area had forecast near record highs, it is very close proximity to a lot of private residences, and the HNF's own daily report forecast a Red Flag Warning starting at noon today. No forest treatment is worth burning a bunch of homes down. I wouldn't call what this fire is doing "slop over".

If you or I went up there and started a fire in those conditions, we'd be locked up. Driving a green pickup does not give one a free pass on criminally negligent actions. I'm sure you'd agree if you were evacuated right now.
 
Oak said:
Doesn't matter what their goals for the fire were. I'm sure they were targeting 100hr or 1000hr fuels with the extent of beetle-kill in the area. The fact is, the area had forecast near record highs, it is very close proximity to a lot of private residences, and the HNF's own daily report forecast a Red Flag Warning starting at noon today. No forest treatment is worth burning a bunch of homes down. I wouldn't call what this fire is doing "slop over".

If you or I went up there and started a fire in those conditions, we'd be locked up. Driving a green pickup does not give one a free pass on criminally negligent actions. I'm sure you'd agree if you were evacuated right now.
Click to expand...


Good reply Oak... Buzz No disrespect...But how can you defend a "stupid mistake"?

In "ANY" private organization .. heads would roll!...
 
Not a big surprise this "prescribed" burn got away. Warnings have been made all week.

Good afternoon everyone. Since this afternoon is a critical fire weather period, I have updated the briefing that was issued this morning with more up-to-date information. Basically, nothing has changed. You can view the presentation by visiting the following link:

http://gacc.nifc.gov/nrcc/predictive/weather/WebBriefing/WebBriefing.html
 
From the Canyon Creek Fire Hall, Rick Grady stared in disbelief at the roiling smoke over his family ranch. As a member of the volunteer fire board and former DNRC firefighter, he was angry that the prescribed fire was started, noting that open burning was closed in Lewis and Clark County on Wednesday-day and Thursday. The National Weather Service had also issued a "red flag" warning on Wednesday for Thursday, meaning that the combination of near-record warm temperatures, low humidity and gusty southwest winds would create dangerous fire weather conditions.

With that forecast why would you think about it. That whole area is all pine beetle kill. Hopefully no one looses their homes or are hurt. If a home is lost it's perfect grounds for a lawsuit. But at least they are kill some beetle and you don't have to look at dead trees in the area, just burnt ones. Easier to spot game now.:hump:
 
Where is the common sense here? Guess is somebody was just following a directive from higher up instead of saying, "You get off your FA and out of your office and come torch this off."
 
Although a stupid decision by FS, I would love it if a large portion of the public lands in that area torched up. I don't know why, but the deer have nearly vacated that area in the last 5 years. I used to see dozens on every trip now I am lucky to see one or two per visit to the area.
 
smalls said:
Although a stupid decision by FS, I would love it if a large portion of the public lands in that area torched up. I don't know why, but the deer have nearly vacated that area in the last 5 years. I used to see dozens on every trip now I am lucky to see one or two per visit to the area.
Click to expand...

I feel the same way regarding some of the Idaho zones. The ones I am talking about were previously logged, some good feed for a couple of years, then the brush starts growing and strangles some good area.
 
Holy smokes. The Bozeman valley is full of smoke. I just walked outside for the first time today and the only mountains you can see are the Bridgers and you can barely see them. Thanks to the ahole who decided to start the fire, although it was probably needed, not the best time in the world to be burning. I'm heading into the Spanish Peaks tomorrow to do some skiing and won't be able to see a flippin' thing. Guess I'll lighten up the pack and leave the camera at home.
 
" The Bozeman valley is full of smoke. I just walked outside for the first time today and" .......................

You post at noon is the first time out of the house for the day:) I want your job:)LOL
 
Oak said:
Driving a green pickup does not give one a free pass on criminally negligent actions.
Click to expand...

Yep. Except that it does, in reality, give you a free pass. Shouldn't but it does.

Hell, in Arizona no matter what color truck or car you drive, you can set fire intentionally because you're "lost" (after driving around barricades on a road closed due to another fire) and be responsible for charring hundreds of thousands of acres of forest--areas that my kids may NEVER see anything but black sticks in their lifetime--and walk away scot free. But don't drive over the speed limit on the freeways! :rolleyes:

Stupid and irresponsible thing to do. Lots of things are more art than science and don't end up costing people their homes and all. I'm sure it's walking a fine line but you always have to err on the side of caution. Even if takes two or three or four times as long. There are no quick fixes tending Mother Nature's garden.
 
Moosie said:
I tried that line on my wife last night and it didn't go over so well........................
Click to expand...

I dont care who you are that is funny right there
As for the fire I agree just because they drive a green truck doesnt make up for making a stupid decision
 
Oak,

I agree...but you know as well as anyone that the FS isnt getting anything but grief no matter how that fire starts.

The FS lights it and it gets out of hand...the FS takes the blame and everyone is a Monday morning QB telling them they shouldnt have. Even though the same people evacuting their homes were very likely the same people harrassing the FS to "do something about all those dead trees".

Next year a lightning strike starts it on fire and the FS should have "done something" to reduce the fuel loads LAST year...again the FS takes the blame. There is no winning and no way to avoid the inevitable. This is small taters compared to whats going to happen really soon in a large part of the interior west. It will be ugly, and the FS will take the blame...and those living in the woods will be singing the blues.

Tell me what the difference really is...either way that place, along with a whole lot of others, are going to burn, sooner rather than later.

Also, I wouldnt have to worry about evacuting as I'm smart enough to:

1. Not live in the woods.
2. If I did, my house would have defensible space, adequate turn arounds, be properly insured, and very likely a sprinkler system.

DDD, you wait for perfect conditions to light a prescribed fire...they may as well quit manufacturing drip torches...

There always this too: Helena National Forest spokeswoman Kathy Bushnell said U.S. Forest Service’s burn plans are very specific and "they were within those specific prescriptions for this plan yesterday" when the fire was set.


Dutton said when forest officials called with their plans, there were none of the red-flag warnings.
 
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