FWP giving up on scientific management

Ya... Democrats went too far left and Montanan's voted to reverse it.
Really? How far left could the Democrats have gone to compare to this craziness? The Democrats have always, as far as I can remember, been on the side of preserving public hunting land. If that's too far left then someone please send me a membership card for the Communist Party.
 
🙄
Take your blinders off...
I asked for some help seeing how far left the Dems went and that's your answer? Obviously I don't see what you see ... and with an answer like that it's probably because you don't really see anything anyway. And I'm the one wearing blinders? The sad truth is too many Montanans bought into the conservative "Make America Great Again" propaganda. It's a myth because it can mean anything and everything ... or nothing at all when it suits whatever way the wind blows. It sounds good. That's it. And the "fight back" crap was equally blind and meaningless. Just inspire hate for the sake of doing it. A distraction. Someone else has to be to blame ... even if there's nothing really worth blaming. Dems are bad ... just because they are. It's the liberals and the mainstream media's fault Republicans make a mess of things. Sure the GOP screws up but it's always because someone else makes them or makes them look bad. It would always have to be worse if the liberals get elected. Worse than January 6th? Worse than the mess Gianforte is making of Montana's precious natural resources? How is that possible?
 
We are not going to agree on this… hence the reason some will find a sway to the article and others will find it as desired.
I’m not looking for any sway. I asked a legitimate question. I’d think YOU of all people would be unhappy with this given your perpetual heartburn about minimum population counts.

You want good scientific data to chart the best path forward for Region 1? Tough shit, you ain’t getting it based on extrapolation from the Bitterroot.
“Now we’ve got a heated discussion on predator-prey relationships in Region 1,” Kujala said, referring to the Sanders-Lincoln-Flathead county area of northwest Montana. “We think we can respond to that pressure not with a research design put in place, but rather with directly applied management application coupled with thoughtfully applied research that answers those pressing discussions.”

Gianforte signed four wolf-control bills brought by Republican Sanders County legislators Rep. Paul Fielder and Sen. Bob Brown in the just-finished legislative session. They require FWP to reduce wolf populations to a “sustainable” level and direct the state Fish and Wildlife Commission to consider allowing unlimited wolf kills, hunting wolves at night on private land, and using bait to hunt them. Other new laws allow the use of snares to kill wolves and lets private organizations reimburse wolf hunters for their expenses.

I can all but guarantee you won’t be happy with them trying to extrapolate across different regions. I’ve seen it with my own eyes how flawed that approach can be.

Kujala is trying to polish a turd and he knows it. Good luck, you’ll need it. Instead of pushing for adaptive management research to possibly chart a better path forward, let’s just keep the same old season structure while we kill more woofs. What a freaking joke.
 
Shows a certain sway within the "article"...
We are not going to agree on this… hence the reason some will find a sway to the article and others will find it as desired.
Meaning the sway of the article is fit to follow their viewpoint.
I’m not looking for any sway.

Sorry, couldn’t help myself.
 
Kujala is a good dude. This isn’t him. He is doing what he’s told. I feel for some of the good employees at fwp dealing with this mess.
 
Kujala is a good dude. This isn’t him. He is doing what he’s told. I feel for some of the good employees at fwp dealing with this mess.
He is a good dude.
 
I can all but guarantee you won’t be happy with them trying to extrapolate across different regions. I’ve seen it with my own eyes how flawed that approach can be.
This is where you and I will continue to disagree. I think FWP has not done a sufficient job with their quotas and approximated #'s for our woof counts. You say tough shit - I say... many say tough shit to you and others who find the quotas are quality actions taken by our FWP.

I think tough shit fits perfect when telling where the eco extremists have held hostage our State's FWP actions for quotas simply because they are adjacent to a National Park??? I say - tough shit to those eco's wack - jobs.

to claim quota of 2 wolves able to be taken is so far out of wack for such a large swath of poor elk numbers as it is (not accounting for other aspects adversely effecting our elk...

Remember, Buzz has constantly held heavy adverse opinions on R1 and R2's FWP counting activity and the bs reasons why our copter is not in use nor the counts properly managed... (edit: I can quote if you need.. though I think he's made it pretty clear)
 
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I asked for some help seeing how far left the Dems went and that's your answer? Obviously I don't see what you see ... and with an answer like that it's probably because you don't really see anything anyway. And I'm the one wearing blinders? The sad truth is too many Montanans bought into the conservative "Make America Great Again" propaganda.
My blinder referral is based on your assessment for why a nut job such as G won over Cooney (whom I voted for)... by the same voters who've voted D governors while also voting R Presidents ever since Martz!

There is a reason and the blinders are a reference to your narrow view you shared of what the same Montanans voted to change the direction with an R Governor. While I would have greatly voted for FOX, Cooney was not a bad choice. Yet...
 
This is where you and I will continue to disagree. I think FWP has not done a sufficient job with their quotas and approximated #'s for our woof counts. You say tough shit - I say... many say tough shit to you and others who find the quotas are quality actions taken by our FWP.

I think tough shit fits perfect when telling where the eco extremists have held hostage our State's FWP actions for quotas simply because they are adjacent to a National Park??? I say - tough shit to those eco's wack - jobs.

to claim quota of 2 wolves able to be taken is so far out of wack for such a large swath of poor elk numbers as it is (not accounting for other aspects adversely effecting our elk...

Remember, Buzz has constantly held heavy adverse opinions on R1 and R2's FWP counting activity and the bs reasons why our copter is not in use nor the counts properly managed...
And they sure as hell won’t get their data from the Bitterroot. I don’t give two chits what metric you feel like using for wolf counts. You’re not going to be able to simply extrapolate and have a good adaptive management strategy moving forward.

Do you really think your regional elk counts suck because of a wolf quota near the park? Really? Have you ever questioned the fact they suck because of a lack of adaptive management and a true understanding of how many elk there are, and how they use then landscape?

But here’s the rub. A new adaptive management plan takes research and data, none of which you’re getting.

The only person you’re hurting with your tough shit attitude is every elk hunter in region 1. Like I said, good luck cause you’ll damned sure need it. Everyone will pat themselves on the back for accomplishing the wolf legislation, then in 7-8 years they’ll be left to wonder why the elk hunting still sucks.
 
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Do you really think your regional elk counts suck because of a wolf quota near the park? Really? Have you ever questioned the fact they suck because of a lack of adaptive management and a true understanding of how many elk there are, and how they use then landscape?
Are you shitting me??? READ.

to claim quota of 2 wolves able to be taken is so far out of wack for such a large swath of poor elk numbers as it is (not accounting for other aspects adversely effecting our elk...
 
What you really should be pressing for is a study equivalent to the Absoraka project that Wyoming did in conjunction with NPS. That’s good data. But hey, you can just extrapolate.
 
Are you shitting me??? READ.
I did read it. I have no idea exactly what you were trying to say. But hey, I’m just looking for political sway. About the date on that photo?
 
Everyone will pat themselves on the back for accomplishing the wolf legislation, then in 7-8 years they’ll be left to wonder why the elk hunting still sucks.
This in spades. But then it’s the easy way out for hunters. Blame the wolf while doing nothing more than bitching on the net from the living room couch and demanding to kill a cow.

Seen it more that once and lived it through the Vore years.
 
What you really should be pressing for is a study equivalent to the Absoraka project that Wyoming did in conjunction with NPS. That’s good data. But hey, you can just extrapolate.
Hey, you're pretty good at your own extrapolation from articles. I look at the fact we have a quota of taking two wolves for an entire area we suffer from a lack of elk. That is attributed to more than the wolf factor though the lack of effective management on the total population of wolves for this area that is lacking a healthy elk population by no means is helped by not maintaining a reasonable level of wolves with a quota of 2... and this is simply one example.

1621049869692.png

1621049968302.png

This is a reason so many are frustrated with the wolf packs that attribute to the hinderance of recovering elk population in 110.
 
Hey, you're pretty good at your own extrapolation from articles. I look at the fact we have a quota of taking two wolves for an entire area we suffer from a lack of elk. That is attributed to more than the wolf factor though the lack of effective management on the total population of wolves for this area that is lacking a healthy wolf population by no means is helped by not maintaining a reasonable level of wolves with a quota of 2... and this is simply one example.

View attachment 183342

View attachment 183343

This is a reason so many are frustrated with the wolf packs that attribute to the hinderance of recovering elk population in 110.
You could shoot every damned wolf in that pack and your elk numbers would still suck.
 
Carry on JLS... Your point has missed the mark. Hell, even Buzz says FWP is fugged up with respect to proper counting of elk. Lays blame directly on FWP. though hey, your point is what? That a quota of taking two wolves in an area as large as 110 means jack squat for our elk. We sure as heck do not see each other's point.
 

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