Domestic Livestock in the Bighorn National Forest

[Oak]

Not likely that they increased AUM. What’s more likely is that with drought conditions the area got hammered by the same number of livestock. The nature of the federal grazing program is that managers have to be reactive rather than proactive. Some areas around here got hammered this year because of our drought. But I did get a permittee drought letter from one BLM office a couple of weeks ago indicated that they would likely reduce AUM an average of 50% next year due to the drought conditions.

 

[Forkyfinder]

Not likely that they increased AUM. What’s more likely is that with drought conditions the area got hammered by the same number of livestock.

@birdseye this was what was going on in my experience.

In your emails/letters that you wrote - did you get a response

 

[birdseye]

I don't think that there is anyone with the B.H.N.F. that cares and the stockmen cut the livestock loose at any # they prefer and remove them when they feel like it. No responsible public land agency would allow this and look the other way with all the cows and sheep ravaging the riparian areas...but guess that the B.H.N.F. authorities are both allowing this and looking away.

If anyone doubts what I've written, drive through the North Tongue Valley, Hunt Mountain Rd, Etc. and see for yourself

 

[Forkyfinder]

I don't think that there is anyone with the B.H.N.F. that cares and the stockmen cut the livestock loose at any # they prefer and remove them when they feel like it. No responsible public land agency would allow this and look the other way with all the cows and sheep ravaging the riparian areas...but guess that the B.H.N.F. authorities are both allowing this and looking away.

If anyone doubts what I've written, drive through the North Tongue Valley, Hunt Mountain Rd, Etc. and see for yourself

Pics?

 

[Bonasababy]

The Ashland district of the Custer has been cut 10,000 Aum's in the last thirty years. I can not imagine an increase in the Big Horns.

But...who is left to police the numbers?

 

[COEngineer]

I think ranchers and farmers should go on strike. And truck drivers that pull diesel transports. They should go on strike too.

They will be replaced by AI bots soon enough.

 

[antlerradar]

But...who is left to police the numbers?

Not one person in range was cut at the Ashland district of the Custer. Assuming that all ranchers are cheating is the same as a rancher assuming that all hunters are trespassing poachers.

 

[BearLakeHunter]

Some like to label ranchers/grazers as uncooperative individuals who don’t care for the range land. This is far from the truth for 99% of all ranchers. They are not short sighted enough to graze parcels down to nothing because of the ramifications that has on the future condition of the range. If the range is to stay healthy and be used again and again in the future they have a responsibility to use good range management practices. They need a healthy range every year. They aren’t in it to damage the range because one year of mistreatment takes several years to recover. It’s just not what they do.

 

[SAJ-99]

for 99% of all ranchers.

I must have some innate ability to find that 1%. LOL
In all seriousness, I think the problem is more because drought means less grass, so the same lease results in the appearance of more grazing. I would love to hear recent examples of Fed employees telling ranchers to pull their livestock. I'm sure it happens, but probably not as much as it should.
The good news is that cattle numbers are at multi-decade lows. The bad news is that beef prices are near all-time highs which will eventually mean more cattle. This problem isn't going away.

 

[antlerradar]

I must have some innate ability to find that 1%. LOL
In all seriousness, I think the problem is more because drought means less grass, so the same lease results in the appearance of more grazing. I would love to hear recent examples of Fed employees telling ranchers to pull their livestock. I'm sure it happens, but probably not as much as it should.
The good news is that cattle numbers are at multi-decade lows. The bad news is that beef prices are near all-time highs which will eventually mean more cattle. This problem isn't going away.

2021 drought on the Custer, Most permits took a cut in numbers and time that equaled roughly 40%.

I am not sure numbers are going to increase that fast, especially in the west. Too many ranches have been sold and those new owners often are not interested in dealing with cattle. Even more likely that they will not put up with the requirements of a public land permit.

 

[Forkyfinder]

Even more likely that they will not put up with the requirements of a public land permit.

Whats the big lift here? When i glanced at the paperwork - it doesnt seem like much.

It surely isnt the oversight or management of the lease.

 

[SAJ-99]

Most permits took a cut in numbers and time that equaled roughly 40%.

I think the question is how tightly are the permit cuts are enforced? I couldn't even make a guess and it probably varies by office.

Visuals can show the clear impact of grazing. Here is one below. This section is private land, but the right links to the "winter" range and the left links to BLM (which was grazed to the ground). The main herd (all cow/calf pairs) is kept on the bottom for the summer. The top was only bulls. The on-the-ground difference is much more obvious than the picture. Grass was knee-high and plentiful on one side, even though it was a dry year (aren't they all at this point?). The elk know it too. They jumped the fence to get to "greener pastures" every day. Again highlighting the problem of elk being on areas of private land owners don't want them. It's a viscous cycle, but one that keeps conversation moving on HT.

I am not sure numbers are going to increase that fast, especially in the west. Too many ranches have been sold and those new owners often are not interested in dealing with cattle. Even more likely that they will not put up with the requirements of a public land permit.

That's a good point. Your guess is much better than mine. I only know that typically high prices fixes high prices.

 

[antlerradar]

Whats the big lift here? When i glanced at the paperwork - it doesnt seem like much.

It surely isnt the oversight or management of the lease.

Been my experience that the wealthy are not real fond of compiling with Gov. regulations like NEPA.

 

[antlerradar]

I think the question is how tightly are the permit cuts are enforced? I couldn't even make a guess and it probably varies by office.

Visuals can show the clear impact of grazing. Here is one below. This section is private land, but the right links to the "winter" range and the left links to BLM (which was grazed to the ground). The main herd (all cow/calf pairs) is kept on the bottom for the summer. The top was only bulls. The on-the-ground difference is much more obvious than the picture. Grass was knee-high and plentiful on one side, even though it was a dry year (aren't they all at this point?). The elk know it too. They jumped the fence to get to "greener pastures" every day. Again highlighting the problem of elk being on areas of private land owners don't want them. It's a viscous cycle, but one that keeps conversation moving on HT.

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That's a good point. Your guess is much better than mine. I only know that typically high prices fixes high prices.

I have no knowledge of the picture you posted, But visuals can be misleading as to condition. Proximity to water, Natural or forced cattle movement and a host of other things can bias a visual. Much better to base judgement on the species composition.

 

[SAJ-99]

I have no knowledge of the picture you posted, But visuals can be misleading as to condition. Proximity to water, Natural or forced cattle movement and a host of other things can bias a visual. Much better to base judgement on the species composition.

Not in this case. The visuals,
along with elk trying to get to the darker side, told a pretty clear message. It is hard to gauge difference in species composition when all the grass on one side of the fence is grazed to the crown.

 

[Bighorner]

I would whole heartedly agree that most of the ag operators do care about the land.

They also have a sweet heart deal on with federal leases. If one piece of ground is going to the brunt of grazing it will always be the leased ground before it is the deeded. Pretty much anyone with business sense would do the same. They are not raising beef for recreation two weeks a year.

 

[birdseye]

drought stunted forage, cows still on public land pasture and resorting to eating up vegetation in riparian areas, tearing up banks and defecating everywhere with no apparent oversight. The habitat is stomped down to oblivion, cows using the actual streambeds as trails. Don't believe me? Take a ride along Hwy 14A through the Forest, don't forget a detour on Hunt Mtn Road over to Hwy 14. Some here don't see the issue so see for yourselfr. This year is not an exception, the overgrazing situation is now a yearly event in the BHNF. Yes, authorities are notified, several times each summer. Zero action

 

[mevertsen]

Unfortunately, livestock production pre-dates sport hunting and wildlife conservation.

You are not going to get much action on it, in a state that is was built on livestock production and is still a major contributor to the economy, far surpassing sport hunting and recreational pursuits.

That's the west.

Good luck on getting anywhere, but it truly is a lost cause.

 

[Forkyfinder]

If one piece of ground is going to the brunt of grazing it will always be the leased ground before it is the deeded. Pretty much anyone with business sense would do the same.

This is the exact reality.

Easy choice.

 

[BearLakeHunter]

I must have some innate ability to find that 1%. LOL
In all seriousness, I think the problem is more because drought means less grass, so the same lease results in the appearance of more grazing. I would love to hear recent examples of Fed employees telling ranchers to pull their livestock. I'm sure it happens, but probably not as much as it should.
The good news is that cattle numbers are at multi-decade lows. The bad news is that beef prices are near all-time highs which will eventually mean more cattle. This problem isn't going away.

I can give you an example. This year the BLM here in Southwest Wyoming made us pull cattle nearly a month early due to the drought conditions and lack of water. None of us argued it because it was a necessary move that needed to be made for the sake of the feed/land. It was the responsible thing that had to be done.