UPOM as an Anti-Hunting, Anti-Fishing Organization

lifeisgoodsteve

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Feb 2, 2019
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Bitterroot Valley
How funny would it be for the FWP to say “OK, we will manage for objective by sending our hired marksmen in to cull the cows on your land and drive them from your property”.

Worth imagining if only to give myself a laugh and not be so darn disheartened by such blatant abuse.

Donors hold the political power.

It’s a steep hill to climb but I hope at some point a hunting conservation group can find a way to really step up, raise serious funds, mobilize ordinary folks, build strong relationships with politicians and move the needle.

Hoping this doesn’t remain a dream only…
 

Ben Lamb

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Cedar, MI
Would it be possible to file a suit against the department to force them to enact cow only seasons? If UPOM wants to hold them accountable for managing within objectives then here you go fellas. I’m no fan of lawsuits but it feels like sportsmen are going to get run over on this deal yet again. I don’t like the thought of any lawsuit driving hunting regulations so perhaps that’d be a bad precedent. That being said I’d be willing to chip in for attorney fees.

Someone could countersue the agency for not following their own ARM rules or following the EMP. That case would actually have more merit than the UPOM tearjerker.

I'd also look for bills to eliminate the statutory requirement for allowing access in order to receive damage assistance (MCA 87-1-225) among others.
 

BuzzH

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Laramie, WY
Montana is a disaster politically.

I say force the fwp to simply not count harbored elk in the objective numbers.

Either that or force them to slaughter elk from the air with government hunters. Make sure to have all kinds of media coverage.

Show the idiots in Montana that elections have consequences.
 

Ben Lamb

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17,440
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Cedar, MI
It’s a steep hill to climb but I hope at some point a hunting conservation group can find a way to really step up, raise serious funds, mobilize ordinary folks, build strong relationships with politicians and move the needle.

Hoping this doesn’t remain a dream only…

MTELK.org

These folks are doing that. They were the people behind the big push on the season setting work, they've been building bridges since January & they're working their tails off to make good things happen.
 

Ben Lamb

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Cedar, MI
Montana is a disaster politically.

I say force the fwp to simply not count harbored elk in the objective numbers.

Either that or force them to slaughter elk from the air with government hunters. Make sure to have all kinds of media coverage.

Show the idiots in Montana that elections have consequences.

The funny thing is, if we had an AG that stood up for the actual rule of law, that's probably what would happen. A judge would look at the laws, the rules and the EMP and simply say: The remedy exists - cow only & don't count inaccessible animals.

Unfortunately, this is likely to receive a tepid response from the AG who will try to tell the state that there's no option but to do this, because they wouldn't win a trail. Which is horsepuckey. It's a tactic that people use to simply capitulate rather than actually do their jobs on issues they agree with the plaintiff on.
 

lifeisgoodsteve

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Messages
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Bitterroot Valley
MTELK.org

These folks are doing that. They were the people behind the big push on the season setting work, they've been building bridges since January & they're working their tails off to make good things happen.
Thanks for letting me know. I believe that’s the new group I donated $100 but haven’t heard a word from in regards to what they’re doing or not.

I had been wondering. There’s so much work that goes into climbing that steep hill, so I don’t hold it against them when so young an org, but might suggest some outreach to donors with updates.

Thanks

S
 

Nameless Range

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Western Montana
At this point, I am not sure what a pissed off citizen should do. Wait and see how this plays out?

Edit: Just saw the last few posts. Sending another donation to mtelk.org
 

Ben Lamb

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Cedar, MI
Thanks for letting me know. I believe that’s the new group I donated $100 but haven’t heard a word from in regards to what they’re doing or not.

I had been wondering. There’s so much work that goes into climbing that steep hill, so I don’t hold it against them when so young an org, but might suggest some outreach to donors with updates.

Thanks

S

Agreed. Updates are forthcoming, they've been burning the candle at both ends. Check your PM
 

4ohSick

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Aug 28, 2020
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219
Location
Helena, MT
Would it be possible to file a suit against the department to force them to enact cow only seasons? If UPOM wants to hold them accountable for managing within objectives then here you go fellas. I’m no fan of lawsuits but it feels like sportsmen are going to get run over on this deal yet again. I don’t like the thought of any lawsuit driving hunting regulations so perhaps that’d be a bad precedent. That being said I’d be willing to chip in for attorney fees.
The only issue would be what organization would carry the suit? I doubt any single citizen would want to... Maybe MWF or Montana BHA? The GoFundMe in Wyoming seems like we could raise the funds for a fight if we had a willing organization to carry the flag.
 

Beignet

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Feb 27, 2021
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Montaña
The only issue would be what organization would carry the suit? I doubt any single citizen would want to... Maybe MWF or Montana BHA? The GoFundMe in Wyoming seems like we could raise the funds for a fight if we had a willing organization to carry the flag.
Maybe add in a voice from this year’s permit holders in over objective units?
 

Ben Lamb

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17,440
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Cedar, MI
Justin Schaaf, President, Keep it Public, on behalf of the Montana Citizen's Elk Management Coalition:

The lawsuit filed by United Property Owners of Montana, if successful, eliminates the cherished Montana tradition of equal opportunity to our public wildlife. Also, it hamstrings scientific management of wildlife by Fish, Wildlife & Parks and institutes a system where only a few privileged hunters have the chance to encounter bull elk. The remaining unwashed hunting public is then tasked with actual population management, killing tens of thousands of cow elk annually on behalf of a few vocal landowners. Some of these landowners aren't even Montana residents.

UPOM knows that Montanans, Fish, Wildlife & Parks, and the Fish and Wildlife Commission are currently developing a new Elk Management Plan that aims to balance elk populations with hunting access and landowner tolerance. This preemptive legal action indicates that UPOM doesn't trust the public or our agencies to do the job. This lawsuit is especially puzzling after UPOM told Montanans to sit back and let FWP do its job. That remains excellent advice.
 

mtmuley

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Jan 11, 2009
Messages
10,436
Location
montana
How funny would it be for the FWP to say “OK, we will manage for objective by sending our hired marksmen in to cull the cows on your land and drive them from your property”.

Worth imagining if only to give myself a laugh and not be so darn disheartened by such blatant abuse.

Donors hold the political power.

It’s a steep hill to climb but I hope at some point a hunting conservation group can find a way to really step up, raise serious funds, mobilize ordinary folks, build strong relationships with politicians and move the needle.

Hoping this doesn’t remain a dream only…
Back in the old days there were people, hired by FWP I believe that drove elk off of private property. By herding, not killing. Used to be a sign on a piece if private here naming the guy that was doing it. It might still be there. I'll look tomorrow. mtmuley
 

Nameless Range

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Jun 6, 2013
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4,564
Location
Western Montana
Has anyone seen any take on this from the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation?

I have not asked them and will, but wondered if there was any sort of comment or press releases or social media I was missing.

It’s hard for me to imagine a more radical scenario that runs against their mission statement.

Ensure the future of elk, other wildlife, their habitat and our hunting heritage.

Our hunting heritage is the exact thing on the chopping block
 

brocksw

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Jan 5, 2018
Messages
855
Has anyone seen any take on this from the Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation?

I have not asked them and will, but wondered if there was any sort of comment or press releases or social media I was missing.

It’s hard for me to imagine a more radical scenario that runs against their mission statement.

Ensure the future of elk, other wildlife, their habitat and our hunting heritage.

Our hunting heritage is the exact thing on the chopping block
I'd be surprised since they've been pretty silent on all of these MT issues up to this point. Their facebook posts would lead one to believe that wolves and griz are a bigger threat to elk hunting than UPOM's proposal to slaughter 50k animals as soon as possible.
 
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