SIG BDX system question

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
I wanted a range finder with an inclinometer. My old luepold is still working fine out to 400 yards though. Thought I would look for some good modern features without breaking the bank. Anyway, I ended up with a Sig Sauer KILO1800. I bought an open box for like half the price even though the box had never been opened. I really didn't need a scope as the one I have on the rifle has not ever failed me for the last 15 years. I downloaded the BDX app to my phone so I could configure the Kilo and was impressed with what the system can actually do. Anyway, I ended up getting a sierra3bdx scope for a good price that was a blemished item, even though the box with a small corner tear had never been opened. I have figured everything out except the windage. The configuration choice is symmetrical or directional windage. I guess I could call customer service but I would like to hear from a user of the system if possible. Thanks in advance!
 

ZBB

Active member
Joined
Nov 30, 2016
Messages
228
Location
Pueblo, Co
Page 19, I would assume this information would’ve came with your scope but I could be wrong. The way I read that is the symmetrical gives you several different wind holds for what I would assume is different angles that the wind is blowing, full value vs half or something along those lines. And the way I read the directional is it gives you one wind reading, so you’d have to figure out the direction and value on your own? I’m curious if all the dots show up in the scope or if you pick which one you will use on your phone and it sends it to the scope? I don’t have one of the scopes, this is just how I read it. Probably going to be some trial and error on your part I would think. Good luck to you.
Zach
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
Thank you Zach

The manual reads that symmetrical is for: "varying wind conditions". -G- 🤔

The wind speed and direction is gathered by the bdx phone app and then synced to the LRF. The LRF then sends the wind hold data (once the target is lit up) to the scope. My phone has the wind data grayed out so I can't put the wind data in manually. I don't know how the bdx phone app gathers the wind data at this point.
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
I have an old phone (samsung note3) that I use as a GPS for OnX maps which no longer has cell service. I connect it to wireless internet and load it up with the offline maps that I will use during the hunting trip. I have also loaded the BDX app and the Hornady ballistics app in case I need to go manual on the scope. This old phone works well to configure BDX and sync the ballistic data. The BDX app takes environmental data from the phone (or tablet) that is connected to the internet. The BDX app sends the environmental and ballistic data (via bluetooth) to the LRF (KILO). The LRF crunches the enviro, ballistic and ranging data once the target is lit up. The LRF then sends the elevation and windage hold data to the scope (sierra3). The reason why I could not get enviro data was because the GPS on the phone couldn't get the satellites with me sitting in the living room....Doh! 😀

Symmetrical wind holds still remain somewhat of a mystery and I will be contacting customer support on Monday. I suppose it does make sense given the scenario that if you chase a bull over a ridge; the wind data will change (as well as the other enviro data) with a different shot and target location. I would think that Sig would have given the KILO LRF the capability to accept enviro data from a hand held unit like the Kestrel. There is no wireless internet in the majority of places I hunt and that enviro data isn't accurate enough to rely on for windage, elevation holds anyway. I suppose I could get a cheap handheld unit and input the enviro data manually. However, that is just another layer of complexity and hardware, as well as the time spent to make the shot. I could just do what I've done all of these years...throw up a handful of grass and dirt then send the round. However, that isn't what I paid for.
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
The "idea" is to load the ballistic profile and the enviro data into the LRF beforehand. Then when you are hunting and the game comes along, it is only a matter of clicking the LRF, lining up the hold dots on the scope, and sending the round. The problem I have with the system is to get local, real time enviro data into the LRF. I bought the system to make an ethical and more confident shot on game at the usual ranges with the rifle I have the personal skills for.
.
 

redwoood

Active member
Joined
Jan 20, 2014
Messages
284
Location
Kirksville, MO
I have an old phone (samsung note3) that I use as a GPS for OnX maps which no longer has cell service. I connect it to wireless internet and load it up with the offline maps that I will use during the hunting trip. I have also loaded the BDX app and the Hornady ballistics app in case I need to go manual on the scope. This old phone works well to configure BDX and sync the ballistic data. The BDX app takes environmental data from the phone (or tablet) that is connected to the internet. The BDX app sends the environmental and ballistic data (via bluetooth) to the LRF (KILO). The LRF crunches the enviro, ballistic and ranging data once the target is lit up. The LRF then sends the elevation and windage hold data to the scope (sierra3). The reason why I could not get enviro data was because the GPS on the phone couldn't get the satellites with me sitting in the living room....Doh! 😀

Symmetrical wind holds still remain somewhat of a mystery and I will be contacting customer support on Monday. I suppose it does make sense given the scenario that if you chase a bull over a ridge; the wind data will change (as well as the other enviro data) with a different shot and target location. I would think that Sig would have given the KILO LRF the capability to accept enviro data from a hand held unit like the Kestrel. There is no wireless internet in the majority of places I hunt and that enviro data isn't accurate enough to rely on for windage, elevation holds anyway. I suppose I could get a cheap handheld unit and input the enviro data manually. However, that is just another layer of complexity and hardware, as well as the time spent to make the shot. I could just do what I've done all of these years...throw up a handful of grass and dirt then send the round. However, that isn't what I paid for.

I have the sig2400abs...I use it for my holdover and judge the wind and consult my cheat sheet.

I don't feel that anything is fool proof when it comes to wind.
 

mtmuley

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 11, 2009
Messages
4,965
Location
montana
The "idea" is to load the ballistic profile and the enviro data into the LRF beforehand. Then when you are hunting and the game comes along, it is only a matter of clicking the LRF, lining up the hold dots on the scope, and sending the round. The problem I have with the system is to get local, real time enviro data into the LRF. I bought the system to make an ethical and more confident shot on game at the usual ranges with the rifle I have the personal skills for.
.
Good luck. I'll stay with the old fashioned system. mtmuley
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
Supposedly, the KILO2400abs LRF will only pair with either the Kestrel 5700 elite or the Garmin 5701. That's another $600 or so to plop down on the system. I have the KILO1800 LRF which does not have the "engine" to pair with an external device which is fine by me. I will probably just get a cheap handheld wind meter that I will only use if there is a stiff cross wind.
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
I am starting to feel like an idiot for buying the Sig Sierra3BDX scope. The BDX system is a pile of crap IMHO! The system is supposed to supply windage and elevation hold dots to the scope's reticle. The accuracy of the data is just "smoke and mirrors". The elevation hold is so, so and will only be ball park. The windage hold is totally bogus. The only way to get atmospheric data into the system is one by one hand entry into the BDX app on the cell phone. I told the customer service rep that you people are living in a dream if you think a hunter can use atmospheric data from the internet. Obviously, the only viable enviro data (like wind speed and direction) must be sensed where you are taking the shot. Sig touts the BDX system as having a "hard" limit of 800 yards. If a hunter wants to take shots on game beyond 800 yards then one must purchase the KILO2400abs and either the Kestrel or the Garmin. Then the hard limit is 5000 yards. Are we laughing yet? I seriously doubt that the BDX system was designed by hunters for hunting.

I found out that Applied Ballistics Solutions is the company that designed the ballistic engines in the Sig LRFs and they also designed the Sig BDX app for the phone. Their own ballistic app caters to the competitive precision shooters crowd. Now every ballistic app worth a hoot allows sensed data from either the Kestrel or the Weather flow devices and that includes the ABS app. Apparently, ABS turned off the kestrel and the Weatherflow meters in Sig's BDX app. I would be happy just to get an idea of what the wind speed, wind direction is. Cross wind on the target would be good to know. Which lead me to investigate that little Weatherflow gadget. I bought one for the paltry sum of $85 bucks. Simple, bomb proof, it is waterproof and has an otter like soft rubber case. No menus or screens to navigate. Just push the on button, hold the unit into the wind and it starts dumping atmospheric data into your favorite ballistics app! I am looking at the Strelok Pro ballistics app and so far I like what I see. The app supports the building of yardage and windage holds on reticles from most brands and models of scopes. It is then just a matter of lasing the target, clicking the turrets or moving the scope to approximate the windage, elevation holds, send the round. The Strelok Pro app is a one time download fee of $15 so $100 will buy the entire solution. The Brits have figured it out so I have included a link to their club's video. Note that the Weatherflow they use is blue which is an earlier model before they came out with the desert tan field version:
 

ZBB

Active member
Joined
Nov 30, 2016
Messages
228
Location
Pueblo, Co
GWOT, hunting is just getting the trickle down. I think that video you liked would be a good training aid for wind and holding. But I can’t think of anything more impractical to use for hunting unless you were on a mega ranch with a ton of weather stations around. But at that point why even call it hunting.
 

redwoood

Active member
Joined
Jan 20, 2014
Messages
284
Location
Kirksville, MO
Supposedly, the KILO2400abs LRF will only pair with either the Kestrel 5700 elite or the Garmin 5701. That's another $600 or so to plop down on the system. I have the KILO1800 LRF which does not have the "engine" to pair with an external device which is fine by me. I will probably just get a cheap handheld wind meter that I will only use if there is a stiff cross wind.
The sig 2400abs pairs with your smart phone and comes with a wind meter that plugs into your smart phone.

So far it has been dead on but I've yet to travel to another elevation and test it shooting up or down slope.
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
I apologize for the typo. I meant the Kilo2400bdx LRF. The Weatherflow WeatherMeter that came with your kilo is the same one I bought on amazon. My beef with Sig is that they shut off the WeatherMeter interface to the BDX app. The sole reason they did that was to force a person to get a kilo2400bdx and either a Kestrel or a Garmin unit to make the BDX system function as the way they sold it. Without a way to input the enviro data with the other kilo bdx models, the windage and elevation holds sent to the Sierra3 scope are garbage. Because garbage in equals garbage out. The only difference in capability between the Strelok Pro Solution and the Kilo2400abs is that you need to manually input the range and angle into Strelok Pro.

There are some advantages to using Strelok Pro but I will just stay on topic with BDX. I think the Kilo LRF is a good value and I like mine. The Sierra3BDX is ok but nothing like the quality or function of the Leupold scope that it replaced. My tale of woe with the BDX system is the system data that is exchanged or maybe better said: The lack of it!
 

Gila

Active member
Joined
Jun 8, 2019
Messages
273
Location
New Mexico
That lousy Sierra3 scope is SO GONE! A smile on my face the whole time I was removing it from the rifle!

After calling customer service about the data accuracy debacle and getting nowhere; I tried to just give it a go on manual. I sighted in at 100 yards with the bore laser or attempted to. There is not much range on the elevation turret. In fact if you want to dial in at longer ranges forget it. To return to zero on the turrets, one must remove the caps, loosen a tiny allen screw, then move the dial to zero, and retighten the allen screw. The allen screws are very small and will most likely shoot loose eventually. That small of a screw will probably strip out after being tightened several times anyway. The intensity knob and the parallax knob on the inside are very sharp and difficult to turn. To turn the intensity on or off the knob must travel to the end stop. My fingers were somewhat raw after doing that several times. Moving to the sight picture: On a sunny afternoon the hold over dots were hard to see on the highest intensity. The anti-cant feature is too sensitive at longer ranges and makes it virtually impossible to level. The result is rather large lights on the left and right of the sight picture flashing all of the time. The reticle is a standard duplex but it is very wide. The cross hairs (not) are so wide I couldn't even center on a prairie dog at 500 yards. The entire lower half of the sight picture has aberration lines all the way across which are as wide as the distance between the hold over dots. After looking through the scope for awhile my eyes hurt.

I tried to find something positive about the scope but I just couldn't. Even the logos don't look good! As far as I'm concerned the design is in the dumpster and the quality is not far behind. My intention was not to review the scope but rather to have some justification to keep it which I didn't find. I took a chance in buying it because it is quite new and there are not many out there to be reviewed. One disadvantage to living in the "outback" is 2-3 hours travel to get to a store to look at a scope. The stores don't carry very many models because they expect people to buy on-line. To end this on a positive note, I am learning about the new features to be had in quality riflescopes. That's all I have to say about that.....
 
Top