Hiring

[MarvB]

Regarding social media, a suggestion is to check with your HR dept. first on what they consider to be “policy”. Ours for example (govt. organization) would not allow us to bring up anything in an interview we saw on an SM site (they actually told us not to search them but....) unless it was a job related site like LinkedIn, Glass Door, etc. Don’t know the reason why other than that was their rule. I personally found them helpful, shied away from those that thought posting 90 pics with red plastic cups was the secret to being “liked” these days

 

[SAJ-99]

As a current stay at home dad for 4+ years, the hole left in my resume has got me even more nervous now.

I was/am stay-at-home dad for along time. The comments here on "gaps" are hilarious. Makes you understand why for the past 50yrs women drop out of labor force at such a high rate. Hard part for you is keeping your skill set sharp.

 

[RobertD]

I have a PhD and my late wife was on staff at the university. The pressure to market degrees instead of provide educational OPPORTUNITY is the way things have gone.

Not to derail OPs thread, but I had to comment on this because it resonates so thoroughly with me. I work for a university and am halfway through my MA. I would add to your comment the marketing of the "college experience" and the "Enjoy the pool and the rock climbing wall and the video games while we babysit you through a four-year degree and you magically get hired the day you leave this place" mentality... we have really devalued college education as a whole in many ways.

To OP, I guess to help make this relevant to your hiring search, when you interview candidates with degrees, pay less attention to what the degree is in and what school it came from... pay more attention to how they talk about their educational experience, and whether or not they took an active role in seeking knowledge and experiences in college to prepare themselves for the future or just "went through the motions."

 

[88man]

Non-hunting related question...

It appears I am being put in a position at the company I work for to hire a new employee. I'm having resumes passed over to me and will likely be involved in the interview process as well. Not having any experience with this sort of thing, I find myself overanalyzing the resumes I'm getting. I was wondering if any of you have been put in this position and have any useful feedback about your experience: red flags, what not to get caught up with, etc. This isn't a high-level position but we've had bad luck in the past (I wasn't part of that but trying to figure out what was missed) and I'd like to get it as right as one can at this stage. Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thank you,
Chris

Chris, follow up with the references. Just do the best you can and organize and take it seriously. There is no magical equation for a good hire> trust your gut and good luck with the experience.

I have missed bucks at 40 yrds with a rifle that were a slam dunk and killed runners at 250yrds. Just do your best. However, when references say they will do a great job they typically do!

 

[OntarioHunter]

All the above are great ideas/techniques for the interview/hiring process. I believe the OP mentioned he was working on a hire for a manual labor/unskilled worker type position. For a number of years I was responsible for hiring warehouse and delivery personnel for a large furniture store, here in AK. One of the things I did before setting up an interview was to check the state court system for legal problems. This step unqualified quite a few prospective employees. Another thing I would do (today) would be to check their social media footprint - FB, Twitter, Instagram, etc.

Good suggestion! I don't do the Twitter FaceBook thing but it would be a good way to flesh out some psychiatric background. Okay ... I'll resist the overwhelming urge to make some caustic political analogy at this point. Heh, heh.

 

[dcopas78]

Having been one of those guys with some significant gaps, I would never rule out a candidate on that basis.

Understandable, but I also suggested that he use his own judgement on that. It doesn't mean their resume automatically goes in file 13, but it is a way to narrow down the pile. There are obvious exceptions, especially for someone that is highly trained and just hasn't been lucky with previous employers. One of the best interviewees o ever had was a woman in her late 30s who had significant gaps because she was raising a family. She was highly trained and experienced and I tried to hire her, but she wanted more money than I could offer for the position available. In her case, her experience and the fact that she had stuck with the same type of work made the gaps in employment unimportant.

 

[Fire_9]

However, when references say they will do a great job they typically do!

Or they’re tired of carrying them as dead weight and want to see them get hired somewhere else. I’ve offered to be a reference for someone on more than one occasion...

 

[LopeHunter]

The only thing I would add is on the recruiting side. Work your network to find good people to target vs. just hoping the right person sees the job posting and applies. Get referrals from people you know and trust about others they might know who would be good candidates. Longer term, build a pipeline of potential people you would hire and maintain contact with them until you have an opening. 80% of my hires over the years were determined before I ever posted the job.

The way I approach the vetting process is that the resume is mostly used to weed people out. The interview is what determines whether someone gets an offer. I spend at least half of the time in the interview determining personality and assessing cultural fit for the broader team. I ask very open ended to questions to get them talking as much as possible. I put a lot of emphasis on team dynamics and morale, so I want to make sure any new person will contribute to that in a positive way vs. negative.

Two questions I ask every single candidate are:
1. Why are you looking to make a change? If they respond to that question by going on a rant about their current or previous job, company or boss, then they are immediately removed from consideration Life is what you make of it, and I don’t tolerate victim mentality.
2. What are you passionate about (and it doesn’t have to be job or career related)? I want people who are passionate. If they get to choose the topic, and don’t come across as passionate, then I likely won’t hire them. I can teach a lot of skills, but I can’t teach passion.

Once we have an offer accepted, I immediately send one of two books to each candidate as a welcome gift before they start. I either send them “No Excuses” by quadruple amputee Kyle Maynard or “Extreme Ownership” by former Navy Seal Jocko Willink. Both of those books espouse the attitude I expect of my team: Own the situation and own your outcome. No excuses.

I work my trusted network hard when we get an opening which is not often but about three years ago I was having a discussion with an industry acquaintance back East and I mentioned I aggressively seek out candidates through references prior to listing an opening. They asked if our company had a concern over lack of diversity. Well, now you mention it. So, I spent a lot of effort recently to expand my network so can gather up names of candidates that are a broader representation of the community here. Still making good hires yet now we are beginning to look more like our community. The diversity brings some tension compared to homogeneity but also yields better solutions for challenges we face as take care of our customers.

 

[VikingsGuy]

A few reactions.

I would shy away from the social media approach. It can create legal issues in some states, and more importantly is a dubious predictor of job performance. Lots of successful people bifurcate work and home. Fun with the old college friends for 5 minutes on Facebook, while still being able to be nose to the grindstone in the office.

As for references, unless I have a prior independent relationship with the person giving the reference I have found them almost useless in predicting success. Sometimes folks are just too nice, sometimes folks are unnecessarily jerks, sometimes folks are natural salespeople, sometimes there are reasons more on the boss than the employee for a departure, but more often than not, different leaders value different skills/styles so what may or may not have worked somewhere else could be different for my place. Where I work, we don't even use them anymore. A company validates resume credentials and that's it.

As for academic transcripts, unless it is an entry-level position in a very technical field and you are looking for the busy dutiful type, but not necessarily the independent thinker, I am not sure they add much. If technical knowledge is necessary, better to determine that for yourself vs some inflated grade done with help from a roommate.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Non-hunting related question...

It appears I am being put in a position at the company I work for to hire a new employee. I'm having resumes passed over to me and will likely be involved in the interview process as well. Not having any experience with this sort of thing, I find myself overanalyzing the resumes I'm getting. I was wondering if any of you have been put in this position and have any useful feedback about your experience: red flags, what not to get caught up with, etc. This isn't a high-level position but we've had bad luck in the past (I wasn't part of that but trying to figure out what was missed) and I'd like to get it as right as one can at this stage. Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thank you,
Chris

I’ve done maybe 200 interviews. I don’t read the applications or resumes. I’ll spend 5-10 seconds scanning the 1st page for red flags but that’s it.

If you can, have your first interview be brief (10 mins) and via video.

1. why does this position interest you?
2. What’s your understanding of what (position) does at our organization?
3. What makes you good for the job?

You can weed out 50% of people within the first 60 seconds of this mini interview. Select from the remaining 50% a handful that you liked or stood out for a full interview. Go back and actually read their paperwork and have some pointed questions for them. I like to give softball questions prompting them to showcase their accomplishments and skills.

Who you actually hire is probably 50% luck if they turn out to be OK vs a real stellar find...don’t overthink it.

 

[Nameless Range]

As for academic transcripts, unless it is an entry-level position in a very technical field and you are looking for the busy dutiful type, but not necessarily the independent thinker, I am not sure they add much. If technical knowledge is necessary, better to determine that for yourself vs some inflated grade done with help from a roommate.

As someone who failed out of college twice, and when I finally passed did so unimpressively, I approve of this message.

 

[antlerradar]

I had to hire quite a few teachers when I was on the school board.
Make sure practice your interview questions in advance, you will want looking at the prospective employee and not at a sheet of questions. If you can not remember them have someone else read the questions.
Make sure your questions are vetted by someone in VikingsGuy's profession. Don't make them up yourself.
One thing I have noticed is if the person is not a little nervous, they are not all that interested in the job.

 

[406dn]

Ahhhhhhh, it's nice to be retired.

My biggest interfacing with hiring was defending employees who got into some sort of trouble. That is, I was the chairman of the union for wage employees in the refinery for quite a few years.

For the most part the workforce was very good because the pay and benefits were very good. That made the competition for positions very steep. Far more people got into difficulty because of a personality clash with their supervisor than their actual job skills. Many times it was a situation in their personal life, bleeding into their work.

I can tell you were there is a huge opportunity for improvement. That is selecting first line supervisors. Many of them couldn't get a puppy to follow them if they had a steak in each hand.

It is nice to be retired.

 

[OntarioHunter]

A few reactions.

I would shy away from the social media approach. It can create legal issues in some states, and more importantly is a dubious predictor of job performance. Lots of successful people bifurcate work and home. Fun with the old college friends for 5 minutes on Facebook, while still being able to be nose to the grindstone in the office.

As for references, unless I have a prior independent relationship with the person giving the reference I have found them almost useless in predicting success. Sometimes folks are just too nice, sometimes folks are unnecessarily jerks, sometimes folks are natural salespeople, sometimes there are reasons more on the boss than the employee for a departure, but more often than not, different leaders value different skills/styles so what may or may not have worked somewhere else could be different for my place. Where I work, we don't even use them anymore. A company validates resume credentials and that's it.

As for academic transcripts, unless it is an entry-level position in a very technical field and you are looking for the busy dutiful type, but not necessarily the independent thinker, I am not sure they add much. If technical knowledge is necessary, better to determine that for yourself vs some inflated grade done with help from a roommate.

Agreed on most points. About the only thing I want to know from previous employers is did the person show up to work when he/she was supposed to. If the reference tells me the guy went above and beyond call of duty in that regard (obliging for overtime and covering other bases when needed, etc.), that means something. One has to be careful not to be leading when looking for the extra mile information. If it was there, it should be reported spontaneously. I really choose to make assessments for team player potential on my own in the interview. I never asked about that from previous employers. My perception of team player may be different than the next guy's. And managers who aren't any good at "team building" (a term that's so overused) generally have teams that are trainwrecks ... but of course it's always everyone else's fault! I could tell some stories!

A university degree usually means the person has shown some dedication to completing an objective. Transcript may give some idea about consistency and planning to meet that objective. My undergraduate work was finished in less than four years and second BA in little more than two. Honor roll GPA but just barely. I averaged about 22 credits a quarter the second go round ... when I had a new wife and baby. My graduate degrees were not very timely but the end products were exceptional (+ working full time, another new wife, and two babies). 4.00 and published.

In my field written product speaks loudest (e.g. theses). As an interviewer one should look for examples of finished work or projects. Even potential construction employees should be able to provide some examples of their handiwork.

Personally, I find more promise in someone with diversity in their background. It doesn't necessarily mean they can't stick with it. Perhaps they like challenges and enjoy thinking outside the box. Those types can be extremely productive. You just have to flesh out which way the frequent flyer flies. My resume and vitae are both very thick. Life was simply too short to be wasting it not being creative. A few employers capitalized on it and were amply rewarded. Most were afraid of it. Team builders who should have been baseball coaches. "Everyone take their place in the lineup and on the field and wait till a ball comes your way. Don't move!" Yawn. I'm a business historian and once read an interesting monograph on the disadvantages of traditional team building. Saab tried a different approach to an absenteeism problem at their auto plant. They forced rotation in assembly line positions. A worker would spend six months installing windows and then moved to painting or engines. Most of the plant was automated so it didn't require a lot of retraining. The benefit to Saab was remarkable. Employees took more interest in producing a better product and absenteeism dropped off dramatically. Employees were never in one place long enough to build up a lot of workplace drama. Moral of the story is someone who changes careers a lot is not necessarily a potential problem. They may be a potential asset ... in the right job ... for the right employer.

 

[longbow51]

I couldn't resist.

 

[OntarioHunter]

I couldn't resist.

That was a riot. Thanks.

 

[ChrisC]

Wow! Thank you all for the feedback. A lot to process here. Really, thank you all for taking the time!

Regarding the position, it's mostly going to be typical office duties in a small business: order entry, phones/emails, shipping, basic technical support, etc...nothing that can't be taught in terms of how we do it. I don't think it will be hard to find someone to do these skills, but I'm really after someone who takes an interest in learning all facets of the company, who can help out wherever it's needed, and doesn't feel limited in terms of what they can accomplish while at the company. I don't have a problem with them eventually growing out of this role and into a new one here (or adding to their role), provided that they don't ever feel a role has become beneath them.

I'm not sure if that's too much to ask, I just really dislike those who have complacent attitudes and think there is an end to learning. I'm hoping this is evident during the interview process.

No pressure!

you hold the future of someone's life in your decision making abilities, and you owe it to all of them and your company to do you due diligence.

 

[Bambistew]

I'm hardly an expert, but I've interviewed for probably for probably a dozen positions over the years, for what I was looking for it was pretty easy to pull out the candidates from the pile that I wanted to talk to. For me it started with job history, as in how much and how long at one place. Did they move up, and why are they looking for a change. As mentioned if they were looking for more of a challenge... sign here. If it was for some other reason, then why? Get them talking about their passions, do they like to learn new things, or play sports? That passion generally follows through to work ethic, it also helps you see if they will fit in with the rest of the employees.

I disagree about the schooling that was mentioned above to some extent. I'm probably the dumbest person in the room in any number of internal meetings I attend. I would estimate 25% of our staff have a PhD, and another 50% has at least 1 masters degree the rest of us peons get by on street smarts and past experience. It takes a special person to dedicate that much time and effort to learning something. This is not always the case, but it takes a special individual to have a PhD in the geosciences and engineering. A master in business? meah...

As far as interviewing, don't ask stupid questions. I interviewed for a seat on a board a while back, and at the end of the interview I told them I wasn't interested in the position after the interview. The questions where some of the stupidest things I've ever had someone ask me. What are my favorite books? Who would I like to spend a week on an island with? Who do you idolize? Who is my favorite historical figure? WTF. None of that had anything to do with the position, and if someone was this I'll prepared for an interview I didn't want to be part of their dong factory.

I forgot the most important one for me... Did they research the company they want to work for. If they have no clue who you are, it will be obvious in the interview, and I ask them up front. Someone that want to work for you will know what you do, someone who wants a paycheck won't have a clue and will expect to learn about you in the interview.

 

[BenInMT]

Hire slow fire fast make sure she’s hot and isn’t going to get knocked up 6 months into it? Biggest red flag for me is someone who‘s been looking for greener pastures their entire career and always jumping on to the next thing, usually they make the jump right around the time they see the writing on the wall that they are going to be cut loose. Those types crush interviews because they have a lot of practice.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

I couldn't resist.

Gen Z, Millennials are mid to late 30s now.

"Generation" not "Young people"