As busy as it sounded like he was this morning, I hope you didn't tell him I sent you.
Endangered Grizzly Bear Photo Thread
- Thread starter BigHornRam
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Cheesehead
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I loaned my copy out and haven't seen it since then.Some good stories in it. Can't remember the grizzly photo though.
So had a conversation with Kevin, he had mentioned that WSF pitched the idea of open more unlimited tags/quota sheep/goat hunts 4-5 years ago. Like @Oak had mentioned. He sent me a copy of what was pitched. Was focused around how the MT unlimited bighorn hunts runs, as far as quotas, population density, terrain, prices, and pretty much all the other stuff that guys doing this hunt already know about. He mentioned that WSF isnt in the business of setting regulations but have advocated towards this type of hunt ( where applicable ). But it is ultimately up to the state wild life agency to decide.
sacountry
Well-known member
I see the logic, but man there are already a ton of organizations out there at the state and national level. My thought is show MWF or BCHA the demand and they will apply focus to draw in more dollars.
I fully support more unlimited areas. Is a “chapter” the best way to organize ourselves and approach individual state game agencies to push them on the idea? I don’t think a “chapter” would be the right structure. More like a task force, across chapters, showing national level interest?
I also think the meetings of the “chapter” would be hilarious. A bunch of hardcore hunters sitting around NOT sharing hunting stories or photos. “Man I just got back from an awesome hunt in……nevermind. Here is a macro zoomed in photo of the rams horn base.” It would be some quiet meetings!
I also think the meetings of the “chapter” would be hilarious. A bunch of hardcore hunters sitting around NOT sharing hunting stories or photos. “Man I just got back from an awesome hunt in……nevermind. Here is a macro zoomed in photo of the rams horn base.” It would be some quiet meetings!
mevertsen
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There are actually a couple areas in NV which I have wondered if they could work. Extreme terrain, remote, wilderness, and challenge for succes, even with the draw tags.
Lilhowie83
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I think unit 27-1 would be a great unit for an unlimited tag in Idaho. They give 12 tags in the draw, but there are only 2-3 rams killed every season.
mevertsen
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Yes. A couple of desert units.
shines@times
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Sounds like a natural match to the concept. Would Montana's 48 hours to report work there?
BAKPAKR
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A lot of people fly in to a backcountry strip to start the 27-1 hunt so the ability to check a ram in within 48 hours could be dependent on arranging a flight out.
Also, for non-residents, the tag costs are quite a bit steeper than Montana — $2626.75 tag + $185 license.
Bluffgruff
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Part of the distribution of opportunity with the tag cost. Its "more" accessible, but not for everyone every year. $3000 is much easier to swing to say you hunted sheep than $20k+ for a dall.
BuzzH
Well-known member
I would never advocate for an unlimited hunt in Wyoming for sheep.
I would rather see the current management system stay in place where a sheep hunter that draws doesn't have to fall victim to a short, compressed seasons where people are killing barely legal rams.
I'd much rather see sheep hunters get to enjoy a reasonable season length and be able to look over a lot more rams. That gives hunters the opportunity to select rams over 8 years old, rather than pound on 4-5 year old barely legal sheep. Much better for herd health and much better trophy quality.
One of the best parts of my Wyoming sheep hunt was the ability to spread the season out over a couple months with no pressure to kill the first legal ram I saw. The late part of my hunt was pretty awesome, very few hunters with a tag left and new rams that moved out of the park...rams that would never be hunted in an early unlimited deal. Quality of a sheep hunt matters, and my experience in the MT unlimited units I hunted (2 of them 300 and 301) wasn't near the quality of my WY hunt.
The other issue with an unlimited season in Wyoming is the wilderness guide law...NR's would be forced to use a guide or hunt with a resident which would mean a $10-11K unlimited sheep hunt.
I would rather see the current management system stay in place where a sheep hunter that draws doesn't have to fall victim to a short, compressed seasons where people are killing barely legal rams.
I'd much rather see sheep hunters get to enjoy a reasonable season length and be able to look over a lot more rams. That gives hunters the opportunity to select rams over 8 years old, rather than pound on 4-5 year old barely legal sheep. Much better for herd health and much better trophy quality.
One of the best parts of my Wyoming sheep hunt was the ability to spread the season out over a couple months with no pressure to kill the first legal ram I saw. The late part of my hunt was pretty awesome, very few hunters with a tag left and new rams that moved out of the park...rams that would never be hunted in an early unlimited deal. Quality of a sheep hunt matters, and my experience in the MT unlimited units I hunted (2 of them 300 and 301) wasn't near the quality of my WY hunt.
The other issue with an unlimited season in Wyoming is the wilderness guide law...NR's would be forced to use a guide or hunt with a resident which would mean a $10-11K unlimited sheep hunt.
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Politely, it just sounds like unlimited sheep hunts aren’t for you. And they certainly aren’t for everyone.
Some solutions to the issues you pointed out though:
If we don’t want 4.5 year old rams getting whacked then change it to 7/8 curl instead of 3/4 curl.
Wyoming’s wilderness guide rule is stupid and needs to be eliminated regardless of unlimited sheep hunts.
Don’t hunt the 300’s if you want solitude on an unlimited sheep hunt.
Some solutions to the issues you pointed out though:
If we don’t want 4.5 year old rams getting whacked then change it to 7/8 curl instead of 3/4 curl.
Wyoming’s wilderness guide rule is stupid and needs to be eliminated regardless of unlimited sheep hunts.
Don’t hunt the 300’s if you want solitude on an unlimited sheep hunt.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Politely, still a couple potential problems...there are 8-9+ year old rams in WY that would never be legal under 7/8 including the 9.5 year old ram I killed.
I don't see the Wilderness guide law changing or an unlimited sheep hunt here either.
Can't hunt 301 unlimited anymore so that problem is solved.
Hunt quality would always be a concern in Wyoming and people waiting 20-25 years to hunt what would turn into unlimited area (likely unit 1) probably wouldn't be easily convinced.
IMO, your efforts are better spent keeping them in Montana rather than trying to expand them in States that don't want them.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Solution for the wilderness guide law?
Probably be smart to get the horse in front of the cart...again, my opinion.
Another thing to consider is that WY's sheep populations in units 1-5 have been on a steady decline for 10 years or more...since I started applying in 1999 tags have been cut nearly in half statewide.
That's going to be a pretty big hurdle to jump in an unlimited push...
Probably be smart to get the horse in front of the cart...again, my opinion.
Another thing to consider is that WY's sheep populations in units 1-5 have been on a steady decline for 10 years or more...since I started applying in 1999 tags have been cut nearly in half statewide.
That's going to be a pretty big hurdle to jump in an unlimited push...
BigHornRam
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I agree that carving out an unlimited area adjacent to the park would be a hard to no sell. What about marginal high elevation, early migration areas in in the winds? Any potential there?
Labman
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That’s what MT should have in place now in the unlimited sheep units.
BuzzH
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That may be a possibility, but IME, the best hunting for sheep would be on the Reservation side of the winds...and I don't think they would be open to the idea at all.
I didn't see many sheep when I worked the remote sections of the Winds on the Reservation side, but the ones I saw were pretty awesome rams (old, heavy, and broomed). Saw about 90% of them from the air in a helicopter.
No doubt that country is where it would make sense. Very few trails and a longggg way in there. The elk hunting would be something special as well, saw some really nice bulls in there working. The fishing in there would be world class as well...some of the best remote country I've ever worked or spent time in the lower 48. Unbelievably beautiful and I got paid to work there...in September.
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