How much to spend on a new rifle?

[Beignet]

I also think I may just be shooting too fast for what the barrel likes. Groups start out ok and them get worse.

I’ve been curious if this might be a problem for my own shooting as well. I try to slow things down, but my barrel gets damn hot before long. Been thinking of taking a .22 along and plinking to occupy my sitting around time while I wait for the center fire barrel to cool between groups.

 

[Redside]

I haven’t considered taking a class, frankly wasn’t aware that’s even a thing. I do have plenty of experience shooting, having grown up in the Boy Scouts and then served as an infantryman in the army, I just don’t get to the range as often as I should. Only about once every 3 months these days.

I also think I may just be shooting too fast for what the barrel likes. Groups start out ok and them get worse. Hard to say if it’s because the barrel is getting hot, or because my arm is getting sore and I’m flinching. Probably a bit of both.

I do have a 10/22 and an AR, both of which I can group pretty well considering they’re only equipped with iron sights.

As for ammo variety, that’s probably a good place to start looking. I’ve only tried 3: Winchester 7.62x51, Red Army Standard 308, and Federal Power Shok. Basically I’ve just been buying cheap fmj stuff for the range, and then the (also cheap) federal for my hunting rounds. Might be time to bite the bullet and try some spendier ammo.

There are some people that argue you should be able to put 10 rounds in a row through a gun and not really have much of a change in impact. If it starts to drift could be a free floating barrel problem.

Someone on here has also talked about "tuning" a savage by trying different torque values on the action screws. Can't remember who shared the link but you might be able to find it.

I'd definitely try different ammo. It's quite interesting how one can have 3 shots touching and another is 2" or more of a group. Its not always the premium stuff that shoots either.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

I haven’t considered taking a class, frankly wasn’t aware that’s even a thing. I do have plenty of experience shooting, having grown up in the Boy Scouts and then served as an infantryman in the army, I just don’t get to the range as often as I should. Only about once every 3 months these days.

I also think I may just be shooting too fast for what the barrel likes. Groups start out ok and them get worse. Hard to say if it’s because the barrel is getting hot, or because my arm is getting sore and I’m flinching. Probably a bit of both.

I do have a 10/22 and an AR, both of which I can group pretty well considering they’re only equipped with iron sights.

As for ammo variety, that’s probably a good place to start looking. I’ve only tried 3: Winchester 7.62x51, Red Army Standard 308, and Federal Power Shok. Basically I’ve just been buying cheap fmj stuff for the range, and then the (also cheap) federal for my hunting rounds. Might be time to bite the bullet and try some spendier ammo.

If I was you I would follow @brockel and buy one of his projects once he get bored and goes off on another hair.

I've regretted not being patient and missing out approximately 27 times since I joined the forum.

 

[Nick87]

If I was you I would follow @brockel and buy one of his projects once he get bored and goes off on another hair.

I've regretted not being patient and missing out approximately 27 times since I joined the forum.

Thats probably the best advice I've seen on these threads. Perhaps brockel has a waiting list program.

 

[brockel]

Thats probably the best advice I've seen on these threads. Perhaps brockel has a waiting list program.

Not everyone wants oddball stuff

 

[Nick87]

Not everyone wants oddball stuff

They ain't all oddball. Should of bought the awr.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Not everyone [knows they] wants oddball stuff

FIFY

 

[noharleyyet]

Not everyone wants oddball stuff

You still haven’t signed the NDA I sent.

 

[Ben Lamb]

I’ll start out with disclosing I am new to hunting, and newly returned to shooting.

I’m considering upgrading my deer rifle (LH 308 Savage 11 trophy hunter w/Nikon prostaff, they were a package deal) either after this season, or the year after, and I’m trying get something of the lay of the land on how to interpret quality and marginal return for the money.

I’m a bassist, and it kinda seems like rifles may fall into similar price ranges as basses do. What I’m picking up looking around is rifles kinda shake out like

Intro/Starter = <$750
- Lack some features or lower quality, but will get the job done.

Intermediate = $750-$2000
- Good enough for most anything

Pro level =$2000-infinity
- Marginal return on investment in terms of measurable improvement down range the higher up you go, but they sure are pretty.

Is this a fair approximation of the break out?

My rifle firmly falls in the starter category, but it seems to shoot OK. My groups aren’t great, but that’s more on me.

My question then becomes: what features should I look for in this intermediate category to indicate better bang for your buck?

And lastly, what suggestions do you all have for a 308 that is either left handed or ambidextrous?

I know I should also (primarily?) upgrade my optic as well, but that’s a discussion for a different subforum.

Your assesment is about right on break out.

Things to look for that indicate a quality build:

1.) Wood to metal fit. Is the wood or metal extremely proud of the other one? Quality firearms have tight tolerances, and the wood to metal fit needs to reflect this level of detail if you are going to spend money in this price point.

2.) Smoothness of action: The Tikka is a smooth action. YOu don't feel binding when you work it, or grit when you cycle it. It feels like stainless on a bearing almost. A Ruger, on the otherhand, is a looser action, by design, and not quite a smooth as a Tikka, but is still a solid action due to manufacturing tolerances & final polishing & finish (In the Mark II, quality seems to have lessened on the Hawkeyes).

3.) Quality of stock material: With wood - look for better than average grain and make sure it's walnut, not beech or other species. The finish should be smooth to the touch, like they used 1000 grit paper for the finish sanding/polishing. it should not have flaking and it should be an oil finish, not a polymer or varnish, although modern varnish finishes are commonplace (albeit quite gauche).

4.) Metal finishing: No machine marks at all, and highly polished metal regardless of the finish. Smooth steel is good steel. Proper bluing finish with wood, or actual stainless with plastic, etc. Cerakote is fine, but it's not something that indicates increased quality as it's a cheap to apply finish.

5.) Guaranteed accuracy. Any rifle that you drop over $1K on should come with a guarantee of accuracy for at least 1.5 MOA. There is no reason to accept poor accuracy in a newly built firearm. This also helps you deal with the factory if your gun won't shoot, so you protect your investment.

6.) Your scope needs to be high quality and not the last thing you think of. Leupold Vx3HD remains the best bang for the buck re: quality versus cost, but the VX5HD is the clear winner once you step up a level. For a 308, I'd go with a 2.5x8 VX3 or the 2x10 VX5.

Brands:

Tikka, Ruger, Browning, Montana Rifle Company, Weatherby, Sako, Remington all make quality Left handed bolt guns. For lever guns, the BLR, Winchester 95 would be my go to options rather than the Henry, but I'm picky about levers.

For the bolt, my top three would be: MT Rifle, Ruger, Browning.

 

[brockel]

You still haven’t signed the NDA I sent.

When that mashburn makes it back to Montana I’ll sign

 

[Ben Lamb]

Also, here's some left-handed eye candy:

Left Hand Rifles for sale

Browse all new and used Left Hand Rifles for sale and buy with confidence from Guns International.

www.gunsinternational.com

This is what I'd class at a top level tier left-handed firearm: https://www.gunsinternational.com/g...tock-new-left-hand-stock.cfm?gun_id=100958638

 

[Don Fischer]

I’ve been curious if this might be a problem for my own shooting as well. I try to slow things down, but my barrel gets damn hot before long. Been thinking of taking a .22 along and plinking to occupy my sitting around time while I wait for the center fire barrel to cool between groups.

I had a Parker Hale 1200 in 308 back about 1967. First two shot were fine and third started walking. I was told the barrel was most likely not stress relieved! Get a little hot and it start's walking the bullets. I don't really know. But with my much more modern rifles I noticed it was pretty hard to keep the barrel cool when shooting at targets. Because of that I pretty much only work up loads in the late fall and early spring. Outside temp stays down and it's much easier to get the barrel cooled down. Temp get's up in 70's plus and barrels just don't want to cool down well at all. I suspect that the hotter a barrel get the more limber it becomes and vibrates differently as it heats up. I have been told stress relieving can help a great deal. Either that or pay attention to the temperature outside when your shooting! Then of course there's bedding issues that can play havoc.

 

[nhenry]

Also, here's some left-handed eye candy:

Left Hand Rifles for sale

Browse all new and used Left Hand Rifles for sale and buy with confidence from Guns International.

www.gunsinternational.com

I look at this category every day, waiting for the perfect rifle to show up.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Not everyone wants oddball stuff

.35-378 brockel

What do you think?

 

[brockel]

.35-378 brockel

What do you think?

Ouch

 

[Ben Lamb]

.35-378 brockel

What do you think?

 

[Alpine01]

I haven’t considered taking a class, frankly wasn’t aware that’s even a thing. I do have plenty of experience shooting, having grown up in the Boy Scouts and then served as an infantryman in the army, I just don’t get to the range as often as I should. Only about once every 3 months these days.

I also think I may just be shooting too fast for what the barrel likes. Groups start out ok and them get worse. Hard to say if it’s because the barrel is getting hot, or because my arm is getting sore and I’m flinching. Probably a bit of both.

I do have a 10/22 and an AR, both of which I can group pretty well considering they’re only equipped with iron sights.

As for ammo variety, that’s probably a good place to start looking. I’ve only tried 3: Winchester 7.62x51, Red Army Standard 308, and Federal Power Shok. Basically I’ve just been buying cheap fmj stuff for the range, and then the (also cheap) federal for my hunting rounds. Might be time to bite the bullet and try some spendier ammo.

I ended up going through about 14 different options, from 150 gr to 180 gr across 4 different manufactures for my 308. It (Kimber Classic) seemed to really like 165 gr rounds and in particular, the Federal Trophy Bonded Tip. I can get sub 0.75 MOA consistently if I do my part. It also liked Federal 180 Partitions which I can get 1 MOA performance with. But I never had any luck with Hornady (ELD-X 178) or Nosler (Trophy Grade Accubonds and Partitions in 165 gr) rounds, 1.5 - 2.0 MOA at best. Barnes was somewhere in-between but closer to Hornady/Nosler than the Federal stuff. I dropped a 5x5 bull where he stood last year with the TBT from 182 yds. Absolutely devastating. A hunting buddy gave me some Federal Terminal Ascents (175 gr) last year. I haven't had a chance to shoot them yet so I am interested to see how they perform. Hopefully they are a good 2nd or 3rd option. So I would try a lot of different rounds and see which ones your rifle likes the most.

 

[Doublegunner]

Determine your max budget and take it from there. Then divide that by half and spend one half on scope and mount and the other half on the rifle. I'd rather have a $500 scope on a $200 gun than a $200 scope on a $500 gun and whoa to the shooter who spends $30 on rings!!!

Ammo is extra, but worth spending. I bought a Weatherby Vanguard which at first I didn't like because it didn't group like a thought it should. Then I bought 8 boxes of ammo with bullets I would happily hunt with and tried them all out. It was amazing seeing what it did and did not like. 100 yard groups from .7in-3.5in.

Looking back that was the best $300 I ever spent and arguably more important that the rifle OR the scope.

This is good advice.

 

[Doublegunner]

That’s just it, I wasn’t asking for model recommendations, that just started happening. I suppose what I’m really asking is, to you statement, what is it that earned various makes/models their good reputation? Presuming that most every innovation has been more or less copied by most every manufacturer, what are the improved/more reliable features that I should be looking for?

I'm not entirely sure there is really anything new regarding most bolt action rifle these days regarding how they function. Mostly it's what they are made from and how well they are made. The reality is that you can get a good shooter for not a lot of money but it's going to be deficient in some areas. The finish will be thin, it'll rust easily and the stock will be flexible. But it will shoot. The more you spend the more you get. Carbon fiber stock or nice walnut, Stainless steel, better trigger, carbon fiber wrap barrel,and so on. Depends on what you want. We have lots of reliable proven brands out there. I would figure out what's important to you regarding features and start to narrow the field that way. Then go look at them in the store. As long you stick to reputable brands you should be fine. Once you find the one your thinking about buying get back on this site and ask peoples opinions. I'll also say this, don't go cheap on the scope. Buy the best you can afford. At least the vx3hd. With good glass you will be able to shoot the rifle more accurately. I really like the vx5 models for cost and performance. Next, try as many different types of ammo you can find. I own many rifles and they all like something different. I'm not reloading right now so I try to find an inexpensive target round and also my hunting round. Then get out and practice.

 

[BenInMT]

If I didn’t reload I don’t think I would spend much on a rifle. Maybe like 1/3 of what I’d spend on the glass and mounts.