Dubya fires his Scientists.....

[cjcj]

Buzz you missed one non-liar "Ross Perot", I have voted in every election since i was 18, The press "killed" Perot because he talked kinda funny and was short and unattractive, but he still got a whopping 20 million votes!I find myself voting more to keep one out than to get the other in, it`s a good old boy network thru and thru, time for "strong" multiple parties to rise up. i want a president who will stand up and do the right thing for the U.S.A. and not play this politically correct horseshit!

 

[280]

I am sure most recipients of buzz`s letters were shaking in their boots. NOT,,most,,,make that all I am sure don`t give a rats ass what buzz thinks

 

[BuzzH]

Hey 280, its not about threats, its about influence, in particular influence through numbers...

Your ignorant ass wouldnt have even a clue where to begin in dealing with complicated issues...now run along junior, your lego's are lonely.

 

[BHR]

Buzz,

I'm sure you letter writing and propoganda campaign has swayed a lot of public opinion. You, IT, and Gunner sound just like the green party candidate in the California recall election. How much support did he get, even in California? His whining didn't play very well with people looking for solutions, did it?

Bush has made some mistakes, but I believe he has yet to lie. Buzz, you said this in a previous post:

"Wolves have been working on the same elk population since 93...in 94 the doomsdayers were already predicting an end to elk hunting by 2000, or sooner, or at least greatly reduced opportunity."

Was this a lie by you or a mistake?

You claim to be an honest person that does not lie and has no personal agenda. Here's a chance to let everyone know where you are coming from.

If you were in charge, and had the ability to breech all the dams in the Columbia River system that restricted, or halted the migration of salmon, would YOU breech them all? Give an honest answer Buzz. No BS, no Ithacan spin. I will assume that a non answer will mean that you would indeed breech them all. Looking forward to your answer.

Paul

 

[280]

"influence through numbers"??????????
it appears you are an army of one,,,,thats likes to pat himself on the back,,,and thump his own chest,,,while everyone else thinks you are an aggogant ass

 

[BuzzH]

Paul, come on I need a challenge...

I absolutely would NOT breach all the dams on the Columbia River system.

I would breach the 4 on the Snake. The reason for that is quite obvious. From the PATH report, compiled by fisheries biologists from the tribes, Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana, USFWS, etc. (around 200 in all), they believe that breeching the 4 Snake dams would keep wild salmon and steelhead off the list and keep stocks viable forever. The result would be a net gain all the way around. It would save tax payers an enormous amount of money. It would halt all the ES listing processes and the money and time it takes to do that.It would halt the most highly subsidized grain transportation system in the Columbia basin saving taxpayers...(FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY, right Paul?) It would greatly improve the defunct economies in small towns like Riggins, Orifino, etc. Thats already evident by the crying the Kamiah mayor and town officials did to get the Idaho Game and fish to open the upper river this last year (despite low salmon numbers). They felt the money that salmon bring and they want more! I cant blame them!

I'm inclined to listen to experts, not wood butchers from TFalls, BPA hacks, or the fearless leader in the whitehouse who more than likely wouldnt know a coho from a chum, much less what it would take to keep them off the list.

The solution is so easy its pathetic.

Paul, on the wolf issue...

There were wolves in Montana prior to the reintroduction...ever heard of the Ninemile Valley west of Missoula? The North Fork also had a pack prior to reintroduction.

I sat in on monthly district meetings while I was working for the Ninemile District and listened to many "concerned" citizens (some who even worked for the district) in the ninemile valley whining (in 1989-1990) that their kids, pets, and "their" elk and deer were going to be wiped out by wolves. Fact Paul, end of story...

What part of that is a lie?

Oh, and Bush hasnt lied? You have to be joking!

One more thing...the letter writing not swaying public opinion or making a difference...you dont think it works eh?

Sure it doesnt, ask anyone thats ever proposed a timber sale if a few letters dont "sway" things. The power of the pen is incredible.

I wonder why the wolves were reintroduced so quickly and easily...couldnt have been because a vast majority of WRITTEN comments were in favor of it...no, couldnt have been.

I doubt FNAWS or its members write letters either do they Paul?

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 11-12-2003 08:54: Message edited by: BuzzH ]</font>

 

[BHR]

Buzz,

I told you, no Ithacan spin.

Your response was:

"I absolutely would NOT breach all the dams on the Columbia River system."

I did not ask you that. I asked you:

"If you were in charge, and had the ability to breech all the dams in the Columbia River system that restricted, or halted the migration of salmon, would YOU breech them all?"

Big difference. Not all dams in the Columbia system restrict or halt the migration of salmon. Would you breech all the dams that restrict or halt the migration of salmon? Answer it straight this time.

Paul

 

[BuzzH]

Paul, no I would not.

Learn to read, I answered your silly question.

The 4 Snake dams would be history.

 

[BHR]

Buzz,

So if you had your way, and the 4 Snake River Dams were breeched, and for some reason, the salmon numbers on the Snake system did not improve, you would not be in favor of breeching any more dams, correct? How about FT Peck Res? Should it even exist?

Paul

 

[BuzzH]

You're catching on now Paul....

From all the best sources in the U.S., theres universal agreement that the breeching of the 4 Snake dams would keep viable stocks of anadromous fishes from 1. becoming extinct 2. delist all the wild listed runs 3. provide a huge savings to the taxpayer 4. eliminate the looming 350 billion dollar lawsuit that the tribes are going to file and win for treaty violations in regard to anadromous fish.

The real question is why would anyone NOT support the proposal of breeching 4 subsidized dams that are costing the people of the NW their fish and economies?

 

[BHR]

Buzz,

I notice you still did not answer my (2) questions. What's the matter, afraid of your nose growing? Did you ever stop to think that the PATH report might be a piece of shit, put together by a bunch of agenda driven whacko's like you? A lot of other people have. That's why dam breeching aint going to happen. Write all the letters you want, and save all your pennies for the lawyers. Knock yourself out.

Paul

 

[BuzzH]

Paul, I answered your questions, I want the 4 snake dams breeched.

I dont want the main Columbia River dams breeched...pretty simple answer.

Speaking of not answering questions you've done a pretty good job of avoiding them yourself.

The PATH report isnt a "piece of shit" actually quite the opposite, but then you've probably never taken the time to read it have you Paul? Who would the "agenda driven whackos" be? I guess you're smarter than the 200+ fisheries biologists that wrote it? Sure you are.

Maybe you should, how did you say it, "keep your phucking yap shut" until you have the first clue about the issue.

The dams are coming down Paul, count on it. I'll win yet again.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Paul,
Remember, Dam Breaching turned out to be one of the topics that you didn't know anything about, so I thought we agreed you wouldn't be posting anything. I thought you would just read, and get you some education on the topic....

Look what happens if you breach the 4 Lower Snake dams. You remove all of the obstacles clear to Redfish Lake for the Sockeyes. You remove all the obstacles clear to Bear Valley Creek for the Chinook. You remove all the obstacles for Steelhead clear to the Crooked River.

You breach 'em, and you open up 100's and perhaps 1000's of miles of historical fish habitat for reproduction of Wild Salmon and Steelhead in Idaho.