Honest answers for a question....

[supersider34]

I am asking you all a question and would like honest answers from you.
What is your major concern while out hunting? Do you as hunters look out for the welfare of a deer herd in general or a easy hunt? I will be printing this out to submit the answers to F&G. Alot of the archery hunters in my area here are trying to get info and feedback from all hunters to go to F&G about them opening up a Muzzleloader hunt into a unit that has not been anything but a archery unit for who knows how long. The herd here is not as big as F&G think and I am asking all on here for feedback on this. I spend alot of time out and about and have been from one end of the unit to the other. i do not see the numbers that have been told to me by some of the F&G officers here. They have counted the numbers in the spring when coming off the wintering range from what I have been told. So to justify opening a area for a hunt the deer do not know what the weapons will do, Is this fair to the game? They will stand out and look at you if driving by and they usually run out to about a 100 yds and stop and will look at you. Our herd will be slaughtered. Every archery hunter i have talked to wants to stop this hunt.
So again I ask a couple questions that are basically the same so would like your opinions on it.
Do you consider a ML hunt a fair chase scenario situation if the deer have never been hunted with anything other than archery?
I am not looking for a debate but just opinions on what I have stated as I said this will be printed out and submitted to Id F&G with other info I and others have collected.

 

[antlershed]

SS These area's have not been open to any other type of hunting besides bow in years? Are there other area's only open to ML hunters and rifle hunters only?

 

[OSOK]

I would suspect that the F&G will probably go ahead w/ things, and your deer herd will never be the same again for sometime to come. That's what Colorado did w/ my honey holes anyway!

 

[BuzzH]

SS,

The best avenue you have to stop this kind of thing is not a few replies from a hunt forum. You need to get an ORGANIZED group of Idaho archery hunters (like the Montana Bowhunters Association does in Montana) to really make some things happen.

As to the issue, I dont think the IDGF will view this as being "fair" to the deer or to the archery hunters of Idaho. They're strictly looking at it from a management plan that says they have too many deer and they need to be killed.

I'd look closely at their "numbers", as typically population estimates are pretty "rough" in some cases. I recently read and commented on Montanas Elk Management Plan and the MTFWP documents in that literature that elk population estimates (in many areas) with a confidence interval of 40%...thats a pretty large fluctuation. In my opinion, with that kind of variation, estimating population would be just about as accurate if Rodney Dangerfield, the clown biologist, pulled a number straight out of his ass.

If you spend a lot of time in the unit, tell them what YOU see, and what others are seeing population wise...also comment on the condition of the browse in there. If the habitat is not being degraded, I dont see the need to whack and stack the deer.

All that said, without having seen the area, the condition of the habitat, and seeing their numbers...its pretty difficult for me to comment much beyond that.

Good luck, and hopefully a solution can be worked out that favors whats best for the herd.

 

[wyomingtim]

If they are set in their mind to allow ML hunters, make a big push to make sure it is primative weapons - no in-line allowed. This would at least make it a little more difficult and give the deer a better chance.

 

[BrianID]

Supersider,

If there is something we can do besides making a post on an internet forum let us know. I think I know what unit you are talking about but could be wrong because I haven't heard anything official yet. I don't think archery hunters are asking too much for wanting only a half a unit to themselves.

If muzzleloader hunters were allowed hunt there I don't think there would be any moral issues with anyone shooting deer there. Most of the deer that were stupid enough to stand there and stare at hunters would be gone after one season. The moral question part of it could be compared to rut hunts and what happened in unit 56 this year. Most of those mature bucks killed in 56 and mature bucks killed on rut hunts don't act half as "smart" as mature bucks in general season units during October.

Do the F&G in the Magic Valley Region like to keep things a secrete until they are printed in the regs? Last April I tried to find something official about unit 56 getting opened up to any buck for part of the general season but couldn't find anything about it. Things like that get to hunters upset at the F&G most.

 

[BrianID]

i think the F&G shouldn't just open up a unit into a general hunt that will be a war zone like what happened in 56 this year. Why not slowly increase the number of tags for a few years and then open it up to a controlled hunt?

 

[1_pointer]

wyotim- Why no inlines? They've been around since the 1800's, just not in the style that you see now. IIRC the Longhunter Society excepts them in the traditional category as long as loose powder is used and no scopes.

 

[wyomingtim]

I just dont think having that kind of accuracy at those ranges qualifies in the spirit of the ML hunt. I know all of the arguments, and I know all of the same arguments were used with compund bows, but thats just how I feel.

 

[Moosie]

Wyoming tim, Although the Inlines Brag about thier Accuracey, I disagree that the guys with Traditionals can't shoot as good. There is a big Coon cap wearing bunch of guys around here that put 99% of the inline shooters to shame. I still think it's a "Know yer gun" type senario. MAybe thats just me ?

S.S. Get yer boys together and Let's go talk to the Fish and Game. Like I said in a prior Email. I know which doors to knock on and we can git 'er done. Although most organizations think F&G jsut do their stuff without listening thats 100% wrong. I thnik if someone goes in with "FACTS" and a "VOICE" they can change things.. or in your case Keep them the same. I agree With Buzz that this place's Input won't get much done, But we can by going into them with information and a group.

You got my #, You got the Info, Call me up and We'll go talk to the Region.

 

[1_pointer]

tim- No worries, I was just yanking your chain abit...and do agree to an extent.

 

[sm]

trying to answer your two questions............here in northern ontario i have found that in last few years alot more emphasis has been put into management of our deer herds.

our camp has really been trying to cull as you might say the weeker and also more does as the population has really increased.

we really are new to this management thing as yet but are learning all the time. alot of our info comes from forums like this.


so please keep us imformed

 

[IdahoPredatorHunter]

supersider34, I do not think that there are many hunters out there who care about the welfare of any animals.(I will use the Idaho unit 56 deer and unit 69 A tag late cow hunt as examples.) With that being said, there are more serious hunters, like most the ones who frequent this sight, that I believe understand the importance of herd management and welfare. In order to answer your question I need more information. Are there motorized vehicle restrictions in this unit? What time of year does this hunt occur? With answers to these questions I feel I can give you a better answer as to how I feel it would impact the deer herd.

 

[crabyx78]

I would think if F&G are intent on a ML hunt,having a lower number of
tag's would prevent a "over kill" to reach what ever quota the state is
after.Also it would condition the animals to the longer reach of guns.Maybe?
Ideally having a bow only unit with limited access is perfect.

 

[Sako7STW]

Personaly I beleive having a few specialty areas is a good thing. If Bow hunting is your bag then hey, what a better area to go to then that! Adding ML hunt to it will likely have the effect SS is stating and ID and its residents would be loosing a great opportunity to stretch their strings at a quality number of animals. That would be a shame and I for one support no MZL hunt!

 

[nitro x]

As was mentioned This board has no power to change things. You need politicians and facts to support your argument.
This society is not a Democracy it is a Republic.In a Democracy you simply need a majority opinion.In a Republic all people are represented equally.The muzzle loader guys have just as much right as the archery guys so there needs to be some other argument to persuade your game and fish.
Not to say there isn't one but I have yet to hear a good one.
PS NITRO is a PSE BOW,and X is the center of an archery target,so you know where I am.